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By the rules the feat Weapon finesse doesn't enable the use dex for very much.
a Scimitar is not on that list...
a elven curve blade is a Two hander...
In pathfinder, mithril doesn't change a weapon's "Hand-weight" (light-one handed- two handed)
So, uh, what effective weapons are there that can be used with weapon finesse - aside from those the feat lists?
Personally, I would like to see Elves using mithril longswords with weapon finesse. How do I propose an Idea to Pathfinder society officials?
If you're a saranite you can take the dervish dance fear, or dip dawnflower dervish bard for dex to damage with a scimitar.
Rapier is also a good option, along with the Fencing Grace feat from Advanced Class Origins.
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If you want to use your Dex to hit and damage with a Magus you can:
1) Use a Scimitar with Dervish Dance but you can't qualify for that until 3rd Level unless you take a one level dip into Dawnflower Dervish.
2) Use a Dueling Sword or Whip with Slashing Grace but you can't qualify for that until 5th Level unless you are a Kensai.
3) Use a Rapier with Fencing Grace but you can't qualify for that until 5th Level unless you take a one level dip into Inspired Blade.
4) Use any One-Handed Slashing Weapon with Slashing Grace by taking a one level dip into Swashbuckler.
5) Use any Finessable weapon with the Agile enchantment but you won't have the Fame to acquire that until you are nearly 6th level at a minimum.
6) Use unarmed strike or a natural weapon with an Agile Amulet of Mighty Fists, but you won't have the Fame to acquire that until you are at least 4th level.
If you don't care about Dex to damage, then a Whip can be cool for delivering Touch spells at a distance, though still requires you to wait until you are at least 3rd level to use it.
Staff magus with staff mastery is the best way to go for a two-handed magus actually. This feat was especially created for this archetype....
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Elven kensai can take the aldori sword (I did)
What is the source for the Aldori Sword?
Title and the page number that shows it.
My Pathfinder Society D.M.s will not let me "Have" something unless I can physically show The referenced material to them.
So, I don't get to fudge. I have to use the rules as they are - not how I want them to be.
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Elven kensai can take the aldori sword (I did)What is the source for the Aldori Sword?
Title and the page number that shows it.
My Pathfinder Society D.M.s will not let me "Have" something unless I can physically show The referenced material to them.So, I don't get to fudge. I have to use the rules as they are - not how I want them to be.
Which is proper PFS procedure as laid out in the Guide to Organized Play.
So you'll find the Aldori Dueling Sword on pages 290-291 of the Inner Sea World Guide.
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The Estoc is like a finesseable bastard sword in mechanics. It allows you to two hand it as a martial weapon or one hand it if you've got the exotic proficiency. With the exotic proficiencies, I think it's probably the best finesse weapon out there for a magus. One-handed when you're using spell combat, two-handed when you aren't.
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What about Weapon Finesse, Slashing Grace: Bastard Sword, and a Sun Blade?
The Estoc is like a finesseable bastard sword in mechanics. It allows you to two hand it as a martial weapon or one hand it if you've got the exotic proficiency. With the exotic proficiencies, I think it's probably the best finesse weapon out there for a magus. One-handed when you're using spell combat, two-handed when you aren't.It's the best weapon for a Strength-based Magus, but actually a rather terrible one for a Dex-based Magus. And the reason it's best for a Strength Magus has more to do with that P in the damage type than anything about two-handing.
Care to explain why Piercing damage is best for a Magus specifically?
Actually, wait, let me guess, it's for qualifying for Precise Strike, isn't it?
Answered my own question halfway through asking it, lol.
That said, why is it a bad weapon for a DEX magus? You're getting Weapon Finesse anyway, and it still has that highly valued 18-20/x2 crit range. Plus, it deals 2d4 weapon damage. I can't see any real faults to this weapon for either the DEX or STR side.
I suppose maybe the EWP feat tax for non-Kensai...?
Oh yeah, the issue with piercing weapons not getting Dex to Damage. Had almost forgot about that.
What about Weapon Finesse, Slashing Grace: Bastard Sword, and a Sun Blade?
Feasible but i think is rather costly getting one
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Partially out of context, is there any good way to create magus who wields a two-handed weapon?Yes, in three easy steps:
Step 1: Build magus.
Step 2: Equip him with a 2H weapon.
Step 3: Don't select arcanas that require Spell Combat.
You want to use spell combat to cast and make a full attack at the same time.
So you either spend a feat and use a bastard word with two hands when you aren't casting or, even simpler, you grip your weapon in 2 hands when you aren't casting.
It you wield a one handed weapon with two hands you get the same benefits as someone using a two handed weapon when applying your strength or using power attack.
Using a smaller damage dice isn't so relevant.
Partially out of context, is there any good way to create magus who wields a two-handed weapon?Yes, in three easy steps:
Step 1: Build magus.
Step 2: Equip him with a 2H weapon.
Step 3: Don't select arcanas that require Spell Combat.You want to use spell combat to cast and make a full attack at the same time.
So you either spend a feat and use a bastard word with two hands when you aren't casting or, even simpler, you grip your weapon in 2 hands when you aren't casting.
It you wield a one handed weapon with two hands you get the same benefits as someone using a two handed weapon when applying your strength or using power attack.
Using a smaller damage dice isn't so relevant.
i think str magi is quite well of with a reach weapon like a bardiche and figthing for AoOs at the lower levels. But later on theyloose out to Spell combat and precise strike.
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I am currently playing a two-handed weapon Strength Magus in a low-level campaign.
With a simple 'enlarge person' selfcast he rocks the battleground.
Add 'Shield' and his Protective familiar to the party and he'll stroll around with a decent AC.
Being an Aasimar and having Combat Reflexes to make use of the size and Hammer's reach nets you way more offensive strength then you could get through spamming an empowered Shocking Grasp.
I loved the Magus' concept of spellstrike+SpellCombat until I realized you'll almost always have to fight defensively if you wanna use SpellCombat. In total, that's -6 to his accuracy and requires a concentration check which is easy lategame but a true gamble early on.
With Slashing Grace, things get very silly. Try a Dwarven Magus finessing a Double Waraxe, or a Tengu with a Katana, or a Half-Orc with a Whip. Or try something really silly, like a Terbutje, Sibat or Urumi.
Or go Kensai, and pick any of them.
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The problem of the 5ft dance is that it sometimes doesn't allow you to benefit from AoOs caused by trips and specific abilities, and it is not always that beneficial against large or larger creatures.
But SpellCombat can be powerful if the enemies ever gets passed the reach.
Aside from weapon cord is there a way to easily and cheaply draw a weapon as a swift or free action?
A small list:
Items:
Weapon Cord
Spells:
Call Weapon
Feats:
Quick draw
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Heartseeker is another one: since Precise Strike is precision damage and thus negated by concealment, a Magus would really like to not have to deal with concealment*.
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*Admittedly, I'm a bit shaky on the official ruling for this one, but it makes sense in my mind. Negate the miss chance, you should still be able to deal the precision damage.
HeartseekerPrice +1 bonus; Aura moderate necromancy; CL 7th; Weight —
This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons. A heartseeker weapon is drawn unerringly toward beating hearts. A heartseeker weapon ignores the miss chance for concealment against most living targets, though the attack must still target the proper square. This special ability does not apply against aberrations, oozes, plants, outsiders with the elemental subtype, or any creature specifically noted to lack a heart.
Precise Strike (Ex): At 3rd level, while she has at least 1 panache point, a swashbuckler gains the ability to strike precisely with a light or one-handed piercing melee weapon (though not natural weapon attacks), adding her swashbuckler level to the damage dealt. To use this deed, a swashbuckler cannot attack with a weapon in her other hand or use a shield other than a buckler. She can even use this ability with thrown light or one-handed piercing melee weapons, so long as the target is within 30 feet of her. Any creature that is immune to sneak attacks is immune to the additional damage granted by precise strike, and any item or ability that protects a creature from critical hits also protects a creature from the additional damage of a precise strike. This additional damage is precision damage, and isn't multiplied on a critical hit.
Concealment and Precision Damage: Does concealment (the 20% kind, not total concealment) negate all kinds of precision damage? There is some confusion from the multiple places where precision damage appears.
Yes, in general concealment does negate all kinds of precision damage, unless you have a special ability that particularly says otherwise like the Shadow Strike feat or the Unchained rogue’s sneak attack.
The FAQ don't speak of miss chance, it speak of concealment. Heartseeker don't remove concealment. I doubt it will allow you to sue precision damage.
To give a reason for that: to deal precision damage you need to aim to a weak spot, so you need to see or perceive it. With Heartseeker instead it is the weapon that guide your hand where the weapon want to strike.
Sneak attack specify that "The rogue must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot." and I think that applies to all precision damage.
With Slashing Grace, things get very silly. Try a Dwarven Magus finessing a Double Waraxe, or a Tengu with a Katana, or a Half-Orc with a Whip. Or try something really silly, like a Terbutje, Sibat or Urumi.
Or go Kensai, and pick any of them.
You need a swash dip to do most of this stuff. Exept the whip that is.
if you want to wield an Elven Curve Blade in one hand you could always take a 2 level dip into Titan mauler
Contributor
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The Elven Curved Blade works just fine with Spellstrike; it just doesn't work with Spell Combat.the elven curve blade is a bastard... i mean, in pf doesnt say nothing about, but the weapon was maded for elves in eberron and was treated like bastardsword, so, your gm could do the math and allow that thing
I'm not sure which weapon you're talking about, and I can't find any reference to it in the Eberron Campaign Setting. I thought Eberron's elves used the Valenar double scimitar.
The elven curve blade in Pathfinder is 95% identical to the elven courtblade from 3.5's Races of the Wild, though. I liked that name better. :)
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Two handed magi can still be fun and effective. Part of the trick is to use multi-touch spells instead of single-touch ones. This allows for more spellstrikes without using spell combat.
At low levels, this allows more mobility. Since you won't have multiple attacks until level 8, you'll only ever be using standard attack actions, so you've got your moves available.
MAGUS 3 WITH GREATSWORD
Round 1 - FIGHT!
Free Action: shift grip on sword to single hand (not wielding, just holding)
Standard Action: cast Frostbite
Free Action: shift grip to wielding sword in both hands
Move Action: move up to first victim
Free Action: Deliver one touch of the spell via spellstrike with greatsword.
Round 2 - FIGHT!
Standard Action: Attack (delivering touch 2 via spellstrike, felling foe)
Move Action: Move to flank of the battlefield.
Round 3 - FIGHT!
Full-Round Action: Charge at next enemy (delivering 3rd and final frostbite touch via spellstrike).
Two handed magi can still be fun and effective. Part of the trick is to use multi-touch spells instead of single-touch ones. This allows for more spellstrikes without using spell combat.
At low levels, this allows more mobility. Since you won't have multiple attacks until level 8, you'll only ever be using standard attack actions, so you've got your moves available.
MAGUS 3 WITH GREATSWORD
Round 1 - FIGHT!
Free Action: shift grip on sword to single hand (not wielding, just holding)
Standard Action: cast Frostbite
Free Action: shift grip to wielding sword in both hands
Move Action: move up to first victim
Free Action: Deliver one touch of the spell via spellstrike with greatsword.Round 2 - FIGHT!
Standard Action: Attack (delivering touch 2 via spellstrike, felling foe)
Move Action: Move to flank of the battlefield.Round 3 - FIGHT!
Full-Round Action: Charge at next enemy (delivering 3rd and final frostbite touch via spellstrike).
i suggest this just with a reach weapon for low level str magi.
i suggest this just with a reach weapon for low level str magi.Two handed magi can still be fun and effective. Part of the trick is to use multi-touch spells instead of single-touch ones. This allows for more spellstrikes without using spell combat.
At low levels, this allows more mobility. Since you won't have multiple attacks until level 8, you'll only ever be using standard attack actions, so you've got your moves available.
MAGUS 3 WITH GREATSWORD
Round 1 - FIGHT!
Free Action: shift grip on sword to single hand (not wielding, just holding)
Standard Action: cast Frostbite
Free Action: shift grip to wielding sword in both hands
Move Action: move up to first victim
Free Action: Deliver one touch of the spell via spellstrike with greatsword.Round 2 - FIGHT!
Standard Action: Attack (delivering touch 2 via spellstrike, felling foe)
Move Action: Move to flank of the battlefield.Round 3 - FIGHT!
Full-Round Action: Charge at next enemy (delivering 3rd and final frostbite touch via spellstrike).
spell combat specifically calls for a one handed or light weapon, so that dosn't work.
also, since with spell combat is techically two weapon fighting, I wouldn't allow the spell hand to be used for the GreatSword, and I would be surprised if other GMs would.
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i suggest this just with a reach weapon for low level str magi.Two handed magi can still be fun and effective. Part of the trick is to use multi-touch spells instead of single-touch ones. This allows for more spellstrikes without using spell combat.
At low levels, this allows more mobility. Since you won't have multiple attacks until level 8, you'll only ever be using standard attack actions, so you've got your moves available.
MAGUS 3 WITH GREATSWORD
Round 1 - FIGHT!
Free Action: shift grip on sword to single hand (not wielding, just holding)
Standard Action: cast Frostbite
Free Action: shift grip to wielding sword in both hands
Move Action: move up to first victim
Free Action: Deliver one touch of the spell via spellstrike with greatsword.Round 2 - FIGHT!
Standard Action: Attack (delivering touch 2 via spellstrike, felling foe)
Move Action: Move to flank of the battlefield.Round 3 - FIGHT!
Full-Round Action: Charge at next enemy (delivering 3rd and final frostbite touch via spellstrike).spell combat specifically calls for a one handed or light weapon, so that dosn't work.
also, since with spell combat is techically two weapon fighting, I wouldn't allow the spell hand to be used for the GreatSword, and I would be surprised if other GMs would.
There is a difference between spell combat and spell strike. The post you quoted doesn't mention spell combat.