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So, I've been looking at creating an indoor drydock, and as such, I've been trying to figure out how big the various ships are. I'm perplexed especially by the Warship, found in ultimate combat. How big are it's sails? Do the sails hang over the edge, or go straight up?
So, if anyone knows the answers to that, that'd be awesome so I know how wide and tall my indoor drydock should be.
However, something about the warship is perplexing. Consider the following numbers:
Warship: 20x100, 2 decks, 1 mast, 160 squares of sails.
Sailing Ship: 20x75, 2 decks, 2 masts, 30 squares of sails.
Longship: 15x75, 1 deck, 1 mast, 10 squares of sails.
Keelboat: 20x50, 1 deck, 1 mast, 20 squares of sails.
Galley: 20x130, 3 decks, 3 masts, 60 squares of sails.
Doesn't it seem ridiculous that the warship has 8 times more sails per mast than any other ship?
The next Flip-mat is the warship, so that should give you an excellent view of one, also try the product discussion thread there.
So, I've been looking at creating an indoor drydock, and as such, I've been trying to figure out how big the various ships are. I'm perplexed especially by the Warship, found in ultimate combat. How big are it's sails? Do the sails hang over the edge, or go straight up?
So, if anyone knows the answers to that, that'd be awesome so I know how wide and tall my indoor drydock should be.
However, something about the warship is perplexing. Consider the following numbers:
Warship: 20x100, 2 decks, 1 mast, 160 squares of sails.
Sailing Ship: 20x75, 2 decks, 2 masts, 30 squares of sails.
Longship: 15x75, 1 deck, 1 mast, 10 squares of sails.
Keelboat: 20x50, 1 deck, 1 mast, 20 squares of sails.
Galley: 20x130, 3 decks, 3 masts, 60 squares of sails.Doesn't it seem ridiculous that the warship has 8 times more sails per mast than any other ship?
Surface area of ships gets exponentially larger as ship size/mast caåacity increases. Rig design in hugely infliential too.
For example:
large viking ships (leidang) would have 200-300 metres squared of sail (25 metre ship, 1 mast, 1 sail).
East India Man of the late 1700s would in comparison have 1942 metres squared, being 40 metres long and 3 masted.
The OP is specifically referencing this...
Warship: This 100-foot-long ship has a single mast, although oars can also propel it. It has a crew of 60 to 80 rowers. This ship can carry 160 soldiers, but not for long distances, since there isn't room for supplies to support that many people. The warship cannot make sea voyages and sticks to the coast. It is not used for cargo. It moves about 2-1/2 miles per hour when being rowed or under sail. - Core Rulebook
Flip-mat shows a battle barge and a trimaran, so no help there.
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I actually was referencing the entry in Ultimate Combat under Vehicles, but it just didn't seem to make sense that the warship has tons more sails per mast than any other listed vessel, including the only other vessel that larger than the warship, the Galley.
I've kinda given up on the idea though, I was thinking of designing a ship that carried other large ships into battle for an epic sea based battle, but I'm restricting the dock's size to vessels under the height of ten feet. A warship's mast height seems to be at around 63 feet high (sqrt(160)*5) when in a square shape, but it might be taller or wider depending on it's shape.
Since it's being carried on another ship, reserving that many floors with that much space for just masts seems ridiculous. So, the dry dock will be reserved for boarding craft.
@LazarX The Galley, a 3 masted ship, has more crew, faster speed, 3 decks, twice as many siege engines, is longer, and still has a significant amount less sails than the warship (60 squares vs 160 squares). The only thing in the warship's favor is it's DR, which is 10 instead of 5. But the rules in UC state that affects the amount of propulsion by 2x, which is really not happening here, hence the confusion O.o
With the historical ships you can just pick an actual example, and use that for your mast height and sail dimensions. The warship doesn't seem to fit any historical mold, it sounds like some sort of galley overloaded with seige weapons and troops, with enough oars and sail to get up to walking speed sans any current. Just use whatever makes sense.
All of those ships however, are well over 10' in height when out of the water, such as when in a drydock, and that's not counting any masts, just the hulls.
Ships masts can also be un-stepped, they are not all permanent.
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all the ships are detailed in the Skulls & Shackles Player's Guide. A lot of stuff from UC got revised in that book. Have you checked it out to see if it compares to UC in regards to your issues?
Good suggestion! The warship listed in the S&S PG has 40 squares of sail. For comparison the sailing ship has 90 squares.
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all the ships are detailed in the Skulls & Shackles Player's Guide. A lot of stuff from UC got revised in that book. Have you checked it out to see if it compares to UC in regards to your issues?Good suggestion! The warship listed in the S&S PG has 40 squares of sail. For comparison the sailing ship has 90 squares.
i think the guide also says it's usually 30 squares of sail per mast; so the three masted sailing ship is 90 squares, and so on...
all the ships are detailed in the Skulls & Shackles Player's Guide. A lot of stuff from UC got revised in that book. Have you checked it out to see if it compares to UC in regards to your issues?Good suggestion! The warship listed in the S&S PG has 40 squares of sail. For comparison the sailing ship has 90 squares.
Do the redone rules in Skulls and Shackle's happen to also make mention of what height the ships' top decks sit above the water?
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I kinda just went with about 10ft per deck, similar to dnd 3.0 stronghold builder's guidebook, which is the main resource I'm using for the designing of the larger vessel.
Thanks for pointing out Skulls and Shackles. I don't own the player's guide personally, but I was able to find the updated stats for the warship on d20. Makes -so- much more sense O.o.
Looking at the possibilities, none of the vessels with just 1 deck can have weapons, so a 10ft ceiling would only accommodate boarding craft with small arms. Even if I did raise the ceiling, it would have to be high enough for the sails if I want the ships to move and attack (none of the vessels I'm seeing can be rowed and still use siege equipment). Even with just 40 squares of sails thats still 30 feet up, not including extra mast height and the decks.
So I'll probably ditch the drydock idea in lieu of a just a large boarding area for the transfer of cargo and what not.
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Here are the assumptions i made for our campaign (Kraken's Fury = sailing ship)
Distance to horizon table (metric)
Eye height Distance to horizon
0.0 m 0.0 m
1.0 cm 370 m
10 cm 1.2 km
20 cm 1.7 km
30 cm 2.0 km
40 cm 2.3 km
50 cm 2.6 km
60 cm 2.9 km
70 cm 3.1 km
80 cm 3.3 km
90 cm 3.5 km
1.0 m 3.7 km --> ship's boat crew height
1.1 m 3.9 km
1.2 m 4.1 km
1.3 m 4.2 km
1.4 m 4.4 km
1.5 m 4.5 km
1.6 m 4.7 km
1.7 m 4.8 km
1.8 m 5.0 km
1.9 m 5.1 km
2.0 m 5.3 km
2.1 m 5.4 km
2.2 m 5.5 km
2.3 m 5.6 km
2.4 m 5.8 km
2.5 m 5.9 km
3.0 m 6.4 km --> Kraken's Fury crew height
3.5 m 6.9 km
4.0 m 7.4 km
4.5 m 7.9 km
5.0 m 8.3 km
6.0 m 9.1 km
7.0 m 9.8 km
8.0 m 11 km
9.0 m 11 km
10 m 12 km
11 m 12 km
12 m 13 km
13 m 13 km
14 m 14 km
15 m 14 km
20 m 17 km --> Kraken's Fury crow's nest (day: Rotgut, +11 Perception, Low-light vision; awareness on incoming ships transmitted automatically to ranger via Empathic Link within 1 mile distance, even if sleeping below decks // night: Conchobhar, +7 Perception, Low-light vision)
25 m 19 km
30 m 20 km
35 m 22 km
40 m 23 km
45 m 25 km
50 m 26 km
60 m 29 km
70 m 31 km
80 m 33 km
90 m 35 km
100 m 37 km
110 m 39 km
120 m 41 km
130 m 42 km
140 m 44 km
150 m 45 km
200 m 53 km
250 m 59 km
300 m 64 km
350 m 69 km
400 m 74 km
500 m 83 km
600 m 91 km
700 m 98 km
800 m 110 km
900 m 110 km
1.0 km 120 km
Thanks for pointing out Skulls and Shackles. I don't own the player's guide personally, but I was able to find the updated stats for the warship on d20. Makes -so- much more sense O.o.
Quick tip, you can pick up the S&S Player's Guide PDF free of charge. All the player's guides are free. :)
It has a lot of extra information on ships, navigation and naval combat.