(PFS) TWF Strength Slayer


Advice

Shadow Lodge

Looking for a little C&C on TWF Strength Slayer dual-wielding kukris. I only plan on playing it to L12 in PFS.

STR 17 (+2 Human)
DEX 15
CON 14
INT 13
WIS 12
CHA 7

Traits:
Reactionary
Indomitable

Human FCB: 1/6 Talent

L1 TWF, Power Attack (Human)
L2 Talent: Double Slice
L3 Step Up
L4 Talent: Weapon Focus Kukri, +1 STR
L5 Combat Expertise
L6 Talent: ITWF, Bonus Talent: Trap Finding
L7 ITW Feint
L8 Talent: Combat Trick: Improved Critical (Kukri), +1 STR
L9 (Lunge or Combat Reflexes)
L10 Talent: Two-Weapon Rend
L11 Dazing Assault
L12 Talent: Evasion, Bonus Talent: Opportunist, +1 STR

Things I'm not sure on:
-I'm willing to drop the Feint line and re-jigger my stats slightly as the 13 Int is pulling points from boosting STR
-I'm willing to lose a feat learn Twin Bladed Sword or Sawtooth Sabres if that is better for L1-12

Thoughts?


Play a Deliverer Slayer and you get Sawooth Saber proficiency for free!


I am always a bit 'meh' on double slice. At least at low levels (you get what? +2 on one attack when you full attack?)

I would probably switch it around with trap finding (not sure how important that is in low level PFS games, but still... seems vaguely more relevant)

Shadow Lodge

@scavion: Since that archetype replaces the L2, L6 and L10 talents and those are the key pick ups for TWF stuff, I would basically consider that a no go.

@lemeres, good point. I honestly wish there were better Slayer Talent choices.


Yeah, at level 6, you might be able to pull off 20 strength with a belt on, so that would be +3 damage over 2 hits- a much better prospect.

I suppose just a larger share of the basic rogue stuff that people didn't do much with because.....rogue... would be an easy way to solve the limited choice problem.


Don't forget Kukris are light weapons so Power Attack will only do -1/+1.

Have you thought of jiggering about a bit to get piranha strike?

EDIT
Me wrong. lights get full PA on main hand. oops.


The only benefit of Piranha strike is that you get to dump your strength.

Silver Crusade

Here is what I would do...- note, I love the sawtooth sabre...so
(drop feint, no need for it really)
Stats:
Str:17 (+2)
Dex:14
Con:14
Int:10
Wis:12
Cha:07

feats-
1- exotic wepaon prof. Double bladed staff, power attack
2- TWF (slayer)
3- Iron will (or, well, w/e)
4- Weapon focus (Double bladed staff) +1 str (20)
5- w/e (combat reflexes?)
6- Slayer Talent, Improved TWF
7- Stand Still
8- rogue talent (combat trick) lunge
9- Double slice
10- Two Weapon Rend
11- w/e

you now have a blade you can TWF with, OR two-hand (as a free action to change grip) best of both worlds. Hell, you can even reflavor it as two twin blades that can be joined together to form the two handed staff weapon.

need to use your move action? two hand it. You get to full attack? WHEW!


rorek55 wrote:

you now have a blade you can TWF with, OR two-hand (as a free action to change grip) best of both worlds. Hell, you can even reflavor it as two twin blades that can be joined together to form the two handed staff weapon.

need to use your move action? two hand it. You get to full attack? WHEW!

Actually, the new Melee Tactics Toolbox release gave us some new weapons, including a double weapon that is a freakin' simple weapon.

Admittedly, the Weighted Spear's criticals are not that great... but hey, one end does bludgeoning (for when you just have to smash in that lich's skull). It is an step up from quarterstaves at least, since they can be materials other than wood (less of a problem in nonPFS games, since my first thought is 'lead pipe?'... but hey, PFS, what can you do?)

Anyway, point is- you can have the 2 handed goodness while saving a feat.

Shadow Lodge

The three build skeletons I'm whittled it down to.

Slightly MAD, Feinted Ya:

STR 17 (+2 Human)
DEX 15
CON 14
INT 13
WIS 12
CHA 7

Human FCB: 1/6 Talent

L1 TWF, Power Attack (Human)
L2 Talent: Trap Finding
L3 Step Up
L4 Talent: Weapon Focus Kukri, +1 STR
L5 Combat Expertise
L6 Talent: ITWF, Bonus Talent: Double Slice
L7 ITW Feint
L8 Talent: Combat Trick: Improved Critical (Kukri), +1 STR
L9 Lunge
L10 Talent: Two-Weapon Rend
L11 Dazing Assault
L12 Talent: Evasion, Bonus Talent: Opportunist, +1 STR

Less MAD, Kukris, Stick to Ya:

STR 18 (+2 Human)
DEX 14
CON 14
INT 10
WIS 12
CHA 7

Human FCB: 1/6 Talent

L1 Step Up, Power Attack (Human)
L2 Talent: TWF
L3 Following Step
L4 Talent: Weapon Focus Kukri, +1 STR
L5 (temp feat, retrain to Lunge at L6)
L6 Talent: ITWF, Bonus Talent: Double Slice
L7 Step Up & Strike
L8 Talent: Combat Trick: Improved Critical (Kukri), +1 STR
L9 (Open Feat)
L10 Talent: Two-Weapon Rend
L11 Dazing Assault
L12 Talent: Evasion, Bonus Talent: Opportunist, +1 STR

STR all day, Two-bladed Sword, Smashed Ya:

STR 19 (+2 Human)
DEX 15
CON 14
INT 9
WIS 12
CHA 7

Human FCB: 1/6 Talent

L1 TWF, EWP: Two-bladed Sword
L2 Talent: Trap Finding
L3 Power Attack
L4 Talent: Weapon Focus Two-bladed Sword, +1 STR
L5 Step Up
L6 Talent: ITWF, Bonus Talent: Double Slice
L7 Lunge
L8 Talent: Combat Trick: Improved Critical (two-bladed sword), +1 DEX
L9 (Open Feat)
L10 Talent: Two-Weapon Rend
L11 Dazing Assault
L12 Talent: Evasion, Bonus Talent: Opportunist, +1 STR


If you've got high Str, it's better to use a double weapon because, in cases where you either can't use a full-attack or you can't afford the attack penalty of TWF, you can wield it as a 2-h weapon and get 1.5x Str (and 1.5x Power Attack) to damage. I'd say the two-blade sword is best for this.


Apocryphile wrote:

Don't forget Kukris are light weapons so Power Attack will only do -1/+1.

Where is this from?

The Power Attack feat does not indicate this.

Sovereign Court

Sammy, I believe you can only take the ranger weapon style talent three times, at 2nd, 6th, and 10th (or later). Your kukri build has it taken four times, unless I'm misreading.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
EvilMinion wrote:
Apocryphile wrote:

Don't forget Kukris are light weapons so Power Attack will only do -1/+1.

Where is this from?

The Power Attack feat does not indicate this.

It does not. Perhaps a mistake carrying over from 3.5, though I believe in 3.5 light weapons could not be used with Power Attach at all.

Shadow Lodge

Talon Stormwarden wrote:
Sammy, I believe you can only take the ranger weapon style talent three times, at 2nd, 6th, and 10th (or later). Your kukri build has it taken four times, unless I'm misreading.

Ah, the less MAD kukri one! Thanks for pointing that out.

That would leave dealer's choice of a Bonus Talent at L6 and I would hazard to guess I would then pick up Double Slice at L9 via a normal feat (as my STR would be pumped up by then and it would be trivial to pick up a slight DEX boosting item to qualify for Double Slice).

Sovereign Court

Ah yeah, I failed to notice you had two kukri builds, sorry.

I've done something similar with my slayer, who is 7th. My build is the same as your MAD Kukri build so far except I took Gang up and Butterfly's Sting in place of ITW Feint and Step Up, and at ninth I plan on taking Iron Will. 11+ isn't filled in yet.

I've had a lot of fun so far, but starting to feel the pain of DR and the cost of improving two weapons.

Shadow Lodge

I've decided to go with the two-bladed sword build, simply for the option to 2H when I have to move and attack or if I need to power through DR.

However, I wanted to share this for those of you who are fans of Sawtooth Sabres & Achakek:

Faithful (Achakek) Ranger Style, Inner Sea Combat wrote:
If the ranger selects faithful (achaekek), he can choose from the following list whenever he gains a combat style feat: Double Slice, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (sawtooth sabre), Two-Weapon Feint, and Two-Weapon Fighting. At 6th level, he adds Improved Two-Weapon Feint and Two-Weapon Defense to the list. At 10th level, he adds Greater Two-Weapon Fighting and Two-Weapon Rend to the list.

This definitely leans towards a DEX-based or STR/DEX-split character as you need to pick up ITWF (17 Dex) on your own.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Sammy T wrote:

I've decided to go with the two-bladed sword build, simply for the option to 2H when I have to move and attack or if I need to power through DR.

However, I wanted to share this for those of you who are fans of Sawtooth Sabres & Achakek:

Faithful (Achakek) Ranger Style, Inner Sea Combat wrote:
If the ranger selects faithful (achaekek), he can choose from the following list whenever he gains a combat style feat: Double Slice, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (sawtooth sabre), Two-Weapon Feint, and Two-Weapon Fighting. At 6th level, he adds Improved Two-Weapon Feint and Two-Weapon Defense to the list. At 10th level, he adds Greater Two-Weapon Fighting and Two-Weapon Rend to the list.

This definitely leans towards a DEX-based or STR/DEX-split character as you need to pick up ITWF (17 Dex) on your own.

Yeah, Achaekek's combat style is only really good with Sawtooth Sabre Dex builds (Swash dip) as you can get Imp Two-Weapon Feint without prereqs. However, Sawtooth Sabres work fine with using the default two-weapon fighting ranger combat style.


i think that the higer crit of kukris is way better than half str extra when you charge/AO. Also, you can use them when grappled (monster with grab are plentyfull)

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