Knife Master: What spell for Major Magic rogue talent?

[Brakiri]

Hi folks,

we are playing the "Shackled City" campaign with Pathfinder-rules and my character is a new 12 RP catlike humanoid race with 4 levels of Unchained Rogue and one Level of Ninja.

My AC really sucks at the moment (18), my better armor is 2 weeks away (-> Mithril chain Shirt +1 for AC 21) and i was thinking about taking the rogue talents minor and major magic (Mage Hand and Shield) to boost my AC.

To describe my char a little bit (don't worry this combination was sanctioned by the DM): She is a skillmonkey with daggers (Knife master-ability) and two weapon fighting. I have no feats/talents concerning ranged weapons. I have a KI Pool and the Vanishing Trick.

I just read another thread about the very same question, but most of the answers were not really applicable, because my char has another focus entirely.

So my question here is: Are Mage Hand and Shield fitting choices for this kind of character?

I always get clobbered at the moment, because AC 18 on Level 5 is really weak. With Dodge on Level 6, my Chain Shirt and Shield i could end up with AC 26 3 times a day which sounds enormously better ;).

I appreciate your insights. Thank you.

Best regards

Brakiri

[Ellioti]

for the cantrip I always like Ray of Frost as it provides some Ranged capability for sneak attack.
Shield is probably the best idea defensive-wise, Reduce Person (+2 Dex, +1 AC/attack) should be considered as well.
Long Arm opens options tactic-wise. Or True Strike if you plan to have any kind of combat maneuver as a back-up.

[Brakiri]

Ellioti wrote:

for the cantrip I always like Ray of Frost as it provides some Ranged capability for sneak attack.

Shield is probably the best idea defensive-wise, Reduce Person (+2 Dex, +1 AC/attack) should be considered as well.
Long Arm opens options tactic-wise. Or True Strike if you plan to have any kind of combat maneuver as a back-up.

Yeah, Ray of Frost is one of my first choices as well. Reduce Person would be difficult, because my armor only allows +6 Dex Bonus which i already have. +2 Dex would not grant any AC for me.

Long arms is also interesting..reach +5ft and later Combat Reflexes with a +6 Dex bonus..could be worthwhile :)

[Claxon]

I'm a fan of vanish for SHTF situations.

Also, take the feat bookish rogue so it can be whatever you want.

[CWheezy]

He already has super vanish, from his ninja trick.

[RuyanVe]

Ellioti wrote:

for the cantrip I always like Ray of Frost as it provides some Ranged capability for sneak attack.

Shield is probably the best idea defensive-wise [...].

Ha! Just noticed that it only says (ranged) attacks in the sneak attack section... so many new possibilities! Well, thanks for that!

Back to the OP: I always felt that unseen servant provides a lot of utility to the rogue. Or you could go for magic missiles to have some straight damage option (adding sneak attack dice).

Ruyan.

[Cheburn]

RuyanVe wrote:

. . . Or you could go for magic missiles to have some straight damage option (adding sneak attack dice).

It's generally agreed on that you can't apply sneak attack damage to magic missile. Here's a relevant reference.

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

Sneak attack normally works with weapon-like spells, including rays. It doesn't normally work with magic missile because that is not a weapon-like spell or ray.

The 'normally' in question refers to the Arcane Trickster capstone ability (Surprise Spells), which lets you apply SA damage to any spell that deals damage.

[Darche Schneider]

Icicle Dagger
Shadow Weapon
Never get disarmed for long.

[Righty_]

I prefer true strike for it's utility. Then ex retreat, anticipate peril, and vanish. I ofen have shield via wand @ 2 prestige

[RuyanVe]

Cheburn wrote:

RuyanVe wrote:

. . . Or you could go for magic missiles to have some straight damage option (adding sneak attack dice).

It's generally agreed on that you can't apply sneak attack damage to magic missile. Here's a relevant reference.

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

Sneak attack normally works with weapon-like spells, including rays. It doesn't normally work with magic missile because that is not a weapon-like spell or ray.

The 'normally' in question refers to the Arcane Trickster capstone ability (Surprise Spells), which lets you apply SA damage to any spell that deals damage.

Thanks! That's for getting all excited and jumping to conclusions.

Ruyan.

[Brakiri]

Hi,

Icicle Dagger and Shadow Weapon don't really appeal to me.
As my Use Magic Device is close to "non existant", using wands is, at least at the moment, not a good option.

True Strike is a good option but my attack is +10/+10 on Level 5 as a rogue, i think thats ok.

At the moment my top candidates are Acid Spash or Ray of Frost for minor magic and Long arm/Shield for level 1.
Too bad that taking Major Magic twice is not allowed :)

[Laiho Vanallo]

Ellioti wrote:

for the cantrip I always like Ray of Frost as it provides some Ranged capability for sneak attack.

Shield is probably the best idea defensive-wise, Reduce Person (+2 Dex, +1 AC/attack) should be considered as well.
Long Arm opens options tactic-wise. Or True Strike if you plan to have any kind of combat maneuver as a back-up.

Ranged TOUCH AC attack with Ray of frost is wonderful combined with sneak attack!

[Laiho Vanallo]

My suggestions:
Silent image -> very versatile
Summon Minor Monster -> while being invisible from your vanishing trick you can summon a bunch of little critters to help you flank and optimize your sneak attack.
Mount -> summon a horse you can flank with, use for cover, use for travel. Always great and last a long time.
protection from evil -> really great vs mind control

[Ventnor]

Get the Bookish Rogue feat. Have all the cantrips and 1st-level spells.

[Paulicus]

I second Bookish Rogue. Versatility is great, especially without UMD. Alternatively, taking a level of wizard can be useful. Diviner and its variants have nice tricks.

If your GM will allow it, Blend is a great spell for rogues. Basically "hide in plain sight" for 10 mins per level. I grabbed it for my assassin.

True Strike also has lots of situational uses.

[Typelouder]

Silent image: create a globe of darkness. Basically giving them the blinded condition. Create areas of dense fog.

Shocking grasp + conductive weapon.

[Brakiri]

Bookish rogue is a great idea. Need a spell book, but hey that shouldn't be too difficult.

Only problem is the feat..i already had Dodge in mind for the next feat...

But i will think about it...

Thanks!