What limits the amount of objects that can be dropped?

[FrodoOf9Fingers]

So, a player is standing above the head of a very powerful guard. Combat is already ensued, but the player is undetected. He decides he wants to drop a bunch of objects on the head of the bad guy. He currently holding a bunch of various one-handed weapons (which, per the rules, count as object size small). How many can he drop in a single round?

A. Only has many as a full attack, since he is making ranged touch attacks.
B. As many as he has free actions, since dropping an item is a free action.

Bonus question:
If he dumped out his bag of holding, is there a limit then?

[Cavall]

He isn't making touch attacks. He is making attacks.

The answer is as many as he has attacks against the opponents ac.

[Orfamay Quest]

Yeah, he's not "dropping items," he's making attacks. Unless he doesn't care whether he hits the guy's head or not.

I'd rule that he can only drop what he's carrying -- e.g. if he has a rock in each hand, he can drop two rocks, but can't pick any more up. If he has a single cinder block in both hands, he can drop it, but can't pick up another one. If he has a whole bunch of "readied" items (like arrows in a quiver or throwing knives in a bandolier), he could draw up to his number of attacks, just like an archer could.

Now, if he's carrying a box with a complete set of service-for-twelve china in it, he can turn the box upside down and each of the 60-odd objects will fall, but they won't all be aimed at the target, and he won't get attack rolls for each one. The same would apply if he emptied a bag of holding.

[Cavall]

If you like, at best said China set could be said to be a splash attack against his square (ac of 5) and do damage as an improvised weapon, singular, rules for damage already in the core.

Which would be about it.

[FrodoOf9Fingers]

Cavall wrote:

He isn't making touch attacks. He is making attacks.

The answer is as many as he has attacks against the opponents ac.

I was going off the rules for falling objects:

Falling Objects wrote:

Dropping an object on a creature requires a ranged touch attack. Such attacks generally have a range increment of 20 feet. If an object falls on a creature (instead of being thrown), that creature can make a DC 15 Reflex save to halve the damage if he is aware of the object. Falling objects that are part of a trap use the trap rules instead of these general guidelines.

The china set altogether would be a small object methinks, but unloading his bag of holding full of 30-40 shortspears would be 30-40 small objects, that each would do 2d6 points of damage.

[Orfamay Quest]

FrodoOf9Fingers wrote:

Cavall wrote:

He isn't making touch attacks. He is making attacks.

The answer is as many as he has attacks against the opponents ac.

I was going off the rules for falling objects:

Falling Objects wrote:

Dropping an object on a creature requires a ranged touch attack. Such attacks generally have a range increment of 20 feet. If an object falls on a creature (instead of being thrown), that creature can make a DC 15 Reflex save to halve the damage if he is aware of the object. Falling objects that are part of a trap use the trap rules instead of these general guidelines.

The china set altogether would be a small object methinks, but unloading his bag of holding full of 30-40 shortspears would be 30-40 small objects, that each would do 2d6 points of damage.

Except that > 90% of them would not be aimed to hit the bad guy. In fact, none of the spears would be aimed to hit the bad guy, since they're basically being dumped out of a bag.

I'd think that spears would be among the worst possible things to use in this instance, actually. They're probably not going to be nicely lined up point-up in the bag, so you'd essentially be dumping a collection of randomly-oriented sticks on someone's head, with the approximate effect of trying to dump branches out of a lawn bag. The chance of hitting with any specific part of the spear (like, the pointy bit) is almost nil.

I also wonder how 40 shortspears got in the bag without allowing "sharp objects [to] pierce it (from inside or outside)," with the result that "the bag immediately ruptures and is ruined, and all contents are lost forever." Major downer, that....

[FrodoOf9Fingers]

It was hypothetical, though I could see said spears having leather sheathes cover the heads. The thought isn't about hitting with the right part, but rather just hitting, and since they count as small objects, they could potentially do 2d6 damage -if- they hit.

Which comes to the oringinal question, in order to invoke the touch attack, does the player use a free action to "drop an object" or his iterative attacks?

[Cavall]

Well let's look at it this way. Pulling something out of the bag is a move action. So at most two items could be dropped.

However you're correct that it could be turned inside out (given no action is listed default to standard.)

But dumping it out upside down doesn't mean you're aiming it. That would be impossible as all items come out at once. So I would state again such an action would be more an attack against a square than a person.

So ac 5 and reflex to save for half as I stated before.

So at best just easier to hit the target by lowering the number.

[Orfamay Quest]

FrodoOf9Fingers wrote:

It was hypothetical, though I could see said spears having leather sheathes cover the heads. The thought isn't about hitting with the right part, but rather just hitting, and since they count as small objects, they could potentially do 2d6 damage -if- they hit.

Which comes to the oringinal question, in order to invoke the touch attack, does the player use a free action to "drop an object" or his iterative attacks?

Iterative attack, since it's aimed. "Drop an object" refers to something where you simply let go because you need to free up the hand for another purpose, and you hope it doesn't break when it hits the ground.

[littlehewy]

Yeah, if you're making a ranged touch attack, I think the implication is that you're using the attacking rules, i.e. a standard action for one attack, or a full-round action for a full attack with all the iteratives.

[DM_Blake]

Orfamay Quest wrote:

Iterative attack, since it's aimed. "Drop an object" refers to something where you simply let go because you need to free up the hand for another purpose, and you hope it doesn't break when it hits the ground.

And

littlehewy wrote:

Yeah, if you're making a ranged touch attack, I think the implication is that you're using the attacking rules, i.e. a standard action for one attack, or a full-round action for a full attack with all the iteratives.

Are correct.

Dropping objects is on a free action if you're just letting go with no care about where they land. You're opening your hand. Nothing more. Not aiming, not sighting, not even really thinking about where it goes.

The falling object rule quoted above says it specifically is a Touch Attack. The key word there is not "Touch" (though it's good to know) but rather it is "Attack". Yep, "Attack".

So the real question is not how many free drop object actions can he take per round, but rather, how many "Attacks" can he make per round.

[Rub-Eta]

Drop? Infinite, as it's a free action to drop.

However, as you mentioned, he wants to drop one-handed weapons as small objects. He can't retrive or hold infinite amounts of weapons in one round.
And even if one argues that one can hold more than one one-handed weapon in one hand, though not be able to "use" them correctly as weapons, they're still just small sized objects. Dropping one would probably not do that much more than a regular unarmed strike, 1d3 none-leathal damage. And probably not even that if he doesn't make sure they hit, which is an attack action and not a free action.