Lets say I want to play a Nature Fang druid. Lets also say he is a dwarf and I want to play up the "clumsy and slow thinking but steady, stubborn and hardy" (kinda like Perrin from Wheel of Time fame) trope but having a relatively low Dex and Int. Luckily Ranger Combat Styles don't require you to meet prerequisites for those feats.
So, say I wanted to take the two weapon feats and not have to meet the Dex requirements and then take the Combat Expertise feats (from ISG) without meeting the Int requirements. Could I do that?
Why/why not?
Rules based answers only please.
FYI - I have searched the boards and seen the separate but related question of when the Slayer talents have to be taken. A judgement on that saying you have to take them at 2, 6 and 10 wouldn't even make sense in my situation as Nature Fang doesn't even get it's first Slayer Talent until 4th. Honestly, that is probably strong evidence supporting that the Devs intention was NOT to have them forced to be taken at certain levels.
But I digress. My goal in this thread is mostly to discuss how many styles could this character possibly take?
Torbyne: Please reread my original topic and post. This is in reference to Slayers (indirectly) and Nature Fang druids. Not rangers.
Lune, your question is unclear. You need to clarify and you also need to link relevant rules that you want clarified.
As a slayer gains experience, he learns a number of talents that aid him and confound his foes. Starting at 2nd level and every 2 levels thereafter, a slayer gains one slayer talent. Unless otherwise noted, a slayer cannot select an individual talent more than once.
Ranger Combat Style (Ex): The slayer selects a ranger combat style (such as archery or two-weapon combat) and gains a combat feat from the first feat list of that style. He can choose feats from his selected combat style, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites. At 6th level, he may select this talent again and add the 6th-level ranger combat feats from his chosen style to the list. At 10th level, he may select this talent again and add the 10th-level ranger combat feats from his chosen style to the list.
It seems very clear that you are only allowed to have one combat style.
in any event, to answer your question, a Nature Fang druid has ONE combat style that they may select feats from three times only.
Everything you said is true except the last bit, although it's not a big deal. You can take the extra slayer talent feat to get more slayer talents.
So you can use a feat to get a talent to get a feat. Hue, gotta love Pathfinder.
Maezer: You are not aware of it. I posted in my original post it is from ISG (Inner Sea Gods). This is not relevant to answering the question though. This could just as easily be two weapon and archery feats.
I'm not talking about Rangers. This is in reference to Slayers (indirectly) and Nature Fang Druids.
Slayers work off of the ranger styles, and NFD use the slayers. So Rangers are very much applicable since they are the base for all of this.
When the slayer firsts takes the feat he picks one of the rangers styles. From then on when he takes the style again 6+ and 10+ he's still locked into the style he picked for the first time. So if he picks TW for his first style then it's as if he was a ranger with that style, and the feats in archery are inaccessible unless they are also on the TW style list.
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If you want to take Combat Expertise feats without Combat Expertise, look at Dirty Fighting in the Dirty Tactics Toolbox.
If you want to take Two Weapon Fighting without Dexterity, look at Artful Dodge from the Melee Tactics Toolbox.
Unfortunately, you really can't benefit from them both.
Another option is a dip into brawler. You'll lose a level of spellcasting that always hurts, but you can bypass int requirements and can get another die of sneak attack with snakebite striker.
CampinCarl9127: You quoted the Slayer class. Does Nature Fang have that same limitation? I didn't see it printed there.
Sorry, posting from my phone at work. Hard to quote text from pfsrd.
CampinCarl9127: You quoted the Slayer class. Does Nature Fang have that same limitation? I didn't see it printed there.
The ability functions as the slayer class ability. The slayer class ability has that limitation unless the nature fang says otherwise, which it does not. When an ability functions as another ability, you get every aspect of that ability, including the restrictions.
Imbicatus: Hm... good suggestions. I'll take a look. Thanx!
Extra talent may allow you to take the second style at an odd level in place of a feat but the end result is the same, no? you can only take ranger combat style three times through use of slayer talents due to the wording of the talent about taking it multiple times?in any event, to answer your question, a Nature Fang druid has ONE combat style that they may select feats from three times only.Everything you said is true except the last bit, although it's not a big deal. You can take the extra slayer talent feat to get more slayer talents.
So you can use a feat to get a talent to get a feat. Hue, gotta love Pathfinder.
Ah, I stand corrected. Good catch.
Imbicatus: ...why have I not seen this feat before?! Dirty fighter is amazing! Thank you!
The same number as Rangers can have.
Hint: The answer is 1.
Ok, so at home now and more easily able to quote s*+&.
Slayer Talent
At 4th level and every 2 levels thereafter, a nature fang selects a slayer talent. Starting at 12th level, she can select an advanced slayer talent in place of a slayer talent. She uses her druid level as her slayer level to determine what talents she can select.
This ability replaces wild shape.
Ok. Nothing there that says you cannot take a Slayer Talent more than once. So then I go look at the individual Slayer Talent for Combat Style to see if there is anything there barring it...
Ranger Combat Style (Ex): The slayer selects a ranger combat style (such as archery or two-weapon combat) and gains a combat feat from the first feat list of that style. He can choose feats from his selected combat style, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites. At 6th level, he may select this talent again and add the 6th-level ranger combat feats from his chosen style to the list. At 10th level, he may select this talent again and add the 10th-level ranger combat feats from his chosen style to the list.
Nothing there...
What am I missing here? If I am talking about the specific example given in my opening post what is it that bars a Nature Fang Druid from selecting Ranger Combat Style more than once?
I understand that Pathfinder is a permissive system but it is outright telling you to select a Slayer Talent and there is no limitation given as to which you can select. So... has this been ruled on somewhere that I am not aware of? Or are people just trying to apply Slayer or Ranger rules to a Nature Fang even though it explicitly leaves that line out?
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It is in the Slayer Talent description in the Slayer Class. It outlines the rules for Slayer Talents just like the Rogue class outlines the rules for Rogue Talents, just like the Feats section of the rules outlines how you can select Feats.
As a slayer gains experience, he learns a number of talents that aid him and confound his foes. Starting at 2nd level and every 2 levels thereafter, a slayer gains one slayer talent. Unless otherwise noted, a slayer cannot select an individual talent more than once.
ShieldLawrence: I think everything else you referenced there uses language that says "this functions just like the [insert the name of the relevant ability here]". Nature Fang doesn't have that kind of language. Aren't you kinda adding words where they didn't exist?
What makes you want to apply Slayer limitations to Nature Fang?
BBT: Good question. I am wondering that too as I may end up wanting to use that if the multiple styles from Nature Fang doesn't work out.
Also, what about taking the Extra Slayer Talent feat? Would that allow me to pick another Style?
No Lune. Slayer talents function as slayer talents regardless of source. One combat style.
Imbicatus: ...why have I not seen this feat before?! Dirty fighter is amazing! Thank you!
You probably haven't seen it because it is a very recent addition.
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ShieldLawrence: I think everything else you referenced there uses language that says "this functions just like the [insert the name of the relevant ability here]". Nature Fang doesn't have that kind of language. Aren't you kinda adding words where they didn't exist?
What makes you want to apply Slayer limitations to Nature Fang?
I am applying the Slayer Talents limitations to Nature Fang. The limitations are found in the Slayer class description, but that doesn't make them less correct.
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Lune, would you say that a Nature Fang could also add any number of asterisk marked talents to its sneak attacks? The same text limiting you to one is found in the Slayer Talents description in the Slayer Class write up.
As a slayer gains experience, he learns a number of talents that aid him and confound his foes. Starting at 2nd level and every 2 levels thereafter, a slayer gains one slayer talent. Unless otherwise noted, a slayer cannot select an individual talent more than once.
Talents marked with an asterisk add effects to a slayer's sneak attack. Only one of these talents can be applied to an individual attack, and the decision of which to use must be made before the attack roll is made.