Why are Kingdom Building penalties almost always permanent?


Rules Questions


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Nearly every penalty your kingdom can receive directly to your three attributes (Economy, Loyalty, Stability) in the Kingdom Building rules is permanent. But why?

Say for example you wanted to remove an unwanted magic item from your kingdom by taking the following option:

The second method is to manipulate your kingdom's economy to encourage an NPC to purchase the item (such as a random adventurer passing through the settlement). During Step 3 of the Income phase, you may attempt one Economy check for each filled slot you want to empty. For every such check after the first one in a turn, your Economy decreases by 1, since these manipulations are harmful to your kingdom's economy and typically only serve to get rid of an item you consider undesirable. If the check fails, nothing happens. If the check succeeds, erase the item from that slot; you may attempt to fill the empty slot as normal in the next Upkeep phase. You do not gain any gp or BP from this sale; the money goes to the building's owner, who uses it to acquire or craft the next item.

I understand the penalty. I just don't know why there seems to be no way to get ride of it. Unlike Unrest, that penalty will continue to effect your kingdom FOR ALL OF FREAKING TIME.

WHY!? Surely there must be a remedy. Why would anyone EVER take that second option if it meant a forever-penalty for their kingdom?

I see this over and over again in the Kingdom building rules. Surely they aren't truly meant to affect your kingdom thousands of years down the line?

This complicates an already complicated system as you must keep a running tally of the always-accumulating-penalties. No doubt you won't even remember what half of them were from before long.

What am I missing?


"For every such check after the first one in a turn, your Economy decreases by 1"

So you can still make the attempt once with no downside.

Otherwise it seems you can remove that penalty by using BP to construct things that grant a bonus to Economy.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ravingdork wrote:

Nearly every penalty your kingdom can receive directly to your three attributes (Economy, Loyalty, Stability) in the Kingdom Building rules is permanent. But why?

The factors represent the inherent dynamics of a kingdom, which is far far larger than those that affect individuals.

Drastic changes to the kingdom can result in changes as appropriate, so "permanent" is relative.

Liberty's Edge

Freddy Fighter: Hey, they finally stocked a Sunblade and a Holy Avenger at the weapon store! I was wondering when they'd show up!

Sir Runsa Lott: Just remember, Fred, we're hurting the capital's economy by buying these weapons.

Freddy: ....What the actual hell, Runsa. You literally told me when I hired you as a party member that "a Holy Avenger and a Sunblade in tandem is the hallmark of a master paladin, one I strive to be someday," so why don't you want these?

Sir Runsa: I would prefer they be gifted to me by my goddess, not purchased like rations or rope. (points at the sale signs; they have a royal stamp affixed and read "25% OFF 50% OFF 75% OFF 90% OFF NO REASONABLE OFFER REFUSED TAKE ONE, PLEASE"

Rita the Rogue: So shouldn't we be helping the economy by putting money into it by buying these swords for you guys?

Sir Runsa: No, Rita. Clearly the city government's trying to foist these onto a buyer just to get them out of the city. Something's not right here.

Freddy: So, technically, it'd be better for the economy if Rita just stole them?

Sir Runsa: That's not--

Rita: (leaves the store with the Sunblade and Holy Avenger) Too late, I have already made the transaction. XD

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Why are Kingdom Building penalties almost always permanent? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.