Well, my honest opinion, is that balance is a consideration after flavor. Number tweaks are easy. And giving people more flexibility in their PrC choices is a choice for flavor.
PrCs that add to caster level do increase spells per day, and spells known- the thing they don't do by RAW is allow prepared arcane casters to add any free spells to their spellbook/familiar/whatever. Reversing that shouldn't unbalance anything.
In terms of boosting CL by 'sides' I'm not sure how to answer that because I usually do everything fractionally instead of thinking in terms of sides... If everyone is following the same rules (and everything is hard capped by hit dice) it probably will work out well-enough...
Since everything with DT's PrC stacked with Psi-Warrior for ML purposes, I already gained extra PP and powers known. I made the choices I did with that in mind, so allowing other PrCs to break the rule won't really affect my character at all.
That being said, I'm with Illia.
This would be similar to DT not suffering the 5 levels of 3/4 BAB.
Would he be allowed to change them to full, and have a 25 BAB?
Wait, what do you mean Fnord? Channel hellfire doesn't seem to restrict which spells you can alter, aside from them needing to deal damage.
If you happen to have both divine and arcane spellcasting(normally, not with Gestalt rules) and get into the PrC, I see no reason why you couldn't use channel hellfire on both inflict spells and say a fireball.
PrCs that add +1 level to a caster class are pretty clear as RAW, IMO; and "+1 caster level" is entirely different, usually not granted by PrCs. (The rule about "not increasing" refers to spells in a Wizard's spellbook, which are a negligible cost at this level)
Ok, now you've confused me too TB.
Are you saying most prestige classes don't grant an increase to caster level?
I think we should leave the caster levels as is. This game has enough tweaks to it.
My 2c
Most prestige classes increase the level of casting. This increases caster level, spell slots, and spells known. (Wizards do not RAW get the spells known, nor do alchemists/maguses/investigators/arcanists, but they can pay gold to get spells known). Anything that increases caster level ONLY increases caster level, not spells, and those effects on PrCs are rarer.
There's a significant difference in allowing any PrC to choose which casting class to boost at each level and changing the BAB progression of a PrC.
I don't have a problem with allowing a PrC to boost two casting classes.
I do have an issue with changing the BAB progression of a class. I also believe that characters should still not be able to simultaneously take a PrC on both sides of the gestalt.
This does bring up another issue, one that I've always though made this hoel discussion a moot point. When the PrC changes how spells are treated, does this automatically mean you get to apply it to both classes?
For instance a diabolist's channel hellfire would normally only effect one class's spells, will it now effect bother classes, and the spell slots are then doubled?
It was a joke. It'd only be +2 anyway.
Most prestige classes increase the level of casting. This increases caster level, spell slots, and spells known. (Wizards do not RAW get the spells known, nor do alchemists/maguses/investigators/arcanists, but they can pay gold to get spells known). Anything that increases caster level ONLY increases caster level, not spells, and those effects on PrCs are rarer.
not so with psionics PrC's
Powers Known and Maximum Power Level
At every level indicated, a metamind gains access to newpowers as if he had also gained a level in whatever manifesting class he belonged to before he added the prestige class. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained (bonus feats, metapsionic or item creation feats, and so on). This essentially means that he adds the level of metamind to the level of whatever manifesting class the character has, then determines powers known, manifester level, and maximum power level accordingly. If a character had more than one manifesting class before he became a metamind, he must decide to which class he adds the new level of metamind for the purpose of determining powers known, maximum power level, and manifester level.
So Most PrC levels add to ML, its just clear you have to pick which class they add to.
It would be odd if magic casting PrC don't do the same.
just found this Hugh problem with my build,
Psionic Tattoos
The following rules govern the use of psionic tattoos. A creature must have an appropriate physical surface on which to scribe the pattern (thus, incorporeal creatures or creatures with impermanent flesh, such as fire elementals, cannot use psionic tattoos).
So my Cryptic/psion uncarnate is broken so going back to
Deard - [Nightmare Constructor] as that all fits into her story and background fine. I think it has a nice fit as well.
For background she's old but renews her body. So I'm not 100% on her getting age based stuff.
Err, Sapphire—that's actually the same as what I said (for most psionic PrCs); metamind is an exception. It's also irrelevant, because psions are NOT spellcasters (in the same way that alchemists aren't technically either).
Also... Psionic tattoos are just scrolls. Not a big deal to lose.
Understood,
As for Psionic tattoos there a big part of the Cryptic class, losing them really hurts the class as all there powers are linked to them is some way just about.
I think dread will work ok its more theamic at well and fits in with my idea of her now as this incorporeal psionic being.
Under ABP, you calculate the cost as normal, then remove the cost for the enhancement bonuses alone. After is the final price or cost of creation.
So you'd make a +5 Ghost Touch Brilliant Energy sword, and remove the cost for it being +5, only paying for GT and BE and masterwork cost.
I think...lol
That reminds me...
Since DT stacks with Soulknife for the enhancement bonus...it's +10 a few times over...I stopped the progression at +10, but it's actually +13. Should I cap it at 10, or are they Epic/Mythic now, and can be increased beyond 10?
The way I understood the weapon/armor was you could use the +5 for anything, than if you also wanted an additional non enhancement bonus you used the section af the bottom.
For example, you had a +3 keen flaming Longsword. You wanted to add speed, you would subjract the +3 (possibly the keen and flaming as well) and figure out the cost for speed that way.
As Kryz said, I think that's how it's supposed to work.
Enhancement bonus weapon is limited to 10 I think. But don't you have a power that lets you switch that to AC, That remands me, do the Defending enhancement bonus from weapons just not work if there is a hard cap to AC enhancement bonus of +5.
it looked like psionic tattoos were permanent items not scrolls, they cost 50x in material components, which is the same as when making a permanent spell effect.
Nope! Permanent effects cost 4x that much. Psionic tattoos cost twice as much as ordinary scrolls because they don't need to be drawn from a backpack, and don't require a caster level to use.
just so you all know my PC will not be mind reading any other PC, that is far to close to PvP for my liking.
Re Epic enchantments:
This is what legendary weapon says:
You can select this legendary gift multiple times, and it stacks up to +10 for any one weapon.
Not sure if that +10 is supposed to be on top of the +5 you gain pre-20, or if its the max total, especially considering legendary gifts are gained post 20.
All I know is, pre-Epic, you can't go beyond a total of +10. Post 20 you can, and you can get higher enhancement and weapon special abilities, not to mention you can also bypass DR epic.
legendary weapon says (emphasis mine):
Legendary Weapon: Your enhancement bonus from
weapon attunement increases by 1. If you are attuned to
more than one weapon, you can increase only one weapon’s
enhancement bonus in this way. The enhancement bonus on
a single weapon can’t exceed +5, but you can use the excess
to add magic abilities to weapons (see Magic Weapons and
Armor, below). You can select this legendary gift multiple
times, and it stacks up to +10 for any one weapon.
I think the intention is to say "You get +5 from weapon attunement. The legendary weapon adds to this, +1 per point. It stacks (with weapon attunement) up to +10 on any one weapon, with a maximum of +5 going toward enhancement (bonus to hit and damage)."
I don't think it's beyond the pale for a level 25 soulknife to be able to summon mind blades that are "epic".
He doesn't use the enhancement bonuses from ABP on his mind blades anyway. He gets +8 from soulknife (-1 for taking the nimble Blade archetype), and +5 from the dark tempest PrC, and they stack, but not with the +5 from ABP.
EDIT: Nevermind. While the soulknife can get +13 in bonuses, the class has set the maximum enhancement bonus to +5, so no epic mind blades I guess.
Anyway...any one have an example (with mechanics) of an appropriately powered minor artifact for the signature item?
There are several ways to have an epic weapon... Enchantments that temporarily increase enhancement are the easiest: bane against its target raises a +5 weapon to a +7; a greyflame weapon when activated can go from +5 to +6; a furious weapon during rage can go from +5 to +7...
There were some other ways that may or may not have been errata'd away... a Paladin's divine bond used to not be capped so you could just add enhancement past +5, might not be true anymore... Things like magus' arcan pool, arcane duelist bard's blade thirst performance, and greater magic weapon could (at one point) be used to increase enhancement up to +5 on a weapon that already had more than +5 in abilities (bringing total bonus to 11+, which is epic); I think some of those have been errata'd away but they're worth checking.
For arcane casters, mythic arcane strike can add bane to your weapon to push it into epic when needed.
Well, if we use the rules from mythic for minor artifacts, we get this absolute craziness.
"Foe-Biting: When this item deals damage, its user can use mythic power to double the total amount of damage it deals. If the attack is a normal attack, the bearer can expend one use of legendary power to double the total amount of damage. If the attack is a confirmed critical hit, the bearer must instead expend two uses of legendary power to double the total damage. Damage from weapon special abilities (such as flaming) and precision-based damage are also doubled. This ability can be applied only to weapons. An item must be a minor or major artifact to have this ability."
And 2-5 other abilities. In mythic terms, Minor Artifacts are Tier 3.
I presume we are not doing that, as we want these to be unique rulebreaker thingies, rather than giant stat multipliers.
I think we're using *actual* minor artifacts, not creating new ones. I went with a Timeglass, for flavor.
The signature items will be akin to minor artifacts in power and abilities, but they will not be legendary items from mythic, which is what Illia was referencing above.
Foe-biting is so outrageous... A two handed fighter at our level can easily hit for 800+ damage in one hit with that enchantment. (I though about using a build headed that direction and nicknaming him "the godhammer" but it seemed too over the top).
I don't suppose you guys still recruiting?
But said two handed fighter is still hosed by Mirror Image. :P
I've gone with a more cerebral PC, way more mental of physical, so she is a little weak in body. She can throw things around kinetically of that helps. I have a feeling she is going to be really under powered compered with the other hard hitting PCs. 30+ to hit and 100s of DMG. But I wanted a themic feel more than raw power.
just found this Hugh problem with my build,
Psionic Tattoos
The following rules govern the use of psionic tattoos. A creature must have an appropriate physical surface on which to scribe the pattern (thus, incorporeal creatures or creatures with impermanent flesh, such as fire elementals, cannot use psionic tattoos).
Wait, you mean before you realized it was illegal rules wise, you wanted to tattoo a ghost?
Nope your thinking of the Ghost/Psion/Dread/meta-mind build, I'm talking of the Psion Cyptic/Psion/Uncarnate build, its the Uncarnate that stops Cyptic from fully working right.
I have gone back to the Dread as it gets me to the same thematic idea I had at the start. She is now Psion/Dread/Uncarnate build
I'm trying to get as much psionics into this my PC as I can
Race/Classes/items etc. Really hard to make it all work and keep up with magic. There are loads more Magic items than Psionic ones.
I'm thinking Tempest's Hilt will have more utility on it than offensive enchantments.
Ideas so far:
Tempest's Hilt looks like a technological version of a simple 2 handed hilt for a great sword or two bladed sword, with no blade attached. In reality, it is a set of crystalline focus hilts. During his time traveling the world, he's seen some of the tech from Numeria, and decided to craft his hilt to resemble that in order to give people the impression he has a "space sword", rather than the truth that he doesn't need the hilt at all to form his blades.
With a mental command, the two hilts can be separated, to focus two separate mind blades, or remain whole to focus either a two handed great sword sized mind blades, or as the Tempest prefers, a two bladed sword mind blade. Because of his half-giant heritage, he can form large sized blades from the hilts.
Usually, a crystalline hilt adds an enhancement bonus increase to the wielder's mind blade, but DT has no need for such. Instead, it is enchanted to port to him when called, and to change the damage type (bludgeoning, piercing or slashing) on command. It also acts as a power point battery (he puts them in himself and stores them for later) and as an equivalent to a meta-psionic focus (feat to mimic to be determined later).
Is this too strong? Not strong enough?
Also open to suggestions.
Maybe something to where it holds backup power for enchantments, so they still function in an anti-magic field?
I was thinking a staff of the magi variant with some mythic/level appropriate tricks.
With more of a personal flavor of course.
I think I am going to go with a psionic 3ed eye r Crown with the same.
OoOOooh, posting a lot of interest. I'm coming in with two ideas:
A: The Artisan from Drop Dead studios (The Spheres of Power guys), probably Gestalted with Arcanist and Psion into Metamind, or just Alchemist.
An ancient forgemaster, he has crafted from nothing but his bare hands, every single thing that his allies have ever needed.
As for artifact idea, maybe an artifact that makes it so that you can craft 100k gp worth of magic items per day? Maybe a key to his secret forge, forged from his own blood. It contains everything one needs to craft, and is treated as a masterwork crafting tool, and grants a competence bonus on craft checks equal to it's owner HD. In addition, cannot be entered by any means other than opening a door made by himself.
Might drop the Psion levels, and instead request the Phrenic template from 3.5
B: This is a simpler one, being a Wizard//Psion, with the Ghost template. He died, and decided to spend the remainder of his undeath orchestrating new scenarios and to obtain the perfect world.
His artifact of choice would be a spellbook containing one of every Wizard spell in the game, permitting him to become the perfect mage.
@Kryzbyn
It sounds good, what are the mechanics?
1) change damage type: what kind of action, and how often to change?
2) increase weapon size would probably need a no-stacking size change clause, but it is roughly equivalent to a feat
3) crystalline hilt likely wouldn't exist due to ABP, having it behave as a called weapon, might be ok
4) incorporating a cognizance crystal would also be ok, would you want to restrict the power points stored for use with the blade only?Did I miss anything?
@ALL
The legendary gifts table goes to 22, we are 25. Suggestions on what to do with 23-25?
1) There are scabbards that have a similar effect, it would mimic those. They work by putting a weapon in them. When drawn, they act as the other damage type. I would have it when the mind blade is summoned, it has the type desired, and would need to be re-summoned to change it.
2) DT's powerful build racial ability excludes him from the no stacking clause, and any other medium creature using his hilt would not be able to do so, unless it was another half-giant. I wasn't planning on connecting the size of the hilt to the size of blade summoned.3) It's a unique crystal hilt, as that it has no enhancement on it, but is used simply for the flavor of focusing a mind blade through it, and give him something tangible to put cool things on, other than enhancement bonuses or weapon enchantments. Other wise, I agree. With ABP, it serves no purpose, normally.
4) The PP in storage would only be accessible while the hilt is wielded, or at least that was the plan. I did not intend for those PP to be available while sheathed or otherwise not on his person.
You may have missed my intention for it to also act like a meta-psionic feat "rod" (I don't recall what they are called), where while wielded, it grants the use of a meta-psionic feat, he does not know himself.
@ legendary bonuses...
We can logically follow the progression of points for 2 more levels.
It's 3, 5, 7, 8 for a total of 23 points. It could be 9 (32), 10 (42) more for a total of 42? Maybe add a 5 point thing that allows you to consider your weapon epic for DR purposes?
OoOOooh, posting a lot of interest. I'm coming in with two ideas:
A: The Artisan from Drop Dead studios (The Spheres of Power guys), probably Gestalted with Arcanist and Psion into Metamind, or just Alchemist.
An ancient forgemaster, he has crafted from nothing but his bare hands, every single thing that his allies have ever needed.
As for artifact idea, maybe an artifact that makes it so that you can craft 100k gp worth of magic items per day? Maybe a key to his secret forge, forged from his own blood. It contains everything one needs to craft, and is treated as a masterwork crafting tool, and grants a competence bonus on craft checks equal to it's owner HD. In addition, cannot be entered by any means other than opening a door made by himself.
Might drop the Psion levels, and instead request the Phrenic template from 3.5
B: This is a simpler one, being a Wizard//Psion, with the Ghost template. He died, and decided to spend the remainder of his undeath orchestrating new scenarios and to obtain the perfect world.
His artifact of choice would be a spellbook containing one of every Wizard spell in the game, permitting him to become the perfect mage.
Recruitment closed on Sunday (11/22/15).
Gosh darnit. My apologies, then, I'll be off and will not bother you all again. (Curse the forums inability to edit posts)
For those make not using pointy sticks to hit things is there any way to get a +5 to a powers/spells range touch attacks, it would be nice would be nice.
Just my two cents on your delemias before I make off:
With another group who did epic bonus progression, they got 2 per level after they hit the max, with a few new options.
Epic Mental Prowess You gain an additional +2 enhancement bonus to a mental stat of your choice that stacks with the bonus from Mental Prowess. You must have the Legendary Mind 2 Gift to select this one.
Epic Armor You gain an additional +1 enhancement bonus to your AC while wearing an armor or shield you have selected for your Armor Attunement. This bonus allows you to pass the +5 enhancement bonus cap normally allowed. You may select this Gift multiple times per level, but each one must apply to a different suit of armor or shield.
Epic Weaponry You gain an additional +1 enhancement bonus to your attack and damage rolls with a weapon you have selected for your Weapon Attunement. This bonus allows you to pass the +5 enhancement bonus cap normally allowed. You may select this Gift multiple times per level, but each one must apply to a different weapon.
Epic Deflection Your bonus from the Deflection feature increases by +1
Epic Natural Armor Your bonus from the Toughening feature increases by +1
Epic Resistance Your bonus from the Resistance feature increases by +1
And with alternative options for the Weapon attunement, I would simply provide the option to use Weapon Attunement like Staves in Spheres of Power, providing a bonus to caster level.
Ha
I read that as the Complaint Column...
"You have a complaint? Here you go...<whack>"