Bored to death with PFS Core Wizard, please help


Advice


So, my local shop runs all Core tables for PFS right now, which means I can only use Core classes, feats, etc. I had to unexpectedly make a 1st level character for a thing they're doing, and they needed an arcane caster, so I went with a Wizard. It was a rush job, so I just threw together the easiest thing to keep alive: A Conjuration Wizard with Toughness as a 1st level feat. He survived, he threw a lot of acid darts, and he bored me to tears.

Obviously the lack of background is part of what hurts, but the other part is that Conjuration, while probably one of the best core schools mechanically (what else comes close? Abjuration? Divination?) just feels so dull to me. The fun teleportation stuff doesn't show up until 8th level, and an extra round on my summons isn't going to provide much either. Plus, having GM'd plenty of low-level Pathfinders, simply the thought of summoning an Eagle to claw, claw, bite puts me to sleep.

How can I rebuild this Wizard into something interesting (most important) and useful (secondary importance)? Any wild ideas that can be done with only the Core rulebook? A Lawful Neutral Necromancer sounded interesting at first, but a)the Skeletal Summoner feat is in Ultimate Magic and b) we're doing Godsmouth Heresy, so the fear touch ability is going to be utterly useless.

I'm also open to any interesting Sorcerer build ideas you might have (Celestial? Can anyone make that work?)


One thing to do if you're getting bored: fill your slots with a bunch of Silent Image spells, and figure out ways to solve problems with just that or Ghost Sound.

Otherwise, what is it that you are looking for in a character? It's true that a first level wizard doesn't have much versatility yet, but it's still probably the most versatile class that you can find even at level 1. If just rolling attack and damage dice is getting boring to you, try branching out into more fun spells like Charm Person or Illusions.


18 strength half-orc transmuter wizard with a falchion. Either go for eldritch knight to stay competitive in melee or stay pure wizard and transition into buffing/control at higher levels. Its fun because you get to use those cool wizard polymorph spells. Also the confused looks from everyone else at the table makes it worthwhile.

Grand Lodge

Complain to your local VO that you want to use the materials and books you've bought and that offering Core-only games is seriously inhibiting your fun.


Felyndiira wrote:

One thing to do if you're getting bored: fill your slots with a bunch of Silent Image spells, and figure out ways to solve problems with just that or Ghost Sound.

Otherwise, what is it that you are looking for in a character? It's true that a first level wizard doesn't have much versatility yet, but it's still probably the most versatile class that you can find even at level 1. If just rolling attack and damage dice is getting boring to you, try branching out into more fun spells like Charm Person or Illusions.

It's a tough situation because much of what you encounter in Godsmouth Heresy is largely immune to things like Charm Person.

Jason Robbs wrote:
18 strength half-orc transmuter wizard with a falchion. Either go for eldritch knight to stay competitive in melee or stay pure wizard and transition into buffing/control at higher levels. Its fun because you get to use those cool wizard polymorph spells. Also the confused looks from everyone else at the table makes it worthwhile.

I like this idea! I was just over here sketching out something similar (dual-dagger, bonded weapon[dagger], etc) but I ran up against the question of whether you can still deliver magical touch attacks if you've got knives in both hands (or in your case, both hands are on a falchion).

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

What kind of stuff do you usually find fun/interesting? There's a lot of different ways you can build an arcane caster and knowing what you enjoy would make it a lot easier to give advice...

A gnomish sorcerer with the fey bloodline and some illusions could solve a lot of problems with charms and trickery (and be pretty good with bluff and diplomacy), plus you could take acid splash to still have that fallback.

The Str based half-Orc transmuter can be fun (though on a 20pt buy you'll never have the DCs to make good use of spells that allow saves).

Any sorcerer can take combat reflexes and a longspear- that allows you to use your standard actions on any kinds of spells or whatever you want and still contribute directly in combat through AoOs.

Bards are arcane casters... They get a lot of options from their skills, are a force multiplier through party buffs, are better physical combatants than wiz/sor typically, and don't fall a spell-level behind sorcerers until 6th level.


spectrevk wrote:
Felyndiira wrote:

One thing to do if you're getting bored: fill your slots with a bunch of Silent Image spells, and figure out ways to solve problems with just that or Ghost Sound.

Otherwise, what is it that you are looking for in a character? It's true that a first level wizard doesn't have much versatility yet, but it's still probably the most versatile class that you can find even at level 1. If just rolling attack and damage dice is getting boring to you, try branching out into more fun spells like Charm Person or Illusions.

It's a tough situation because much of what you encounter in Godsmouth Heresy is largely immune to things like Charm Person.

Jason Robbs wrote:
18 strength half-orc transmuter wizard with a falchion. Either go for eldritch knight to stay competitive in melee or stay pure wizard and transition into buffing/control at higher levels. Its fun because you get to use those cool wizard polymorph spells. Also the confused looks from everyone else at the table makes it worthwhile.
I like this idea! I was just over here sketching out something similar (dual-dagger, bonded weapon[dagger], etc) but I ran up against the question of whether you can still deliver magical touch attacks if you've got knives in both hands (or in your case, both hands are on a falchion).

With two weapon fighting you will find it difficult to cast spells since both of your hands are full. With a falchion you can still cast and deliver touch spells. The strength wizard can basically go in two directions:

Wizard 5/Barbarian OR Fighter 1/Eldritch Knight X
This is a fun but not very effective option. You open combat with either Haste or some polymorph spell and then wade into melee. With this option you need to focus on precasting as many long term buffs as possible to stay okay at hitting. You are going to need things like Heroism and False Life up as much as possible. A fighter level is better than a Barbarian level but I think that fighting as a raging Fire Elemental is funnier.

Wizard X
This is a more standard build. You will stay effective in melee until level 6~9ish, depending on your party. At the mid levels you will transition to more standard spells like Haste and summoning spells. For this build I recommend getting Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus for transmutation and using Slow and Telekinesis to differentiate yourself from other wizards.


How about a Wizard/Monk combo? I just reviewed the melee touch attack rules and as long as you're using unarmed/natural attacks, you can deliver touch spells with an attack and deal your normal attack damage in addition to the spell's damage. A short dip into Monk will give you 1d6 on unarmed attacks, the improved unarmed combat feat, and WIS to AC. Seems like a pretty good deal.

Granted, it doesn't become a thing until level 2, but it'll be something I can look forward to.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Universalist re-spec. Hand of the Apprentice says "your melee weapon" and "a melee weapon", doesn't say a darned thing about having to be proficient with it. I recommend the biggest weapon you can physically carry without exceeding encumbrance, such as a Large Elven Curve Blade or something more ridiculous. Make sure you have a decent Strength (14 or higher). Hurl helicopter blades for fun and profit (3 +INT bonus)/day. For added insult to injury, do this 1/2 rounds by casting true strike first.


I don't know too much about wizards or sticking to core but Turin the Mad that sounds so cool. I can't wait to try it out.


It's all CRB. ;)


Why all core? I never heard of an exclusive core public game.

On the other note, why do they NEED an arcane caster? That seems silly. With the rebuild rules who care what you are at level 1. You could be a ranger and at level two become your monk.


Turin the Mad wrote:
Universalist re-spec. Hand of the Apprentice says "your melee weapon" and "a melee weapon", doesn't say a darned thing about having to be proficient with it. I recommend the biggest weapon you can physically carry without exceeding encumbrance, such as a Large Elven Curve Blade or something more ridiculous. Make sure you have a decent Strength (14 or higher). Hurl helicopter blades for fun and profit (3 +INT bonus)/day. For added insult to injury, do this 1/2 rounds by casting true strike first.

Hell, combine this with catch off guard (CRB) and launch pretty much whatever you want at whoever you want for crazy big damage.


Finlanderboy wrote:

Why all core? I never heard of an exclusive core public game.

On the other note, why do they NEED an arcane caster? That seems silly. With the rebuild rules who care what you are at level 1. You could be a ranger and at level two become your monk.

You've never heard of of the PFS Core Campaign? They started it last year. It's ostensibly a way to get newer players involved without putting them at a disadvantage for not owning so many books, and it lets experienced players re-play scenarios for credit.

It creates a fun challenge in some situations, but can become rather dull in others.


Of course you're bored, you're just spamming Acid Dart.

Grease and Obscuring Mist are both great choices for your Conjurer Bonus Spell.

Meanwhile there's a ton of excellent stuff for your additional spells, Color Spray, Charm Person, Sleep, Silent Image, Enlarge Person, Animate Rope...

All of it has amazing potential if used correctly.

Dark Archive

Grease, Stumble Gap, Create Pit... always fun options. Summon Monster can be a real hoot... Flank for your friends, menace enemy casters. Be creative and abuse the limits of the creature types and their abilities.

Summon swarm , stinking cloud... battlefield control and terrain denial. Enemy harassment. So much more fun to be had than spamming Acid Arrow and Magic Missile.

When life gives you lemons, create a pit behind your enemy, grease the ground around it, and summon a earth elemental to bullrush him into it. Then throw the lemons in. And then a couple of summoned dolphins because why not.

Obviously that's all a bit over the top but you get the idea. Wizards, even Core, are incredibly versatile. With some cheap wands and a variety of hindering and helping spells you can have a lot of fun and not get bored.


Are Stumble Gap and Create Pit considered core spells? I was under the impression this PFS style was CRB only, but if it includes the entire Core Line that opens a TON of options.

[Incidentally Summon Monster I has never seemed worth it to me. Just not enough potency, coupled with crap duration when its relevant.]

Dark Archive

Dang my bad. Those are APG spells. :(

You can always use summoned monsters to block escape routes and then bowl a flaming sphere. Explosive runes on a paper, hand it to your earth elemental, and have it burrow next to enemies and read the paper.

Magic mouth, combined with silent image or other illusion spells can increase believability and fun for roleplaying. True strike when you expect an AOO, maybe even with that Falchion mentioned above?

Don't give up, hehe. Think outside the box.


spectrevk wrote:
Finlanderboy wrote:

Why all core? I never heard of an exclusive core public game.

On the other note, why do they NEED an arcane caster? That seems silly. With the rebuild rules who care what you are at level 1. You could be a ranger and at level two become your monk.

You've never heard of of the PFS Core Campaign? They started it last year. It's ostensibly a way to get newer players involved without putting them at a disadvantage for not owning so many books, and it lets experienced players re-play scenarios for credit.

It creates a fun challenge in some situations, but can become rather dull in others.

I am sorry i heard of core, I misunderstood and thought you store only ran core.

My core character is Coreran Ger, he is a ranger for the proletariat CORE. None of those bourgeoisie splat books. We are all equals!

He works with KORNAN! the barbarian, Corserer the arcane caster, and Coraladin the holy warrior.

Grand Lodge

spectrevk wrote:
Felyndiira wrote:

One thing to do if you're getting bored: fill your slots with a bunch of Silent Image spells, and figure out ways to solve problems with just that or Ghost Sound.

Otherwise, what is it that you are looking for in a character? It's true that a first level wizard doesn't have much versatility yet, but it's still probably the most versatile class that you can find even at level 1. If just rolling attack and damage dice is getting boring to you, try branching out into more fun spells like Charm Person or Illusions.

It's a tough situation because much of what you encounter in Godsmouth Heresy is largely immune to things like Charm Person.

Jason Robbs wrote:
18 strength half-orc transmuter wizard with a falchion. Either go for eldritch knight to stay competitive in melee or stay pure wizard and transition into buffing/control at higher levels. Its fun because you get to use those cool wizard polymorph spells. Also the confused looks from everyone else at the table makes it worthwhile.
I like this idea! I was just over here sketching out something similar (dual-dagger, bonded weapon[dagger], etc) but I ran up against the question of whether you can still deliver magical touch attacks if you've got knives in both hands (or in your case, both hands are on a falchion).

You sure can deliver a melee touch attack with a falchion. You can hold the falchion in one hand while you deliver the touch attack with the other, then regrip the falchion. Otherwise how would a wizard ever be able to cast a spell with a staff and still have a free hand? As long as you don't abuse release/regrib rules, you'll be fine. I think there is a FAQ on it somewhere. Dual wielding daggers might be more cumbersome and more of a grey area.

A Fighter 1/Wizard 5(6?)/EK x might be a good choice for you, probably of transmutation school. I kind of like the idea of the 6th level of wizard. Doesn't hurt BAB and gives you a good save boost all around.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I love low (through mid) level adventuring.
Core conjurer?
Cantrips are your friend. Granted usefulness will vary by table composition. A group of smash and grab murder hobos won't appreciate finesse or subtlety.

Also as others have mentioned there are plenty of game changers even at level 1.
Grease that boss's weapon or magical staff or your buddy who's grappled.
Obscuring Mist vs. incoming arrows. Party stands at edge and gets concealment while baddies do not.
Work in combination with others. Unseen Servant can get by many obstacles and it is great after the fighter does a disarm.
Mount and then have it giddayup down that trap filled hall.

And...nothing wrong with non Conjuration spells such as Color Spray, Enlarge, etc...

At the end of the day, you are a wizard. That means among other things you are a god :)


claudekennilol wrote:
Complain to your local VO that you want to use the materials and books you've bought and that offering Core-only games is seriously inhibiting your fun.

I don't think there is anything a VO can do about it. As far as I understand, they don't get to control what type of games are run at locations.

If the locations are only offering core-only games I don't think there's anything to do, except to ask one of the locations if they would create a non-core game.

All that aside, it should be pretty easy to make a fun core only wizard. In fact, many of the best options for wizards are in the core rule book. Part of the problem is 1st level wizards don't have many spell slots, so they resort to cantrips. Thusly they aren't a lot of fun to play to people who like playing wizards (because you're just spamming a weak ranged attack spell).

Low level wizards a rough, that's really about the summary of things. It will get better.

Technically in PFS you can play through level 1 as whatever you want, and the rebuild the character completely before playing the character at level 2. You can rebuild into whatever kind of wizard you want.


I live in an area with a fair number of shops running PFS; I suspect this one is going all-Core to set itself apart and attract new players, which I totally respect. Thanks for all of these quality build ideas!

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

My first character was a Sorceress specializing in Charm/Enchantment spells, however, I picked up Armor Proficiency Light, Arcane Armor Proficiency and later on Combat Reflex to make the most of a Longspear. I think I spent half my low levels as a substitute fighter and had a fun time doing it. Mithril Chain Shirt and Mwk Longspear can be acquired fairly quickly.


You could also choose dwarf rather than Half-Orc and use a Battleaxe or War-hammer two-handed when not casting touch spells. Most of the other ideas I concur with.


Claxon wrote:
All that aside, it should be pretty easy to make a fun core only wizard. In fact, many of the best options for wizards are in the core rule book. Part of the problem is 1st level wizards don't have many spell slots, so they resort to cantrips. Thusly they aren't a lot of fun to play to people who like playing wizards (because you're just spamming a weak ranged attack spell).

The key to playing a wizard at low levels- but especially at levels 1 and 2, is the principle of One Spell One Victory.

Prepare spells that will change the tide of battle in your party's favor and drop the right one at the right time.

A Conjurer has at least three spells per day [1 Wiz Level, 1 from Intelligence and 1 from Specialization], four if he has a 20 Int or a Bonded Object, five if he has a 20 Int AND a Bonded Object.

Make it a point to play the 'game changer' in as many fights as possible. After that? Do what you like. Have your wizard pull a book out of his backpack and lay back against a wall or tree and read while the party cleans up after him. Or stand around and plink with cantrips if you feel like it.

Point being your primary contribution is your one spell that shifts the battle.

Grand Lodge

Sorcerer, Undead bloodline, so your Charm/Enchantment spells work on intelligent undead.


O.k., the giant sword thrower is pretty hilarious and awesome.


bfobar wrote:
Turin the Mad wrote:
Universalist re-spec. Hand of the Apprentice says "your melee weapon" and "a melee weapon", doesn't say a darned thing about having to be proficient with it. I recommend the biggest weapon you can physically carry without exceeding encumbrance, such as a Large Elven Curve Blade or something more ridiculous. Make sure you have a decent Strength (14 or higher). Hurl helicopter blades for fun and profit (3 +INT bonus)/day. For added insult to injury, do this 1/2 rounds by casting true strike first.
Hell, combine this with catch off guard (CRB) and launch pretty much whatever you want at whoever you want for crazy big damage.

Go Eldritch Knight via [class that grants MWP for free], get Improvised Weapon Mastery to go with it. ^______^


Gevaudan wrote:
O.k., the giant sword thrower is pretty hilarious and awesome.

A variant on " I cast FIST!! " ^______^


My first thought is more along the lines of well it is a first level wizard. Expecting a first level wizard to be interesting because of spell availability and choices is not going to happen at least for me. And it sounds like that is all the OP initially had. Any first level character is going to have a difficult road being interesting without background and seeing potential ahead. As in just how interesting would Gandalf or Elminster be at first level really based on spells alone? Much more about the background and journey ahead at that point.


spectrevk wrote:
I live in an area with a fair number of shops running PFS; I suspect this one is going all-Core to set itself apart and attract new players, which I totally respect. Thanks for all of these quality build ideas!

Where is this? Bleh, I need to move...

The Exchange

Illusion is the best Core school, IMO. Plenty of powerful spells at low levels (color spray at 1st, mirror image and invisibility at 2nd) and a great 8th level ability, swift action improved invisibility. The Teleportation ability of the base Conjuration school is okay but not nearly as useful. Keep dimension door memorized and it is less of a loss.

Core Wizards seem to universally suffer at low levels as far as school abilities. The 1st level illusion school ability to blind is not terrible, but suffers greatly from hit dice limitations. Still it seems to lose much less utility than petty-damage based abilities offered by other schools.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Gevaudan wrote:
O.k., the giant sword thrower is pretty hilarious and awesome.

No one expects a Wizard to throw helicopter blades. Want to add insult to injury? Pick a deity that grants the Magic domain, grab just that 1st level of Cleric (and a respectable Wisdom score) for hand of the acolyte. Now you can potentially double the number of helicopter blades/day you throw.

How's THAT for a Mystic Theurge. ^______^


Mystic Madness wrote:

Illusion is the best Core school, IMO. Plenty of powerful spells at low levels (color spray at 1st, mirror image and invisibility at 2nd) and a great 8th level ability, swift action improved invisibility. The Teleportation ability of the base Conjuration school is okay but not nearly as useful. Keep dimension door memorized and it is less of a loss.

Core Wizards seem to universally suffer at low levels as far as school abilities. The 1st level illusion school ability to blind is not terrible, but suffers greatly from hit dice limitations. Still it seems to lose much less utility than petty-damage based abilities offered by other schools.

I used to think the same.

Untill we played higher levels with my illusion specialist.
It's NOT fun at all when half the foes you meet actually see through your illusions through native powers (so many senses and powers trump visual illusions) or simply knowing who you are and preparing accordingly.

Core only I think Conjuration and Transmutation remain superior for their spell list.
Divination has the best power i think.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Advice / Bored to death with PFS Core Wizard, please help All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Advice