Really Paizo?
Are you suggesting paizo shouldn't make an evil AP ever, because there was a successful 3rd party evil AP?
Are you suggesting paizo shouldn't make an evil AP ever, because there was a successful 3rd party evil AP?Really Paizo?
Well, to be fair, that was their entire reasoning for not doing actual psionics, because Dreamscarred Press basically covered everything for them.
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The fact we got an evil campaign before we got a dragon themed, fey/first world, dwarf themed, distant worlds, Arcadia, dark tapestry, Southern Garund, dinosaur/megafauna, lovecraftian, Vudra, Linnorm Kings, Azlanti/aboleth, Sarusan, under the sea, or a real Tian Xia AP is disappointing.
Ultimate Intrigue sounds interesting though the sound of the new class doesn't do anything for me.
I am super excited about B5 and can't wait to find out more.
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Well, to be fair, that was their entire reasoning for not doing actual psionics, because Dreamscarred Press basically covered everything for them.Are you suggesting paizo shouldn't make an evil AP ever, because there was a successful 3rd party evil AP?
Not the entire reason, they also disliked the points system.
Still, they couldn't do a direct translation of psionics but they can do psychic magic. The AP will not just be a copy of Way of the Wicked.
Edit: Sarusan is likely not getting an AP for ages... None of the developers care for it, which as an Australian I find rather disappointing.
I am looking forward to these products but would have really liked a Jurassic park/Kong AP.
I'll never say no to a new Bestiary, and I'm glad that the psychic non-Golarion monsters are getting a space. As for Ultimate Intrigue, I'm going to withhold judgment until the playtest opens up, which I hope can be soon.
The Annunaki is a different alien race then the Greys, they showed art for both.
After seeing the art for the strix and ratfolk there another race in between but I couldn't tell what it was. Does anyone know what race it was?
Where is this grey and annunaki (or any other bestiary 5 artwork)??
I'll never say no to a new Bestiary, and I'm glad that the psychic non-Golarion monsters are getting a space. As for Ultimate Intrigue, I'm going to withhold judgment until the playtest opens up, which I hope can be soon.
The playtest will most likely be only for the vigilante base class, which might amount to no more than maybe 10 pages of a 256-page-book.
Why do I have the feeling that the Hell's Vengeance AP has you play the Thrune agents coming into action as a result of the events of Hell's Rebels?
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Why do I have the feeling that the Hell's Vengeance AP has you play the Thrune agents coming into action as a result of the events of Hell's Rebels?
Hopefully because that's what is going to happen...?
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My money is on Hell's Vengeance being an alternate take on Hell's Rebels, basically being two "opposing" APs starting from the same point, rather than Vengeance being a sequel.
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Well, to be fair, that was their entire reasoning for not doing actual psionics, because Dreamscarred Press basically covered everything for them.Are you suggesting paizo shouldn't make an evil AP ever, because there was a successful 3rd party evil AP?Really Paizo?
While I have nothing against an adventurepath where you have to play evil characters, it has been suggested that you would play followers of Asmodeus in this one. You know, just like in Way of the Wicked. And I'm sure that Paizo can make something awesome out of this that makes all us fangirls squeal, (Like Occult Adventures) I just wished they would have chosen any deity but Asmodeus.
I am looking a little less enthused for
Ultimate Intrigue...rules for social combat and verbal dueling seems to me to always break the flow of Role-Playing than actually helping it in any system that I have played. It also means that it can now be number crunched...which I am not happy to see. But I will try to keep a open mind.
Though the other stuff looks like what I am hoping for...hopefully it will also contained archetypes for existing classes.
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My feeling is that it won't be in Cheliax at all, but in Andoran. That the vengeance is the destruction of the nation of freedom.
This would make the most sense. An Andoran-based AP otherwise is kind of hard to run, since so much of the country is stable/good.
I'm not very interested in Cheliax or evil campaigns, so I'm looking at at least a year's worth of APs I'm not excited about. :|
We've all been there probably. For me, for example, it was the year with Carrion Crown and Jade Regent.
My feeling is that it won't be in Cheliax at all, but in Andoran. That the vengeance is the destruction of the nation of freedom.This would make the most sense. An Andoran-based AP otherwise is kind of hard to run, since so much of the country is stable/good.
Except for maybe the evil corporation oppressing and exploiting the populace.
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Do social combat and verbal dueling mean that I'll finally be able to create my Ace Attorney-based character?
Also, Batman!
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While I have nothing against an adventurepath where you have to play evil characters, it has been suggested that you would play followers of Asmodeus in this one. You know, just like in Way of the Wicked. And I'm sure that Paizo can make something awesome out of this that makes all us fangirls squeal, (Like Occult Adventures) I just wished they would have chosen any deity but Asmodeus.
I don't know about *any* deity, since Lamashtu and Rovagug seem a bit over the top, but a Norgorber-centric AP could get super-political and intrigue-y, if it focused more on the Gray Master / Reaper of Reputation / Blackfingers angles and less on Father Skinsaw. That could be one heck of an urban / rogue-centric campaign, with plenty of room for other classes that fit hand-in-glove with Norgorbers interests, such as reputation-obsessed bards and toxin-crafting alchemists.
Urgathoa goes hand in hand with 'undead PCs,' and might go way too far for Paizo's comfort, and require some serious mechanical tinkering to make undead PCs that aren't applecart-upsetting.
Zon-Kuthon? Purging oneself of weakness to prepare for a great tribulation through self-mortification? "The world is pain, princess. Anybody who tells you different is selling something." I'm not totally into it, as the connections to body piercing, undead-loving druids, darkness and evil fey just haven't quite gelled for me yet. Still, seems more playable than CE followers of 'Guggie (break all the things!) or Lammy (have sex with all the things!).
My feeling is that it won't be in Cheliax at all, but in Andoran. That the vengeance is the destruction of the nation of freedom.
Ooh, that sounds pretty wicked!
The Wolfgang Baur link on the first page shows art for the Greys and Annunaki.
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Well, to be fair, that was their entire reasoning for not doing actual psionics, because Dreamscarred Press basically covered everything for them.Are you suggesting paizo shouldn't make an evil AP ever, because there was a successful 3rd party evil AP?
Not the entire reason, they also disliked the points system.
Still, they couldn't do a direct translation of psionics but they can do psychic magic. The AP will not just be a copy of Way of the Wicked.
Edit: Sarusan is likely not getting an AP for ages... None of the developers care for it, which as an Australian I find rather disappointing.
A Mad Max inspired module in Sarusan would be cool! :-)
The continuing the campaign article in the sixth volume ought to be real interesting at least. Also, it would be nice to be a GM rooting for the creatures for a change. At the very least I won't be as sad when I kill off one of the PCs. Although, the paladins really did have it coming...
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My money is on Hell's Vengeance being an alternate take on Hell's Rebels, basically being two "opposing" APs starting from the same point, rather than Vengeance being a sequel.
That would suck very hard. I would be extremely pissed if it is the exact opposite.
But i don´t think that.
Most likely Hell´s Rebel´s will culminate with a region of Cheliax being freed from the oppressive rule of House Thrune.
Hell´s Vengeance will either be a direct follow up where the chelish government will try to re-conquer the province OR it will be Cheliax attacking a direct neighbour to increase it´s holdings...
How is it vengeance if it's an attack on Andorran? Because it used to be part of the Chelish empire? It could send us to tons of places where Cheliax had holdings. Based on title alone it could be sending us to reclaim Sargava and wrangle dinosaurs.
Contributor
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Where is this grey and annunaki (or any other bestiary 5 artwork)??Here.
In regards to Asmodeus, I think he's probably one of the better choices if you're going to use one of the main evil deities as a possible theme for PCs. Most of the rest of them, you have to be at least a little insane to worship, save perhaps for some of Norgorber's aspects. Asmodeus, well, you just have to be ambitious. Or perhaps merely obedient.
Edit: Speaking of the Annunaki.
Based on that art, I'd go a little deeper.
Aliens.
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What if Hell's Vengeance is a PREQUEL to Hell's Rebels?
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Bestiary 4 had a lot of AP monsters included. I imagine Bestiary 5 could continue that tradition. But, honestly, I have enough monsters. I don't think I've even used Bestiary 4.
Little dissapointed Ultimate Intrigue will be coming out *after* Hell's Rebels is finished. It seems like those two would have worked well together.
This time difference is killing me. How long til the next informative semunar?!
My feeling is that it won't be in Cheliax at all, but in Andoran. That the vengeance is the destruction of the nation of freedom.
Of course, having the party be insurgents working within Andoran just further invites comparisons to Way of the Wicked...
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Bestiary 4 had a lot of AP monsters included. I imagine Bestiary 5 could continue that tradition. But, honestly, I have enough monsters. I don't think I've even used Bestiary 4.
Little dissapointed Ultimate Intrigue will be coming out *after* Hell's Rebels is finished. It seems like those two would have worked well together.
I probably won't (get to) start Hell's Rebels until well after its complete publication - plenty of time to see how Ultimate Intrigue looks. I understand your point, though. ^_^
I assume Ultimate Intrigue is a sibling of Ultimate Magic/Ultimate Combat. If that's the case then it's been a long time coming and I'm looking forward to it. I guess I should expect some social and skill alternate rules but I'd be more interested in more skillful archetypes of classes that don't normally get skills. My real hope is that charisma gets enough options where dumping it actually feels like a serious missed opportunity.
I'm kind of not looking forward to a new bestiary but its not like they're ever bad and each one means that I rarely have to build my own creatures.
I wasn't interested in either of the Hell APs but I still need to buy and play The Mummy's Mask and Iron Gods so my money's going somewhere. It is interesting that an evil campaign comes right after Hell's Rebels. I do see the appeal of dueling APs.
It seems our pleas for skills to get buffed and for classes to get more out of them have been listened to.
I'll have to check out the announcements myself, but I hope we see more of the alternate skills rules like those in Unchained.
I'm super excited to see the new release.
I think it's safe to assume that dream dragons will be our psychic dragons.
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Edit: Sarusan is likely not getting an AP for ages... None of the developers care for it, which as an Australian I find rather disappointing.A Mad Max inspired module in Sarusan would be cool! :-)
Mad Merisiel: Stabbity Road starring Mad Merisiel, Imperator Kyriosa, Immortan Gnoll, and of course, Hakon as the Doof Warrior.
I assume Ultimate Intrigue is a sibling of Ultimate Magic/Ultimate Combat. If that's the case then it's been a long time coming and I'm looking forward to it. I guess I should expect some social and skill alternate rules but I'd be more interested in more skillful archetypes of classes that don't normally get skills. My real hope is that charisma gets enough options where dumping it actually feels like a serious missed opportunity.
I'm kind of not looking forward to a new bestiary but its not like they're ever bad and each one means that I rarely have to build my own creatures.
I wasn't interested in either of the Hell APs but I still need to buy and play The Mummy's Mask and Iron Gods so my money's going somewhere. It is interesting that an evil campaign comes right after Hell's Rebels. I do see the appeal of dueling APs.
CHA AND INT to EVERYTHING!!!!
I hope it is done subtlety, with grace and finesse instead.
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Mad Merisiel: Stabbity Road starring Mad Merisiel, Imperator Kyriosa, Immortan Gnoll, and of course, Hakon as the Doof Warrior.Edit: Sarusan is likely not getting an AP for ages... None of the developers care for it, which as an Australian I find rather disappointing.A Mad Max inspired module in Sarusan would be cool! :-)
This vein of thought might inspire James Jacobs to consider a Sarusan AP sooner, rather than later! :)
Where is this grey and annunaki (or any other bestiary 5 artwork)??Here.
In regards to Asmodeus, I think he's probably one of the better choices if you're going to use one of the main evil deities as a possible theme for PCs. Most of the rest of them, you have to be at least a little insane to worship, save perhaps for some of Norgorber's aspects. Asmodeus, well, you just have to be ambitious. Or perhaps merely obedient.
Edit: Speaking of the Annunaki.
Based on that art, I'd go a little deeper.
** spoiler omitted **
I think you are right. The Paizo Blog now has a better picture posted. It looks pretty alien to me.
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Do social combat and verbal dueling mean that I'll finally be able to create my Ace Attorney-based character?
*Cues Music*
Phoenix Finder, Ace Attorney: Your Honor! There is a fatal contradiction in the witness' statement!
Totally not the murderer: W-What!? That's preposterous! Are you saying you can prove I am the murderer?
PF: Of course! Look at this evidence completely unrelated to the statement I presented it at!
Evil but not-so-evil prosecutor #27: What are you getting at, Finder?
PF: Remember the wounds on the victim?
TNTM: So what? We already confirmed that he was killed by a casting of Burning Hands. I'm a sorceress, and I don't know that spell!
PF: *Puts hands on the sides, smiles smugly* And that's were you're wrong! By an enormous leap of logic that also ignores the simple fact you could have used a scroll, I say that you are...*Slams hands on the table, cool close up*an Arcanist!
TNTM: U-Ugh!
*People in the courtroom starts to talk*
*Three gavel hits*
Dwarf Judge with a kick-**s beard: Order! Order!
EBNEP#27: That doesn't prove anything! What's her motive?
TNTM: Yeah, what's my motive?
Judge: Can the defense prove what her motive was?
Medium that dumped INT and WIS to 3: Gee Nick, we have to prove her motive!
EBNEP#27: Even if you already proved that the defendant wasn't there the day of the crime, had no motive, no way to kill the victim, no magical skills whatsoever as he's a fighter/commoner multiclass, and that the sorceress here was the only one that could have murdered the victim, left her prints all over the place, drank the milk, is a CE sociopath, and lied trough her teeth during all of her testimonies, you still have to prove her motive or the defendant will be sentenced to a slow death by goblin pummeling!
PF: This is it...I've got to turn this case on its head!
*Points finger, cool close up*
PF: This evidence that I already presented half a dozen times is the key to this case!
TNTM: N-*Over the top breakdown scene*
EBNEP#27: You've done it again, Finder! [Insert prosecutor character development here]
The obvious approach for Hell's Vengeance would be an expedition from central Cheliax to reclaim the newly free Republic of Kintargo on the other side of the Menador Mountains. If the "heroes" in Hell's Vengeance are successful, the status quo prior to Hell's Rebels is restores is restored (with Kintargo a bit more tightly oppressed than before). Then, the only way you have a major change to the setting is if Hell's Rebels results in a free Kintargo and Hell's Vengeance either fails or never happens -- and there is no reason for Paizo to assume that that is the case for the core setting.
I hope there will be archetypes that grant more skill points/class skills to classes that only 2+Int skill points.
Isn't there supposed to an event today were they go into more detail about newly announced products? If so when is supposed to take place?
Publisher, Chief Creative Officer
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Really hope it is set elsewhere in Cheliax and seperate from hell's rebels
It is. Both APs take place during the same general rebellion in Cheliax, but they do not deal with the same location. Hell's Rebels is all about the city of Kintargo. Hell's Vengeance doesn't go there at all.
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Publisher, Chief Creative Officer
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Edit: Sarusan is likely not getting an AP for ages... None of the developers care for it, which as an Australian I find rather disappointing.
This is not the case at all. I have never heard anyone at Paizo suggest they don't care for Sarusan. The real reason we haven't done much with it yet is that is so far from Avistan and it is meant to be deliberately mysterious, at least for the time being.
Well then.
Could you tell us where it does go? :)