Fighter Archetype: Archer, Trick Shot, and Feint

[YttriumDervish]

The entry for this ability states, among other things, that the Archer can choose to use a bow to Feint in combat. It also states that using a bow for various combat maneuvers is at a -4 CMB. Feint is not technically a combat maneuver, and doesn't use CMB. Does the -4 penalty apply to the Bluff check for success, or is Feint unpenalized?

[Opuk0]

It does not

[YttriumDervish]

And, just for clarity's sake, this still has to be within melee range to function, right? I can't, for example, feint from 15 feet away, but instead is a modification to the phrasing, such that "melee attack" becomes "attack with a bow at melee range. "

[Opuk0]

There is not actually a range limitation on feinting, benefiting from feinting however is exclusively melee.

With ranged feint, the goal is being able to benefit from your own feint at range.

[YttriumDervish]

That's what I was hoping for, but there still has to be some range limit. It doesn't make sense to Feint at 110 feet with a longbow. 30' is the limit for sneak attacks and Focused Shot precision damage, so that seems reasonable to me, save one caveat.

The idea of a feint is that you do some action that makes the enemy in combat with you believe that you are doing something other than attacking him. If I'm 30' away, he's probably paying more attention to the Barbarian or somesuch other melee dude.

And on the same note, if he's engaged in melee, and I'm 30' away, I'm not threatening him, and he's likely not watching me that closely anyway.

[Opuk0]

Far as I know there's not really a limit

I'd try not to worry too much about the how or why, don't look a gift horse in the mouth as they say

[Cavall]

If 30 feet makes you comfortable then 30 feet isn't unreasonable. But I don't think there's a limit currently other than sight.

[Archaeik]

The 30ft limiter is right there in the Trick Shot description

Archer wrote:

Trick Shot (Ex): At 3rd level, an archer can choose one of the following combat maneuvers or actions: disarm, feint, or sunder. He can perform this action with a bow against any target within 30 feet, with a –4 penalty to his CMB. Every four levels beyond 3rd, he may choose an additional trick shot to learn. These maneuvers use up arrows as normal.

RAW Feint normally only benefits melee attacks, but it's very likely the intent here is to expand it to attacks from your bow as well even though it is not mentioned.

Additionally, feint doesn't actually describe a specific action you take other than to say it's a Bluff check, but as a combat action it's implied that you need to be close enough to acutely distract your foe. Whether this is strictly "melee range" is a bit unclear (as very large creatures have significant reach), but I'd be surprised if it's intended to be available for use at ranges greater than 30ft since that seems to be the standard for many actions. (Colossal-tall creatures using a reach weapons notwithstanding)

[YttriumDervish]

Archaeik wrote:

The 30ft limiter is right there in the Trick Shot description

I couldn't tell you how many times I've read that and skipped over that sentence each time.

Thank you.