So...Valeros confronts a ghost of some sort. It says "must have magic for your check" or ghost is undefeated. I assumed that my +1 sword with magic trait would count for this check. I read on another site that this does not count!? So I am wrong again?!? So many little quirks!!!! Lol
Your check gains the traits of the card you play to Determine Which Skill You're Using (where Valeros plays his +1 sword that has the Magic trait).
But it doesn't gain traits from cards played during "Play Cards and Use Powers that Effect the Check (where someone might play a spell to help your check).
So yes, that counts.
The check also gets traits if a power says it gets a trait (i.e. add 1d4 and the Fire Trait).
Awesome, thanks! I found the post, the person said they used the luckstone card for magic trait but the follow-up posts said it doesn't count.?!?
A luckstone isn't used for "Determine Which Skill You're Using" (because it only modifies a check, it isn't used as a skill check replacement which the sword does). A Luckstone is played during the "Play Cards and Use Powers that Affect the Check" step.
A Luckstone is very different from a Sword in that regard. Just like Aid is very different from Force Missile in that regard.
Ok....thanks! I think I am still confused. Lol
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Lemme see if I can explain better: During a check, you cannot play cards or use powers unless it relates to the step of the check you are in. Each step of the check has some special rules attached to it that impact or restrict cards played and powers used during them. So, let's go through all of those steps in order:
1. Determine Which Skill You're Using
Before you do anything else, you need to figure out just what kind of check this is. Is it a Strength check, or maybe it's an Acrobatics check? That's the point of this step. If the card making you perform the check has multiple choices, you get to pick one of them. Other times, there is only one choice, such as Combat.
After you make your choice, you may then play one card or use one power that further defines what type of check it is. You do not have to play a card or use a power here, but you can if you want. The only cards or powers you're allowed to use during this step are ones that further define the skill you are using for the check. In general, these powers take the form of "For your <x> check, use your <y> skill." Let's take a look at some examples of this:
- The weapon Longsword says "For your combat check, reveal this card to use your Strength or Melee skill + 1d8; you may additionally discard this card to add another 1d6."
- Wrath of the Righteous Kyra says "For your check to defeat a bane that has the Demon or Undead trait, you may recharge a spell to use your Divine skill + 1d8 and add the Attack, Divine, and Magic traits."
If you play a card with such an ability during this step, all of its traits get added to the check. For example, if it was a Combat check, we can play Longsword and choose our Melee skill. Let's say we have Melee: Strength +2, and a Strength of d10. We would then have a base roll of 1d10 + 1d8 + 2. Furthermore, the check would have the following traits: Melee, Strength, Sword, Slashing, and Basic. Note that both the traits on the card as well as the skill you are using (and all skills referenced by that skill) are added as traits to the check.
Let's look at another example, say Kyra is fighting Shamira, a henchman with the Demon trait. Shamira has a check to defeat of Combat 40 or Charisma Diplomacy 16. Kyra determines she wants to attempt the Charisma 16 check, and then uses her power to use her Divine skill instead of her Charisma. The check then has the Divine, Wisdom, Attack, and Magic traits. The Charisma skill was replaced with Divine, so Charisma is not added as a trait on the check. Since Kyra was using her Divine skill and she has Divine: Wisdom +2, Wisdom gets added as a trait to the check as well. Assuming she has 3 Wisdom skill feats, she would then roll a baseline of 1d12 + 1d8 + 5.
Recap: The only cards or powers you can use here are ones that determine the skill you are using. These are worded like "For your <x> check, use your <y> skill." All traits on any such card you play like that are added to the check. You can only play one card or use one power this way.
2. Determine the Difficulty
Here is where you apply any powers that modify the difficulty of the check. For example, the card may say "The difficulty to defeat this bane is increased by the adventure deck number of the current scenario, if any." You can also play cards or use powers that modify the difficulty of the check.
3. Play Cards and Use Powers That Affect Your Check (Optional)
This is where most cards get played. You've already determined what skill you're using and how hard the check is -- all of that is set in stone at this point. Here is where you get to play other cards that enhance your check (or for your friends to play cards to assist you). Any cards played here do not add their traits to the check. This is when Luckstone would get played. Cards and powers may only be used during this step if they actually relate to the check in question. For example, you cannot play a Cure here because healing cards has no impact on the roll you are about to make. The stat stones (Topaz of Strength, Emerald of Dexterity, Onyx of Constitution, Pearl of Wisdom, Sapphire of Intelligence, Ruby of Charisma) say that they use one die type instead of another. These do not determine the skill you are using and as such are played during this step of the check. They merely replace one die type with another, you are still using the original skills and the check still has the original traits even though the die you are rolling is different.
4. Assemble Your Dice and 5. Attempt the Roll
Hopefully self-explanatory.
6. Take Damage, If Necessary
If you fail a check to defeat a monster, you take damage equal to what you failed it by. This is combat damage unless the monster specifies otherwise, even if you were not attempting a combat check. If you failed a check to defeat a barrier, even if it is a combat check, you do not take damage unless the barrier itself tells you to.
Hope that helps :)
Thank you Skizzerz!!! That definitely clears it up for me. I wasn't quite seeing the difference at first but I get it. Thank you for your massive explanation.
An addendum to that for Rise of the Runelords: Rise of the Runelords uses slightly different terminology than what I wrote above. The concepts are exactly the same, just the wording is a bit different.
When RotR refers to a "die", it really means "skill" as I wrote above, in other words the die for that skill plus any bonuses (such as skill feats). When RotR refers to an "unmodified die", it just means the die itself, such as the stat stones example I gave. For example, the Longsword in Rise of the Runelords likely reads something like "For your combat check, reveal this card to use your Strength or Melee die + 1d8; you may additionally discard this card to add another 1d6." -- that wording is equivalent to what I wrote in my above post.
This distinction between "die" and "unmodified die" only applies to Rise of the Runelords. In every other product (other sets, class decks), "die" refers simply to the die (e.g. "unmodified die" in RotR parlance), and "skill" is the die plus modifiers.
That's not always the case skizzerz, and is part of the problem with Runelords. Blessings don't say "unmodified", but that's what you use. There is no clear cut "this wording means feats, this doesn't" in Runelord.
Bleh, serves me right for trying to type stuff from memory with referencing the box (which I don't have access to at the moment) :(
Since I started PACG with S&S, I didn't really read through the RotR cards that much, since I knew generally what they were supposed to be doing based on what type of card they were. Still haven't played through the AP yet, but the gap between WotR and MM means I have plenty of time to do just that.
Actually, there is. Though I think the lack of clarity was the problem. The distinction was in the rulebook.
Assemble Your Dice. The skill you’re using and the cards you played determine the number and type of dice you roll. For example, if you’re attempting a check using your Strength skill, and your Strength die is d10, you’ll roll 1d10. If another player played a blessing to add a die to your check, you’ll roll 2d10.
Attempt the Roll. Roll the dice and add up their value, adding or subtracting any modifiers that apply to the check.
So, the reason you get to add your Strength feats when you make a Strength check is because after rolling the dice you add in any modifiers. Even though you may have rolled 10 of your Strength dice, you still only have 1 modifier.
And the the Longbow says "unmodified Strength die" is specifically to prevent you from adding Strength skill feats when you are already going to add Dexterity skill feats.
But the new way is better.