Looking for some Grappler Brawler advice


Advice


I am currently playing a grappling based brawler in PFS and just hit 2nd level. I am trying to decide on which style feat path to progress down. Initially I had planned to pick up Pummeling Style at 2nd level so I could also dish out some damage when grappling was not an optimal choice. Unfortunately with the errata change to Pummeling Style, right now it isn't as appealing until I can really get Pummeling Charge... So I am trying to decide whether to go down the Grabbing Style or Snapping Turtle Style... Or if I should just use my feats to pick up all three base Style feats and the utilize Martial Flexibility to pick up the next feats in the chain to be more flexible?

At 3rd level I am going to pick up Deific Obidiance for Faylana to get that awesome +4 Grapple/CMD bonus. As you can see the PC is mostly grappling based, but I don't want to be a sole one-trick pony. Any suggestions that you can provide would be greatly appreciated! I am new to the brawler class and grappling in general.


Anyone have a little insight?


I haven't played a brawler, but I've built some to be versatile fighters. Power Attack, Combat Expertise, Dodge, Combat Reflexes, Weapon focus, and improved unarmed strike are some of the feats that help unlock a lot of others to give you lots of versatility. Using martial versatility to reach father up into chains (Greater/rapid grapple or style feats) is also useful, if more specialized.


What feats do you already have?

Personally, I like Martial Flexibility too much to put all my eggs in one basket. So, my Brawler is taking Paulicus' advice, and opening feat trees.


Right now I have Improved Grapple and Combat Expertise (to open up all the Improved combat maneuver options). I am thinking about going this route... Taking Snapping Turtle Style at 2nd level, Deific Obedience at 3rd, and then picking up both Grabbing and Pummeling styles at 5th level. This way I can utilize Martial Flexibility to gain additional feats in all those style trees. Greater Grapple is on the list for 7th level. I haven't decided yet on 8th level... Possibly Combat Reflexes or Power Attack to open up additional options.


I would go with Grabbing Style or Crane Style.

Grabbing style is one of the few ways to keep your Dex bonus to AC when you make a pin. And being able to use one hand to grapple without penalty gives you a great way to get a rope handy to tie up.

Crane Style can help keep you from getting beaten up when you grapple: when you're grappling someone, you are your target's main focus, and you will take their full attacks. (You only need a hand free for Crane Wing: you can use two hands with Crane Style.)

You can't really use Snapping Turtle Style when your grappling: since you have to have one hand free to benefit from Snapping Turtle Style, as soon as you use two hands to grapple, it won't do you any good.


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Minor nitpick: Falayna is an empyreal lord, not a god. So you want Celestial Obedience and not Deific Obedience.

If your going to focus on unarmed attacks (and you're a brawler, so it's a good idea) there's a trait in the Dragon Empires Primer called the something asian sounding Rebel that gives a straight +1 to unarmed damage.

As Paulicus and Visitor have stated, Martial Flexibility is amazing. Power Attack and Combat Expertise are a must for every brawler. The other feats Paulicus mentioned are also good choices but grappling is actually pretty darn useful so investing in it as your go-to option is not a bad plan either. Keep in mind that you don't have to actually take the style/grappling feats, you can Flex into them (but I would take at least through greater grapple).

Snapping Turtle works just fine (I have it on my brawler) and losing the shield bonus when you're already grappling has literally never been a problem. Grabbing Style is still worth considering because (as Gwen pointed out) you don't lose your dex when pinning and that is super useful; and Pummeling Style should also be considered because, even nerfed, it's still pretty solid but if you want to focus on grappling don't worry about it.

I don't recommend Crane Style for brawlers. IMO it's better to use turtle clutch on their turn, then on your turn pin, tie-up, and move on. To do this with Crane Wing you need Riposte in addition to getting the Grab ability so you can start a grapple on their turn to get the same action economy.

-edit-

Found the trait.


Kraken Style is also an option, mainly for the built-in +2 to grapple, though if your Wis is decent, it will help you squeeze (no pun intended)out some more damage.

Some other ways to get better Grapple: Weapon Focus (grapple), Greater Weapon Focus (grapple), Unfair Grip.


Vratix, thank you for pointing that out about the Obedience feats. I had not realized there was a specific one for Empyreal lords!

I'll look into Crane Style, but I really like Snapping Turtle Style simply for the Clutch feat. Being able to grapple as an immediate action following a missed attack seems like a dream for a grappler. That way I can initiate a grapple on the opponents turn, then maintain it on my own turn, then switch over to Grabbing Style once I have them in my grapple.

I like the extra bump that Kraken style gives to grapple and the extra damage is nice, but I won't be doing damage as an option really until I get Greater Grapple; that way I can pin and then start doing damage as a second grapple maintain action. I really want the other Kraken style feats to be great, but they just... aren't. Suffocation rules take WAY too long to ever be effective in combat.

Also, thanks for pointing out Unfair Grip! That's a pretty cool option to look into.

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