I am building an Armiger that will take the Hellknight prestige class as soon as possible in the Wrath of the Righteous adventure path.
Does anyone have any advice on how I should build the character including starting class? I have been torn with starting as a fighter (more feats) vs a paladin to start, but I also was looking at some stuff out of the Demon Hunter's Handbook. I'm very torn on what direction to go with this, does anyone have any advise?
Paladin will give you saves and immunities. If you take the Oath against Chaos, you get more Smite Chaos' and can still opt for Smite Evil if you want.
Fighter can archetype into some cool abilties (Mutagen, Flight, Martial Flexibility, Mauler Familiar), but then you start taking Hellknight levels, and lose all progression on them.
I would do Paladin. It's very fitting for the campaign you're in anyway.
Yeah, paladin would work pretty well thematically. While not super common, it is canon that a leader (or possibly a founder) of one of the Hellknight Orders was in fact a paladin.
With Wrath of Righteous I believe you're fighting chaotic evil demons, so smite chaos or smite evil will work equally well.
Iomedae is one of five Lawful gods venerated by the Order of the Godclaw. There are Lawful Goods and even Paladins in the Hellknights. They even specifically send Paladin/Hellknights on missions where the codes are unlikely to conflict. No reason to send away such powerful forces of Law.
I believe both Iomedae and Torag are patrons of the Order of the Godclaw. The others are Abadar and Irori, both Lawful Neutral, and Asmodeus (Lawful Evil).
Despite working with Devils at times, Hellknight model themselves after Hell to mimic it's efficiency and as a scare tactic. They are not however, mostly evil.
As long as you as a Paladin don't get mixed up in anything evil, you can do just fine as a hellknight. And it should be relatively easy to avoid some of the bigger instances of being evil with the law.
My only problem with a paladin is that I was trying not to ally myself with a god, which if I choose paladin I may have to. I was going to side with Iomedae eventually, but someone told me that this AP focuses a lot on redemption and repentance, I thought that doing that as a paladin might really suck... or maybe it's a really good RP opportunity, who knows?
The thought of a struggle in his heart between Iomedae and Asmodeus was appealing. If nothing else, I liked the idea of a character pushed by law, not necessarily by good. I feel like if I go with a paladin of Iomedae, I lose that. Am I wrong or do the benefits just flat outweigh the down sides?
(please no one talk about lawful good being a downside, because it isn't... it's just characters that champion law more than good and evil are not common. I believe that is was makes Hellknights so intriguing to people).
Depending on the DM, Paladins don't need to be devoted to gods. Have to ask before you make that decision.
If you really want to be LN instead of LG, Steelblood/Untouchable Bloodrager would work. Even skip Untouchable and just use low level Bloodrager spells that don't need to scale like Cheetah's Sprint, Enlarge Person, Long Arm or True Strike.
Prestige classing is tough because you get so many good things for sticking to a base class. Oath against Chaos Paladin just made sense because you were aiming for Smite Chaos anyway and Divine Grace doesn't have any level based scaling.
Paladins are not by default beholden to any god.
There is an archetype specifically emphasizing connection to one god, but that is specific.
I believe Paizo even said you can have "Golarion Atheist" Paladin not worshipping any God.
None of their normal powers come from a God though,
so any worship of one (or many) gods is wholly optional and akin to a Ranger worshipping a God. (except 1 archetype)
I think there is two references to "their god" but I believe those are artifacts of a previous version which emphasized that more.
While she may adventure with good or neutral allies, a paladin avoids working with evil characters or with anyone who consistently offends her moral code. Under exceptional circumstances, a paladin can ally with evil associates, but only to defeat what she believes to be a greater evil. A paladin should seek an atonement spell periodically during such an unusual alliance, and should end the alliance immediately should she feel it is doing more harm than good. A paladin may accept only henchmen, followers, or cohorts who are lawful good.
I am not sure how a Hellknight Paladin can resolve this as a good bit of the organization is evil (no, not all are, not even almost all). Hellknights adhere to law 1st and everything else is secondary. Worse, how does a Hellknight from Cheliax handle that as "evil" is the authority.
On a separate front, how does a paladin deal with not being aligned to a god? There are quite a few things in their abilities which are deity dependent.
Hellknights are not a part of the Chellish government. They are two separate entities, and do occasionally come to blows with one another. While they both have connections to Hell in some sense, they do not always see eye to eye with one another. Though as a lawful evil nation versus a lawful neutral organization, they do have agree more often than not.
As far as paladins specifically in the hellknights, you have to be a member of particular orders which will work better. Order of the godclaw is one of those, and is likely to accommodate paladins by not having them work with those of evil alignment.
Also, none of the normal paladin abilities are deity specific. Not smite evil, not lay on hands, not mercies, not divine grace. Nothing.
I think hellknights work as a mercenaries a lot, I am pretty sure this is mentioned in a magnimar writeup.
Fighter or paladin base is fine as well, here are a couple idea builds:
AoO Fighter:
AoO Fighter
Human fighter (two-handed fighter) 5/Hellknight 5/Champion 2 (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Player's Guide 108)
LG Medium humanoid (human)
Init +8; Senses Perception +13
Aura aura of law
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Defense
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AC 26, touch 13, flat-footed 24 (+12 armor, +1 deflection, +2 Dex, +1 natural)
hp 109 (10d10+45)
Fort +12, Ref +7, Will +7
Defensive Abilities hard to kill
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Offense
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Speed 40 ft.
Melee +1 flying blade +13/+8 (1d12+22/×3)
Space 5 ft.; Reach 10 ft.
Special Attacks mythic power (7/day, surge +1d6), overhand chop, shattering strike, smite chaos, weapon training (flails +1)
Hellknight Spell-Like Abilities (CL 0th; concentration +0)
At will—detect chaos
6/day—discern lies
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Statistics
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Str 21, Dex 14, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 16
Base Atk +10; CMB +12 (+13 sunder); CMD 28 (29 vs. sunder)
Feats Combat Reflexes, Cornugon Smash, Dazzling Display, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (flying blade), Improved Initiative, Iron Will, Power Attack[M], Shatter Defenses[M], Weapon Focus (flying blade)
Skills Acrobatics -1 (+3 to jump), Climb +6, Intimidate +16, Knowledge (planes) +8, Perception +13, Swim +6
Languages Common
SQ agile feet (3/day), amazing initiative, discipline ability (pentamic faith), domain (travel), force of will ability (force of will - compulsion), Hellknight armor, Hellknight order (order of the godclaw)
Other Gear +3 Hellknight plate, +1 flying blade, amulet of natural armor +1, belt of physical perfection +2, cloak of resistance +2, headband of alluring charisma +2, ring of protection +1, silver smite bracelet, 150 gp
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Special Abilities
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Agile Feet (3/day) (Su) For 1 rd, you ignore difficult terrain.
Amazing Initiative (1/round) (Ex) As a free action, use 1 power to gain an extra standard action (can't be used to cast a spell).
Aura of Law (Ex) The power of a Hellknight's aura of law (see the detect law spell) is equal to his total character level.
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Cornugon Smash When you damage an opponent with a Power Attack, you may make an immediate Intimidate check as a free action to attempt to demoralize your opponent.
Dazzling Display (Flying blade) Intimidate check to demoralize can affect those within 30' who see you.
Detect Chaos (At will) (Sp) You can use Detect Chaos at will (as the spell).
Discern Lies (6/day) (Sp) At 2nd level, a Hellknight can use discern lies as a spell-like ability a number of times per day equal to 3 plus his Charisma modifier. His caster level equals his total character level.
Ever Ready (+2) (Ex) Add tier to AoO attack & damage rolls, make AoO while flat-footed.
Fleet Charge (Ex) As a swift action, use 1 power to move speed & attack (+2 bonus, bypass all DR).
Force of Will - Compulsion +2 (Ex) +2 save vs. compulsion spells.
Hard to Kill (Ex) Automatically stabilize when dying, and only die at neg Con x 2.
Hellknight Armor 2 (Ex) Hellknight Armor -2 check penalty, +2 max DEX.
Hellknight Domain (Travel) Granted Powers: You are an explorer and find enlightenment in the simple joy of travel, be it by foot or conveyance or magic. Increase your base speed by 10 feet.
Mythic Power (7/day, Surge +1d6) Use this power to perform your mythic abilities.
Overhand Chop (Ex) Single attacks with two-handed weapons receive double STR bonus.
Pentamic Faith (Ex) Prepare spells from many additional domains.
Power Attack [Mythic] Use 1 power to eliminate attack penalties of Power attack for 1 min.
Shatter Defenses [Mythic] Foe affected by Shatter Defenses are flat footed vs. all attacks (not just yours).
Shattering Strike +1 (Ex) +1 Sunder and damage vs. objects.
Silver smite bracelet This heavy silver bracelet is etched with icons of purity, fidelity, chastity, and honor, and glows with a soft white light whenever its owner prays. The wearer of this bracelet treats her paladin level as 4 higher than normal for the purpose of her smite evil class feature.
Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Item, align weapon, creator must be a paladin; Cost 8,000 gp
Smite Chaos (2/day) (Su) +3 to hit, +5 to damage, +3 deflection bonus to AC when used.
Surge (1d6) (Su) Use 1 power to increase any d20 roll by the listed amount.
Weapon Training (Flails) +1 (Ex) +1 Attack, Damage, CMB, CMD with Flails
I went for an aoo/ intimidate build with a funny weapon, the flying blade, you could do it with a regular weapon instead, whatever. There is also an error in the build, it is supposed to be bracers of the avenging knight, NOT silver smite gauntlets
paladin:
Paladin Guy
Human Hellknight 5/paladin (oath against chaos) 5/Champion 2 (Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Inner Sea Combat)
LG Medium humanoid (human)
Init +10; Senses Perception +13
Aura courage (10 ft.), aura of law
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Defense
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AC 26, touch 13, flat-footed 24 (+12 armor, +1 deflection, +2 Dex, +1 natural)
hp 109 (10d10+45)
Fort +16, Ref +11, Will +12; +2 vs. death
Defensive Abilities hard to kill; Immune disease, fear
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Offense
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Speed 40 ft.
Melee +1 flying blade +9/+4 (1d12+7/×3)
Space 5 ft.; Reach 10 ft.
Special Attacks mythic power (7/day, surge +1d6), smite chaos, smite chaos
Hellknight Spell-Like Abilities (CL 0th; concentration +0)
At will—detect chaos
7/day—discern lies
Paladin Spell-Like Abilities (CL 2nd; concentration +6)
At will—detect chaos
Paladin (Oath against Chaos) Spells Prepared (CL 2nd; concentration +6)
1st—divine favor, liberating command[UC]
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Statistics
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Str 18, Dex 15, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 18
Base Atk +10; CMB +14; CMD 27
Feats Combat Reflexes, Fey Foundling[ISWG], Greater Mercy[UM], Improved Initiative[M], Lunge, Power Attack[M]
Skills Acrobatics -1 (+3 to jump), Climb +2, Intimidate +17, Knowledge (planes) +8, Perception +13, Swim +2
Languages Common
SQ agile feet (3/day), amazing initiative, discipline ability (pentamic faith), divine bond (weapon +1, 1/day), domain (travel), force of will ability (force of will - compulsion), Hellknight armor, Hellknight order (order of the godclaw), lay on hands 6/day (2d6), mercy (fatigued), order of good
Other Gear +3 Hellknight plate, +1 flying blade, amulet of natural armor +1, belt of physical perfection +2, bracers of the avenging knight, cloak of resistance +2, headband of alluring charisma +2, ring of protection +1, 150 gp
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Special Abilities
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Agile Feet (3/day) (Su) For 1 rd, you ignore difficult terrain.
Amazing Initiative (1/round) (Ex) As a free action, use 1 power to gain an extra standard action (can't be used to cast a spell).
Aura of Courage +4 (10 ft.) (Su) Allies in aura gain a morale bonus to saves vs. fear.
Aura of Law (Ex) The power of a Hellknight's aura of law (see the detect law spell) is equal to his total character level.
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Detect Chaos (At will) (Sp) You can use Detect Chaos at will (as the spell).
Detect Chaos (At will) (Sp) You can use detect chaos at will (as the spell).
Discern Lies (7/day) (Sp) At 2nd level, a Hellknight can use discern lies as a spell-like ability a number of times per day equal to 3 plus his Charisma modifier. His caster level equals his total character level.
Divine Bond (Weapon +1, 5 mins, 1/day) (Sp) Weapon shines with light and gains enhancement bonuses or chosen properties.
Ever Ready (+2) (Ex) Add tier to AoO attack & damage rolls, make AoO while flat-footed.
Fey Foundling Magical healing works better on you
Fleet Charge (Ex) As a swift action, use 1 power to move speed & attack (+2 bonus, bypass all DR).
Force of Will - Compulsion +2 (Ex) +2 save vs. compulsion spells.
Greater Mercy Lay on hands heals extra hit points if the target doesn't need a mercy
Hard to Kill (Ex) Automatically stabilize when dying, and only die at neg Con x 2.
Hellknight Armor 2 (Ex) Hellknight Armor -2 check penalty, +2 max DEX.
Hellknight Domain (Travel) Granted Powers: You are an explorer and find enlightenment in the simple joy of travel, be it by foot or conveyance or magic. Increase your base speed by 10 feet.
Immunity to Disease You are immune to diseases.
Immunity to Fear (Ex) You are immune to all fear effects.
Improved Initiative [Mythic] When rolling initiative, use 1 power to treat the roll as a natural 20.
Lay on Hands (2d6 hit points, 6/day) (Su) As a standard action (swift on self), touch channels positive energy and applies mercies.
Lunge Can increase reach by 5 ft, but take -2 to AC for 1 rd.
Mercy (Fatigued) (Su) When you use your lay on hands ability, it also removes the fatigued condition.
Mythic Power (7/day, Surge +1d6) Use this power to perform your mythic abilities.
Order of Good (Su) Spend lay on hands to smite evil instead of chaos.
Pentamic Faith (Ex) Prepare spells from many additional domains.
Power Attack [Mythic] Use 1 power to eliminate attack penalties of Power attack for 1 min.
Smite Chaos (2/day) (Su) +4 to hit, +9 to damage, +4 deflection bonus to AC when used.
Smite Chaos (2/day) (Su) +4 to hit, +9 to damage, +4 deflection bonus to AC when used.
Surge (1d6) (Su) Use 1 power to increase any d20 roll by the listed amount.
Here is the paladin build. I went travel domain with both because travel domain is insane, letting you get dimensional agility eventually
CWheezy those builds look awesome! Quick question. Is there a reason you went with a high dex since Hellknight armor only allows a max dex bonus of +1?
Hell Knight Plate
These distinctive suits of armor are a special type of masterwork full plate that, when worn by a character with levels in the Hell Knight prestige class, grants additional effects.
Hell Knight Armor Scales with Hell Knight Level. Like Fighter Armor Training
At 2nd level, a Hell Knight earns the right to wear Hell Knight armor (below). While wearing this armor, the Hell Knight reduces the armor check penalty by 1, increases the maximum Dexterity bonus allowed by 1, and moves at full speed.
So it looks like we are finally going to play. I am taking your guys advice and going with a paladin. A tielfing from Cheliax, what feats should I take?
Personally I'm fond of maxing intimidate, and picking up Power Attack and Cornugan's Smash when I can. Combined with one of the Hellknight's moves you can AOE Frighten enemies.
I also usually pick up Dazing Attack as soon as I qualify.
Cornugan Smash would be a difficult feat to take a 1st level for a paladin. Though I like the idea of being an intimidation hellknight.
Fey Foundling seems awesome, but I am not sure if I should go that route. Originally I was thing of taking Antagonize to help tank for the party. hmm...
