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Dark Archive Vendor - Fantasiapelit Tampere

1 person marked this as a favorite.

You are legends.

So this seems awesome. I'm instantly in love with Arthur Darvill's character Rip.

Liberty's Edge RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16

Not only does it look awesome, but it has some spoilers about what happens after the season finale of Arrow, I'd suggest making sure you watch that before this trailer.

Liberty's Edge

Interesting. :)

Grand Lodge

Rosgakori wrote:

You are legends.

So this seems awesome. I'm instantly in love with Arthur Darvill's character Rip.

Rory from Dr.Who?

Liberty's Edge

Well, he does have experience with time travel.


Oh yeah!


Yea, I'm just sad that Canary is alive again. Is it too much to leave at least one person in a superhero universe dead? I mean I like the actress and her character, but it takes the stakes out of it all. :(

Liberty's Edge

2 people marked this as a favorite.

The only people who stay dead are Ben Parker, Bucky, Thomas Wayne, and Martha Wayne.

Grand Lodge

Krensky wrote:
The only people who stay dead are Ben Parker, Bucky, Thomas Wayne, and Martha Wayne.

The original Mar-Vell has remained dead since the events of the Graphic Novel bearing his name. He's made the occasional appearance as a spiritual advisor.

Liberty's Edge

He's come back from the dead at least three times.

Thanos brought him back with the reality gem for girl advice, he came back from the dead with a bunch of other dead Avengers during the Chaos War, and he was resurrected by the Kree during the Avengers vs. X-Men crossover.

Liberty's Edge

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Krensky wrote:

He's come back from the dead at least three times.

Thanos brought him back with the reality gem for girl advice, he came back from the dead with a bunch of other dead Avengers during the Chaos War, and he was resurrected by the Kree during the Avengers vs. X-Men crossover.

If we're counting brief resurrections like those, Martha and Thomas Wayne definitely don't qualify either.

Liberty's Edge

Shisumo wrote:
Krensky wrote:

He's come back from the dead at least three times.

Thanos brought him back with the reality gem for girl advice, he came back from the dead with a bunch of other dead Avengers during the Chaos War, and he was resurrected by the Kree during the Avengers vs. X-Men crossover.

If we're counting brief resurrections like those, Martha and Thomas Wayne definitely don't qualify either.

Since they only ever showed up as flashbacks, hallucinations, or visions... yes, yes they do.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Krensky wrote:
Shisumo wrote:
Krensky wrote:

He's come back from the dead at least three times.

Thanos brought him back with the reality gem for girl advice, he came back from the dead with a bunch of other dead Avengers during the Chaos War, and he was resurrected by the Kree during the Avengers vs. X-Men crossover.

If we're counting brief resurrections like those, Martha and Thomas Wayne definitely don't qualify either.
Since they only ever showed up as flashbacks, hallucinations, or visions... yes, yes they do.

Or as main characters in current ongoing DC titles?


Shisumo wrote:
Krensky wrote:
Shisumo wrote:
Krensky wrote:

He's come back from the dead at least three times.

Thanos brought him back with the reality gem for girl advice, he came back from the dead with a bunch of other dead Avengers during the Chaos War, and he was resurrected by the Kree during the Avengers vs. X-Men crossover.

If we're counting brief resurrections like those, Martha and Thomas Wayne definitely don't qualify either.
Since they only ever showed up as flashbacks, hallucinations, or visions... yes, yes they do.
Or as main characters in current ongoing DC titles?

Alternate universes though. I'm not sure that really counts as coming back from the dead.

Edit: And I don't think Convergence is so much an ongoing title as a Crossover event.

Liberty's Edge

The Flashpoint Thomas and Martha Wayne, aka Batman and the Joker don't really count since, you know, they never died.


This could be a chance to bring in DC characters from other times: Jonah Hex, the Demon Knights, the Justice Society etc.
Also, may I say this: THE LAST CENTURION WILL NEVER DIE


This looks AWESOME!!! Now I just need to finish season one, two, and three of Arrow. Yes, I am a bit behind.

Liberty's Edge

Wow... That's a bit of a ride you're in for.


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Looks good...though I am wondering...(Flash Spoiler ahead)

:
How the Flash can trust Captain Cold after the last episode of The Flash.


Spoiler:
He can't. But desperate times...

Liberty's Edge

Spoiler:
Rip can be VERY persuasive.


Amazing Red wrote:
Yea, I'm just sad that Canary is alive again. Is it too much to leave at least one person in a superhero universe dead? I mean I like the actress and her character, but it takes the stakes out of it all. :(

Characters staying dead would actually make this a less faithful adaptation of a superhero universe.


Scott Betts wrote:
Amazing Red wrote:
Yea, I'm just sad that Canary is alive again. Is it too much to leave at least one person in a superhero universe dead? I mean I like the actress and her character, but it takes the stakes out of it all. :(
Characters staying dead would actually make this a less faithful adaptation of a superhero universe.

And it's the worst part of superhero-ness. And Sara being alive renders what Merlyn did absolutely meaningless.

Dark Archive

It got him to ascend to Ra's al Ghul, so it worked out for him.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Amazing Red wrote:
Scott Betts wrote:
Amazing Red wrote:
Yea, I'm just sad that Canary is alive again. Is it too much to leave at least one person in a superhero universe dead? I mean I like the actress and her character, but it takes the stakes out of it all. :(
Characters staying dead would actually make this a less faithful adaptation of a superhero universe.
And it's the worst part of superhero-ness. And Sara being alive renders what Merlyn did absolutely meaningless.

On the contrary - it helps to explain Merlyn's insistence that

Finale spoiler:
he become the next Ra's al Ghul. It puts him in a position where he is in control of the Lazarus pit. His entire motivation this past season has been to free himself of the threat of death that has been hanging over his head since the series began. The Lazarus pit allows him to resurrect Sara, which goes a long way towards appeasing Oliver, Laurel, and Nyssa (the latter of whom has sworn to kill him to avenge Sara's death).

Good point. Is there any time limit on the Lazarus pit? And how good shape you can be in?

Scarab Sages

Didn't DC use it to bring Jason Todd back from his explosive death? Or was that evil Superboy punching reality into submission? I sometimes forget my lame Morrison plot lines.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber Subscriber

As I recall, Aberzombie, it was a combination of both.


I thought Todd was beaten to death with a crowbar, not exploded?

Liberty's Edge

Joker beats him with a crowbar, then blows him up.

The Superboy-Prime punches reality (God, I had forgotten how stupid that sounds) and he lives again, but awakened with amnesia. Then Talia absconds with Todd and dumps him in a pit as part of her stalking of Batman and the Red Hood is born.


I'm hoping this will be used as a way to integrate characters from other time periods (the Demon Knights, Jonah Hex, Justice Society, Legion of Superheroes, etc.) into the Arrowverse.

Scarab Sages

2 people marked this as a favorite.

I could certainly be happy about some Etrigan!


I know nothing of DC as I always made mine Marvel/Excelsior!/'nuff said. I am excited for this show however. Hopefully it's got a really big budget for special effects. I also really like the actress who plays Sara Lance so it's great to see her happening again. That being said though doesn't that completely disintegrate a lot of the drama from this past season of Arrow? Also I want to know too: how long can you be dead to come back in a Lazarus Pit? Can it just be a single bone? Like, can I go find a saint's finger bone from some sepulcher and toss it in the soup and get him back?


Well, they do have a Time Master on board. Pulling Sara out of the time stream before she was killed would cause continuity problems, but she could be dug up only hours after being buried. The question then becomes, does the Lazarus Pit work after you've been embalmed?


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Campaign Setting Subscriber

I'll give them credit for going a different route on Justice League style team. You could have gone something more traditional minus the big three (which has been done in the past in the comic books; with mixed results). Putting a Green Arrow, Flash, Firestorm and Atom in there makes gives it some of the old-style feel, but adding some dubious members gives it more of a JSA/Suicide Squad edge that should make it more modern.

If you weren't going to do someone like a Luthor or Al Ghul, Savage is really a good idea for a sort of global villain.


Who is Vandal Savage?

Scarab Sages

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Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

"Savage is immortal, and has plagued the earth with crime and violence since before the beginning of recorded human history. He is a brilliant tactician with immense technological prowess. He is one of DC's most persistent villains and has fought hundreds of heroes throughout history. In 2009, Vandal Savage was ranked as IGN's 36th Greatest Comic Book Villain of All Time."

Vandal is a caveman who gained immortality when a meteor crashed in front of him and bathed him in radiation. He can heal any wound, including mortal wounds; although I have never seen him get his head chopped off. I may be mistaken, but I think he does age, only very slowly.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Campaign Setting Subscriber

Charles pretty much summarized it. An immortal with no moral compass; untold wealth; and (at least in this series version) access to time travel. He tends to get portrayed as Above Good & Evil or a Chessmaster type in terms of approach in the comics (if you are trope reader), but he can also be vicious streak depending on the writer.

If you haven't ever watched them, there have been some great takes on him in several of the DC animated movies. He's been crushed by a planetary mass driver in one take and had his throat slashed open from end to end by the Cheetah and has recovered.

Grand Lodge

Aberzombie wrote:
Didn't DC use it to bring Jason Todd back from his explosive death?

Yes, but he was a serious case of Came Back Wrong.


LazarX wrote:
Aberzombie wrote:
Didn't DC use it to bring Jason Todd back from his explosive death?
Yes, but he was a serious case of Came Back Wrong.

IIRC, he was actually brought back by Superboy-Prime punching the universe, then later healed and had his memory restored by a Pit. Though obviously not restored to full sanity.


My personal favorite appearance of Vandal Savage so far has been two episodes of the Justice League cartoon: Hereafter and Hereafter II.

In them, Superman is ripped from time during a fight and tossed into the future. The future he finds is one where the earth has been devastated, its sun has turned red, and the only other survivor besides himself is Vandal Savage.

Trapped together in a bleak and barren world, the two work together and, in the end, become friends. Savage experiences something of a redemption as he helps Superman restore a time portal so Superman can go back and stop the calamity Savage caused from taking place.

Savage's final benedicition to the Last Son of Krypton is for Kal-El to make things right. The tragedy is that in going back and stopping Vandal Savages's plot, Supes ensures that the Vandal from his time will never become the repentant Vandal he met and befriended in the future.

---

I hope that the Vandal Savage they feature in LoT is as well written and nuanced as the one from those two episodes of JL. A villain who has been around from time immemorial and who has been Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan, Blackbeard, Vlad the Impaler, and Jack the Ripper has a whole lot of potential as the Big Bad behind a series like this one.

Liberty's Edge

Alex Martin wrote:

Charles pretty much summarized it. An immortal with no moral compass; untold wealth; and (at least in this series version) access to time travel. He tends to get portrayed as Above Good & Evil or a Chessmaster type in terms of approach in the comics (if you are trope reader), but he can also be vicious streak depending on the writer.

If you haven't ever watched them, there have been some great takes on him in several of the DC animated movies. He's been crushed by a planetary mass driver in one take and had his throat slashed open from end to end by the Cheetah and has recovered.

I'm not sure Savage has access to time travel in this, but since he's been around as long as humanity has, no matter where the Legends go, there he is.


Savage from Young Justice was also pretty awesome. Masterminded the take-over of the JL, convinced all the baddest baddies ever to work together, pulled the strings of everyone else including the likes of Mongo and the Reach and then went on to deal with Darkseid.
That's and the JL Vandal Savage is who I want to see.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber, Campaign Setting Subscriber
Krensky wrote:


I'm not sure Savage has access to time travel in this, but since he's been around as long as humanity has, no matter where the Legends go, there he is.

The trailer did kind of sound like they were stopping him throughout time to prevent some future version of events. I just consider it because in the animated series, Savage was shown to have built a time machine (as a way to pass the time) and there was another episode where he helped the Nazi's win World War II by sending a laptop full of information to his past self.

Dal Selpher wrote:
My personal favorite appearance of Vandal Savage so far has been two episodes of the Justice League cartoon: Hereafter and Hereafter II. I hope that the Vandal Savage they feature in LoT is as well written and nuanced as the one from those two episodes of JL.

If you haven't seen it, watch Justice League: Doom. In that version, Savage creates the "Legion of Doom" in such way that was very Machiavellian to take down both heroes and his allies. I think you'll find him to be in similar style; plus it helps that Phil Morris once again voices him in the same cool style of voice.


Yeah, Alex, I've seen JL:Doom and it's *excellent*, probably one of my favorite animated DC movies they've ever done. Savage is great in that too: brilliant and cunning and superbly ruthless.

I still like his portrayal in Hereafter more though - if only because we get to see more of him than just his incomprehensibly smart and crafty villainous side. Granted, that's kind of his schtick, but we get to see the weight and sadness of his immortality and the psychological and emotional baggage it causes SO WELL just in those 42ish minutes.

And also, you're spot on with Phil Morris - the guy does a GREAT Vandal Savage. I wouldn't put him at the same level as CCH Pounder's Amanda Waller or Michael Ironside's Darkseid, but Phil has done a consistently great job with the character.

Dark Archive

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Boba Fett? Boba Fett?


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the one concern i have is the number of "stars" in the show. there's atom, capts. hot and cold, canary girl, TWO hawkpeople, another guy, and the time travel dude. and maybe i missed someone.

that's a lot of people to distribute stories and dialogue with. maybe too many.

that being said, extremely excited to see it as someone who just discovered how amazing Arrow and Flash are a month or so ago on Netflix.


Yakman wrote:

the one concern i have is the number of "stars" in the show. there's atom, capts. hot and cold, canary girl, TWO hawkpeople, another guy, and the time travel dude. and maybe i missed someone.

that's a lot of people to distribute stories and dialogue with. maybe too many.

that being said, extremely excited to see it as someone who just discovered how amazing Arrow and Flash are a month or so ago on Netflix.

Most of those characters are already established, so they get to skip all the backstory.


Waverider!

Per Degaton!


First episode felt a bit rushed and somewhat rough, but it's a better pilot than Supergirl's and that show has turned out quite well. If it doesn't get any better I'll still watch it. Hopefully, like Flash and SG, it will improve as it gets settled into a comfortable pace.

A few minor gripes about variable effects of weapons, explosions never being dangerous , etc. but that's mostly down to comicbook logic/physics.
Things like Sarah wanting help against a bunch of mooks in a bar and Snart happily joining in struck me as a bit against established characters.
Oh, and Norway apparently had nukes, something I was unaware of.

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