ezrider23 Owner - October Country Comics, LLC. |
Hello folks,
I'm looking to make a new PFS character and would like to focus entirely on Battlefield Control and Party Buffs. I'd like to try and stay with CORE classes as much as possible. I have other option available but i like the Core classes and races. I know this may be better served in the PFS forum but i come here to you sagely experts of character buildery.
Q- Which class works best for this? I'm thinking Wizard but i'm open to other thoughts?
I'm not overly concerned with contributing damage myself, i'd like to make the party better murderhobos if i can. I'd also like to stay away from SUMMONING. I just don't like adding critters to fights and monster book keeping. Adding buffs and conjuring terrain features is the most paperwork i want to do, but i want to be the BEST at those things. Having all the other useful PFS bits would be nice as well. Skills and what not.
I really look forward to reading and responding to any and all advice. Mind you i've drifted very far from any "New" Pathfinder stuff as i've just not been keeping up to date.
calagnar |
You can be very effective at one or the other. Due to resources it is not very effective for one character to try and do both.
Best buffer will be Bard. However their only ok at battle field control.
Best battle field control Wizard, or Sorcerer. However their only good at buffing.
Over all Wizard or Sorcerer will do best trying to do both. The Sorcerer with the right spell list will pull a head of the wizard due to castings per day. Arcane bloodline will get you one extra spell on top of that. Along with metamagic special ability's. Bards just don't have the spells per day to make them effective caster base.
Best option IMO..
Sorcerer Bloodline: Arcane starting Cha 20
Trait: Magical Knack: Slow (Persistent Spell Slow as a 4th level slot)
Feet's: Spell Focus, Improved Spell Focus Transmutation, and Conjuration. Both have an extensive list of battle field control spells. Metamagic feet Persistent Spell.
Caster level 8: Persistent Spell Slow DC 24 Will roll twice.
With spell focus, improved spell focus, Bloodline Arcana power, and Cha 26(22+4item).
RainyDayNinja RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16 |
Buffing will of course be done very well with a Bard. They don't have much in the way of battlefield control, but they do have illusions. If used well, they can duplicate the effects of control spells like the various wall of X spells, and so on.
I enjoyed my conjuration (but not summoning) focused Cleric, who I played up to 12 in PFS. With the Caves subdomain, you get the various pit spells as domain spells, and there are some great Conjuration control spells on the Cleric list, such as obscuring mist, cloud of seasickness, and wall of stone. It also has some great save-or-lose spells like hallucinogenic smoke, chains of light, and plane shift. The Evangelist archetype will also give you Inspire Courage like a bard, so you get extra buffing capabilities.
Taenia |
I would suggest playing a Diviner Wizard. Focus on buffing initiative and getting spells that debuff/control the enemy early and move on. I have a friend playing one of these right now and his wizard makes GM's cringe.
Trait Reactionary
Stats High Int, Good Dex/Con, dump str
Diviner wizard always goes in the Surprise Round. High Init means going first in the surprise round.
Focus on Control Spells:
Stinking Cloud
Euphoric Cloud
Sleep/Color Spray
Slow
Create Pit
etc...
Complete your spell layout with utility spells and buffs, haste, greater magic weapon, spider climb also consider communal spells they can change the dynamic of many encounters. Communal Resist Energy and Communal Spider Climb are two of my favorites.
Caryth Derellis |
Honestly, I know you wanted to stick to core classes, but the witch IMO is THE BEST control class. They are great buffers and can eve heal when need be.
Humans are great because you can pick extra hex and gain another hex for free at first level.
Misfortune Hex, Evil Eye, Slumber, are all WONDERFUL control/debuff.
At early levels I have used Mud Ball, glitterdust, and other control spells to bolster my control efforts. If you have a grappler in the party, have them grapply and use the spell Limp Lash to totally shut down enemies...
You can also get Fortune, Ward, Healing, etc. to give excellent buffs.
Be sure to pick up the feat that allows you to cast hexes additional times per day on targets that resist them.
Rolling on the Floor Cackling provides a really get overview of various witch builds and abilities.
ezrider23 Owner - October Country Comics, LLC. |
Caryth Derellis wrote:Honestly, I know you wanted to stick to core classes, but the witch IMO is THE BEST control class. They are great buffers and can eve heal when need be.
Humans are great because you can pick extra hex and gain another hex for free at first level.
Misfortune Hex, Evil Eye, Slumber, are all WONDERFUL control/debuff.
At early levels I have used Mud Ball, glitterdust, and other control spells to bolster my control efforts. If you have a grappler in the party, have them grapply and use the spell Limp Lash to totally shut down enemies...
You can also get Fortune, Ward, Healing, etc. to give excellent buffs.
Be sure to pick up the feat that allows you to cast hexes additional times per day on targets that resist them.
Rolling on the Floor Cackling provides a really get overview of various witch builds and abilities.
Witch is a class that has intrigued me. I'll need to dig deeper. If you or anyone else has more advice on the Witch i'm listening. I'll look into reading the Witch Guide over in the Guide to Guides since they are alway chhock full of really useful tid-bits.
Caryth Derellis |
Generally, you can use their spell selection to debuff or control multiple enemies, while the hexes are generally very effective at shutting down one particular/powerful enemy. Of course, there are exceptions.
If you pick a witch, don't multiclass, and you NEED the Cakcle Hex, which you should use as much as you can - to extend the duration of your hex buffs and hex debuffs.
I also would suggest for a point-buy to DUMNP cha and str.
MAX out Int, have decent Con, and average wisdom and you should be good as long as your group and your control efforts can effectively protect you more often than not. The reason you want to max out INT is to improve your spell pool, and to maximize your DCs. If your hexes fail, your round is wasted.
Gregory Connolly |
Bard is probably the best at this, depending on what you mean by control. Wizard can be devastating as well but it is a lot rougher at levels 1 to 4.
I would recommend against Cleric or Sorcerer because you said you wanted skill points and those classes use intelligence as a dump stat (Bards do too sometimes but 6+ skill points/level and versatile performance more than makes up for it.)
Hideous Laughter and Blindness/Deafness cause lots of problems right out of the CRB. Cacophonous Call and Ear Piercing Scream are also favorites. Don't let anyone tell you Bards make lousy casters. They won't have the spells/day of a Sorcerer but they can use bardic music to make up the difference and there are some choice spells like Good Hope that nobody else gets.
Wizards tend to focus more on messing with the actual battlefield rather than messing up the opponents, though they are good at that too. Metamagic feats are one big way to mess people up an Wizards are some of the best at it. Look into Persistent Spell, Dazing Spell, Sickening Spell, Toppling Spell, Rime Spell and the rest. I find Divination (Foresight), Evocation (Admixture), Conjuration (Teleportation), and Void to be the strongest, but most of them are cool and useful.
Vrog Skyreaver |
Honestly, I would go with bard. It lets you fill in gaps in your party fairly well, you lack a lot of the traps (hp and ac) that other arcane casters, especially in the early game, suffer from. Plus you can fill in if you have no healer at the table (an all too common experience in pfs). There are a ton of solid bard archetypes too, which is definitely a boon.
ezrider23 Owner - October Country Comics, LLC. |
I think it's coming down to either a
1. Diviner Wizard with a very high Initiative and Battlefield Control or
2. Witch with some battlefield control and Debuffing or lastly a
3. Vanilla Bard. Either Reach with Combat Reflexes coupled with Helpful and Body Guard or Ranged.
We have Bards galore, of one stripe or another, in our small PFS community but have absolutely NO Wizards and only one Witch.
I've never played a Wizard long enough to really get fully immersed in the world of Meta-Magics. Therefore i'm leaning heavily towards the Wizard. Witches Hexes seem really cool though.