Bestiary experts needed: trying to find low-CR fire monsters to replace goblins in Vault of Larin Karr


Advice


I'm running the old D&D 3.5 module Vault of Larin Karr. The PCs have come to the location of the fire giant's cave. This cave has goblins as employees, basically. The problem is that the environmental effects (heat damage, smoke inhalation) would kill every single goblin there, since none of them are listed with any fire protection/resistance/immunity at all. They're just normal goblins. Also, since I have 6 players and each has a level 9 PC (also 1 tiger companion, 1 roc companion, and 1 leadership cohort), I do not think the goblins can challenge them, even though some have class levels and all are supposed to converge on the PCs at once.

SO. My friends, let's geek out on Bestiary monsters. Here is the list of monsters in the fight. What can I swap them for? I have every Bestiary and the Tome of Horrors book #4. I'll apply templates too, if you think one is particularly apt.


  • level 5 goblin cleric
  • standard goblins x8 (amusingly, they insta-surrender)
  • level 2 goblin fighter (melee) x6
  • level 2 goblin fighter (archery) x2
  • fire mephit x2
  • level 6 goblin rogue

I think I'd like to keep the fire mephits, since they work with the fire theme, but what about the other guys? I can change the numbers of enemies, the monsters themselves, whether they have levels, etc. However, all the monsters should be OK in an area that does 1d6 heat damage over time. If they can see through smoke or breathe smoke, that's cool too, but I'll handwave that issue if you've got a cool fire monster for me.


Easy solutions:

Give every Goblin Flame Heart as a Feat (or Bonus Feat).

Turn the Rogue into a Vivisectionist Alchemist and take the Goblin Favored Class Bonus. Gives them +1 Fire resistance every level they take it. With Flame Heart and 1 of those they're immune.

Make them Kobolds all with the Dragon-Scaled alternate racial trait. For red dragons, of course, which gives them Fire Resistance 5.


I would give the goblins some fire resistance somehow; if I was running this, I'd just hand-wave it and say they're immune to the local environmental effects.

I also like Rynjin's idea of switching the goblins to red -dragon-scaled kobolds. If you're running this game in Golarion, that might be more thematically appropriate, given how insane goblins are.

As for this not being a challenge: Sometimes it's good to have an easy encounter. (APL-2 or so). It gives the players a chance to feel awesome.

One thing I like to do is have the PCs encounter monsters that had been a huge challenge earlier, that now... aren't. (e.g an ogre is a very challenging encounter for a second-level party. Not so much when the party is sixth!)

Sczarni

Without too much work, you can add a simple Fiendish Template to all goblins or use fire-resistant kobolds as was suggested above. I am not sure how those goblins are supposed to challenge lv9 PCs though, even with class levels. It's also fairly likely that your PCs will have Resist Energy up and ready, negating most fire hazards and effects.

There are some monsters also like magma elemental, magma ooze, magmin, fire beetles and some sort of lava worm (can't recall exact name). There is also Magma Creature Template (+1 CR) and Elemental-Infused Template (+1 CR).

Adam


Azers work as race. Enslave some of them.

Sczarni

It depends on why the fire giant has minions, and who would be willing to serve him (or unable to escape).

Azers are a good choice, as mentioned above. Salamanders might also be a good choice, if you think the fire giant is likely to be able to summon and subjugate some. They also have a higher CR than goblins.

If you want to push the idea of the fire giant as having summoned servants, devils also tend to have fire immunity. A contract devil (phistophilus) or accomplice devil (hesperian) would definitely have their own motivations for being there. They also have the advantage that they don't rely on fire as a weapon, since (as mentioned earlier) the PCs are definitely going to have countermeasures enabled against fire damage.

If you'd rather just say that the fire giant is enslaving creatures it encounters, then ifrits are good vehicles for class levels. Maybe there's a local village with a lot of efreeti blood in the ancestry, and ifrits go on a pilgrimmage to serve the giant for a tenure?


Thank you guys! I think I'll be using pretty much every suggestion! Well, maybe not devils/demons, but otherwise everything else sounds very appropriate. Azers can replace many of the low-level goblins, and salamanders and other critters can be more of a high level challenge.


Dropping the Fiery Template from the Master Summoners Handbook (+1 CR loosely on par power wise with Celestial/Fiendish) would allow you to make a fire version of any non-fire creature fairly easy also BTW.

Hope it helps.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Advice / Bestiary experts needed: trying to find low-CR fire monsters to replace goblins in Vault of Larin Karr All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Advice