Poisoner class

[Gorbeck]

One of my players is interested in playing a class focused on poisons, but was concerned about low poison DC's. I came up with this class and was hoping to get some feedback for it. Any and all comments and suggestions are welcome. This is the first class I've ever made, so I'm sure it's not as good as it could be.

The concept was essentially to make a class that has cheap and easy access to poisons that actually stand a chance of effecting opponents. It's intended to be sort of a debuff class. The wording of the Poison Craft ability is a bit clunky, I know, but I'm not sure how to re-word it to make it better. Also, I don't particularly like the name Poisoner, so any alternative names for the class would be welcome. Thanks!

https://docs.google.com/document/d/19I9t59sI816VrbJ4bpqwiwXQFLqtnVdRGHnRHzh sEmI/edit?usp=sharing

[Ciaran Barnes]

I don't have the focus at the moment to critique the class the way I would like to, but if you were aiming to make weak rogue, then you have succeeded. I suggest that instead of trying to turn one schtick into a class, then you should make a poisoner archetype for another class, such as the rogue, investigator, ranger, or alchemist.

[Drejk]

At the first glance seems to be rather on the weak side. Maybe you should consider writing some talents for a rogue enhancing poisons instead?

Also, dirty tactics toolbox is coming this or next month, it might contain something regarding improving effects of poison?

[Cyrad]

I always recommend making archetypes, especially when your concept has a very narrow focus. Designing classes is exceptionally difficult. Even experienced professional game designers struggle with it.

[Zwordsman]

having read that... I would also have to vote archetype for an alchemist, and then daggermaark poisoner. Your creation isn't really bad but it is a bit weak. and basically will be useless vs a large portion of things. A alchemist which switches out infusions or bombs (not both) will still be valid.

This is me touting what i've made before but I still think its a decent idea.

Basically switching out infusions for poison points. Using those points to create free temporary poisons. Or, by taking an effect similar to the pathfinder chronicler's money thing except make it cheaper and make them temporary existances. Make them SU.

That way they gain a usuable pool of poisons per day.

Then have a few new discoveries, Ones that let created (i.e. self crafted and the temporary poisons ) Add the crafters Int to the DC of the poison.
Include some discoveries that include boosting the amount of free money. OR (not both I suppose) a discovery that lets them use the crafting cost of poison when making the temp poisons.

Lastly snag a few of the class abilities from dagger mark poisoner to replace the Mutagen and those discoveries. (though a viv+this archetype would love dagger mark poisoner for the sneak attack dcboost)

Really basically leave it up to you to decide how much free money they get per level to craft. Since its your game balance.

I've made something similar (but I made it a prestige class, and also included alchemical item boosting class traits as well as poison) and it worked pretty ok and not unbalanced. It filled a pretty nice niche and felt fairly unique. Though I would remake that alchemical scholar now that I've a few more years experience.

[AwesomenessDog]

Not to make this thread a broken record, but it would work better as an archetype or by making these abilities as rogue talents. Also, I would put a WIS cap on studied Poisoner. The Delayed poison ability and Poison Touch ability seem to also only be useful for villainous NPCs.