Umbral Reaver |
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I really like how this class works in Pillars of Eternity, and its mechanics are similar enough to Pathfinder's that I thought I'd have a go at converting it. PoE spans only 12 levels, so the Cipher looks a bit stretched when expanded to 20. An alternative route would be to add more abilities after 12th instead of spreading out the existing ones (as I have done here).
I promise no balance, only the result of rare and short-lived excitement on my part.
Also I haven't finished converting the higher level powers and haven't written a capstone yet. It's kind of sparse. Contribute!
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For those not familiar with what's going on here:
The Cipher is a hybrid combat/caster character that uses Powers that cost Focus. The Focus pool is extremely limited, at most levels not even being large enough to cast two highest level Powers in a row.
The Cipher can replenish Focus in combat by hitting enemies with weapon attacks. While below maximum Focus, each attack deals some extra damage and that extra damage is also added to the Focus pool.
The Cipher flows between casting and fighting, as the Focus pool fills and empties. A Cipher with low Focus strikes powerful blows while a Cipher with high Focus uses frightening psychic powers. These two strikingly different styles come together in a single warrior.
Battlefield Role: Damage/Control
Umbral Reaver |
I wrote it in quite a hurry, so I probably made a stupid pile of mistakes. Also, maximum focus is shown in the class chart. Focus cost is 5 + 5x power level (the same as in PoE). I stretched the max Focus pool over 20 levels. Since 12 doesn't stretch to 20 very accurately, it's probably worth redoing.
Also, I think having higher max focus is a talent. If you're getting higher than your starting focus without that, it might be a bug.
Edit: I just looked again and yes, you're right. I accidentally the 6th level powers column up one row.
Drejk |
It seems that PoE level 12th might simply correspond to d20 level 12 - if you open Wizard's grimoire it shows space for 10th level of spells while in game there is only six level of spells available, looking like a possibility for a sequel or two with increased level cap.
Also, maximum focus is shown in the class chart.
Sorry, I was referring to the fact that you don't start combat with maximum focus and accidentally mixed that with focus cost - for example, my 5th level cipher has starting focus pool of 35, but at times I have reached as much as 50-something. I am not sure how big maximum focus pool actually is.
Drejk |
A thought that I had playing: the cipher has very low endurance like a wizard but giving him HD of d6 would not match the medium BAB progression that does fit cipher's melee/magic blend. However, the game allows wearing all kinds of armor by all classes, as far as I could tell. I think that maybe cipher normal squishiness could be represented by reducing armor proficiency to light armor only?
Drejk |
Maybe? A d8 combat class is pretty harsh on a character that's expected to hit in combat already.
Also, I think you're right there. Now I don't know how to find out what maximum Focus is. PoE is frustratingly uninformative about some things, such as how two-weapon fighting works.
It's like all characters had Duelist feats that appeared somewhere in 3rd edition and in Star Wars d20 or Star Wars SAGA that gave bonuses to one-handed weapon with other hand free and Two-weapon fighting feats (because the off-hand does not seem to be penalized more than main hand.
My current guess is twice the initial focus pool. I remember my focus reaching 20 at 1st level and in game cipher IIRC had focus 10 at first level. I am completely unsure how much focus you get per hit, though...
Drejk |
I just reached Hadret House and spoke with Kurren, learning interesting things about ciphers that are hardly deductible from cipher gameplay: their connection with souls of others allows them locating souls. Now I wonder which of the weird things I experience are Watcher-sense and which are cipher's readings... (cipher is my first character).
Umbral Reaver |
Cipher is my first, too. Once I get there and learn about that stuff, I can incorporate it into the dead levels of this class.
Also, I think there are some more bugs in the Cipher: I took the talent that increases your Soul Whip damage by x1.2. Instead, it increased my multiplier to 2.4. I was expecting 1.4 (20% + 20%) or 1.44 (1.2 x 1.2).
Umbral Reaver |
I don't think it's having the listed effect, either. Hooray for Obsidian's notorious reputation for bugs.
Also, I ran into Kurren. He describes the Ciphers as 'soul detectives'. That seems like a neat angle to fill out the rest, especially since PoE does not grant the classes any non-combat abilities.
According to Kurren, they can see where souls have been recently, who has held an item, tracking and so forth. I'd be tempted to give them an ability that works like scent except for anything that has a soul or animating essence (so it does include undead, but not robots or traps).
Drejk |
I don't think it's having the listed effect, either. Hooray for Obsidian's notorious reputation for bugs.
Also, I ran into Kurren. He describes the Ciphers as 'soul detectives'. That seems like a neat angle to fill out the rest, especially since PoE does not grant the classes any non-combat abilities.
The closest thing to non-combat abilities I saw were class-specific options in scripted interaction. Mostly related to paladin orders, and I think to priest deity.
According to Kurren, they can see where souls have been recently, who has held an item, tracking and so forth. I'd be tempted to give them an ability that works like scent except for anything that has a soul or animating essence (so it does include undead, but not robots or traps).
Sort of psychometry, locating creatures and objects held by ensouled creature probably, maybe.
Umbral Reaver |
I have run into actual mind-reading by ciphers, even though the player character doesn't have this option.
Also! I think Obsidian plans a level 13-20 expansion, as the wizard grimoires list up to 10th (!) level spells but have no slots for them (max 6th level spells at level 12). It might be better to just write the cipher as a 1-12 class and fill in the rest later.
Drejk |
I have run into actual mind-reading by ciphers, even though the player character doesn't have this option.
Also! I think Obsidian plans a level 13-20 expansion, as the wizard grimoires list up to 10th (!) level spells but have no slots for them (max 6th level spells at level 12). It might be better to just write the cipher as a 1-12 class and fill in the rest later.
I said so! :D
UsagiTaicho |
Well this is a fascinating thread. First of all, thanks for introducing me to this game. It's going on the list of purchases.
Secondly, this Cipher has a lot of dead levels. However your powers sound pretty cool, even if I don't like the mechanic they use that much. I mean, it's a cool mechanic, and I like the way your focus pool builds back up with the soul whip, that's neat. It's just, I don't know. Not that Pathfinderized?
My gut reaction is to turn it into a ki pool. But as I type this I am rereading it again and again, I'm rethinking that.
I'm not really sure what else to say. I will be back with more commentary.
Umbral Reaver |
I wouldn't do a ki pool. The key to the Cipher is that it has a very small reserve to spend from and replenishes it quickly by hitting things in combat. To do otherwise would be... not a Cipher. That's what sets them apart from the other classes in Pillar of Eternity (most use a spells per day system).
If you mean reduce it to something like 1 point of Focus replenished per hit, yeah, that's probably doable (along with proportionally cheaper powers and a lower max Focus).
I have finished the game and learned more about Ciphers outside of combat. A redo of the class would definitely involve more of the 'soul detective' skillset.
Drejk |
Now I am considering making a cipher without spells, instead using (psychic) hexes to represent powers that cipher can use every encounter multiple times per day and soul whip inflicting extra damage and possibly debuffing the target with penalty to saving throws against cipher's hexes. I wonder what to do with focus because recreating the whole focus mechanics with its constant ebbs and lows might be not worth the trouble.
I will probably use occult skill unlocks and maybe some other occult rules as well.