What class would benefit most from from the tengu's stats and proficiency options?


Advice


Their profiency options are pretty nuts and open up a lot of different options for weapons, what class would benefit most from these proficiencies while also taking into account their racial stats?


Maybe the slayer? They can make a pretty fearsome sword wielding dex based fighter. I could be wrong though.


Yea that'd make sense, I suppose the wis boost could just cancel out the con minus in that instance.

Grand Lodge

Hunter. That Elven Curved Blade (18-20 crit range) plus Outflank with a pet with many attacks (Deinychus pops to mind with a start of 3, 5 at 7th level) means lots of chances for a crit to swap back and forth.

Also, you can finesse a Curved Blade and the Tengu get a dex bonus (plus wis for casting and the poor base will of Hunters). Con penalty does hurt on a d8 HD, but it could be worse. Good fort and High dex/defense can help make up for the lower HP.


I feel that their stats lends for a ranged something, that way you feel the con penalty less. Because to get a 14 it costs 5 points which gives you a 12, and having an 10 which gives you a 12 costs 0 and is worth 2, thus you're spending 5 points for 4 points worth of stats. Now this isn't the end of the world, but you're not going to have a higher con than a 12 with the point buy.
But going ranged means that you don't take advantage of their weapon proficiencies.


Well they have the option to choose a number of eastern weapons, I don't see why they couldn't choose a ranged one. Soooo any good eastern ranged weapons?


I will say classes without full martial proficiency, since the access to all swords is mostly redundant otherwise (even if you have a favorite exotic weapon, it is usually just a point or two difference, and a martial weapon does it just as well).

So maybe inquisitor. They need better proficiencies.

As a note- do not be constrained by your races bonuses. While things can be easier/harder depending, with point buy, you can usually wiggle out a half decent set of stats with most races. Mostly by lowering expectations when you have a bonus to a secondary or tertiary stat, and dumping when the bonus is to something you barely need. Dumping CHA is always a favorite too (and it can work pretty well on an inquisitor, since they those huge bonuses to intimidate, a common CHA skill). The con penalty hurts, but you can work against it.

On a 20 point buy, you could go like this, for instance:
STR 16 DEX 14 (12) CON 14 (16) INT 10 WIS 14 (12) CHA 7


Sacred fist warpriest for crusaders flurry.


Inquisitor does seem like an ace choice, being essentially a martial class and all, but not getting good proficiencies.


TWF Slayers can benefit from Two-Bladed Sword proficiency. Inquisitors and martially inclined Clerics can probably get the most out of being a Tengu, though.

Silver Crusade

sword and pistol gunslingers

Scarab Sages

Any weapon based monk, sensei especially. The seven branched sword is great. They are also a great way to start an natural weapon build thanks to three natural attacks at level one.


Hm, how would they be better acquainted to a natural weapon build exactly? The only way to focus on natural weapons is to be a ranger or slayer correct? This would provide claws and other races are capable of starting with a bite. I am aware that they can take a feat(s?) to make their bite better however which I suppose has potential.


Well other ways to focus on natural attacks are Fighter to get bonuses to attack and damage with them. Barb to get more str per hit. slayer, paladin, rogue, cavaliers, magus, warpriest, inquisitor... Anything that likes hitting in melee really. Getting 3 attacks at full BAB and full str is something dreamed of for melee people.

The Tengu can trade out the sword training for claw attacks thus giving three natural attacks to any class at lv1.


Hm, didn't think they'd be that viable at high level with damage reduction and what not, figured that would be an issue.


As you get higher you hit some of those issues, but they're issues that TWF would need to deal with too. Paladin's smite ignores it. Fighters can reduce it and have enough damage to punch through anyways. Barbs/cavaliers/divine casters/bards can just try to punch through it with all their abilities that add extra damage.

Also a pretty good plan is play a natural attacker the first 4~7 levels, you know, the levels where there's not really DR, and then switch to a more normal combat style. And about that time a delayed build should be coming online. Example, do this natural attacks while you wait for you mounted combat feats. Do this while you wait for your iterative attacks. While you wait for free feats or to qualify for some core feat for you playstyle.


Jack of Nothing wrote:
Hm, how would they be better acquainted to a natural weapon build exactly? The only way to focus on natural weapons is to be a ranger or slayer correct? This would provide claws and other races are capable of starting with a bite. I am aware that they can take a feat(s?) to make their bite better however which I suppose has potential.

Tengu have an alternate racial trait that trades out Sword Training for 2 claw attacks.


I play a Tengu in PFS and have gone a few different ways over the 10 levels I've played him so far.

Firstly, I swapped Sword Training out for the two claw attacks and took Ninja at first level. Nothing says ouch like 3 sneak attacks when flanking at level 1.

And at level 2 you get vanish, which is just lovely.

I then came up against the DR issue that all Natural attacks come up against, and an Amulet of mighty fists didn't do much to solve it either. So I multiclassed into Magus, and left the natural attacking mostly behind. I don't like playing characters with a dump stat as a rule, so Magus worked nicely. And after a life changing incident with a holy WMD in the weapon in the rift (I think it's called) I took a level of Paladin too.

Now this guy is also equipped with a bane baldric and a silver smiting bracelet. And has Kamikaze as a ninja trick. This can add up to crazy damage when it all comes in at once.

I suppose to answer the OP's question, the only thing you'll not be able to be great at playing a Tengu is a frontline high hp damage soaker. The Con penalty will stuff you up too much. Anything Dex based, ranged, wis based spell caster, any combination of those.. It'll fly.

Especially if you take Tengu Wings at 7th level.

In my time playing Mormont I've kept him alive by trying to avoid ending my turn near a live foe. But when you can drop 5 attacks from a flank, each doing an extra 7d6 damage (Sneak/Bane/Kamikaze) plus smite & frostbite or whatever other spell, and a beak with +5d6 if you really need it, you don't usually end your turn standing next to a live 'un.


That's easy.

Shaman with the Battle Spirit. One of the big annoying things about the Battle Spirit is that shaman get no decent weapon proficiencies. You're there with all these tools for war, and you're swinging a 1d6 x2 chunk of wood for your career.

The Tengu gets every swordlike weapon as a proficiency. or a large number of exotic weapons. Natural Attacks are okay for the first few levels, but Shaman don't get Magic Fang on their list, which gets pretty annoying pretty quickly. You don't get shields either, so go straight for two-handed swords (or exotics)

So. Focus on Armor Class for defense rather than Hit points. Build to Str > Wis > Dex > Con = Cha > Int. You can't take Power Attack or weapon Focus at level 1, so Toughness or Dodge are probably your first-level feat. After that, take up your standard combat feats sprinkled with Extra hex every now and then.

Don't forget to make your familiar into a Mauler.

You are now a yamabushi sword-priest who fights evil with the aid of his shapeshifting goat or fox buddy.


The tengu sword training ability also gets better every time a book with new swords come out.

Tengu work well for any class that can benefit from using all of the swords.

I'd like to see a tengu swashbuckler with slashing glace and a falcata.


Nice ideas Scootalol & Zhangar!

Swashbucklers & Shamans weren't out when I started playing Mormont, but either class would've been a great choice.

Silver Crusade

Tengu warpriest of Apsu.

Favoured weapon bite and wf claws = sacred weapon damage for your 3 natural attacks.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I'm surprised nobody paid much attention to the sacred fist comment... That was the first thing that came to my mind- sacred fist gets channel and flurry on its own, so you can take Crusader's Flurry without multiclassing... Pick a god whose favored weapon is a good sword and go crazy :)

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I'm a fan of a crit-fishing dual-wielding wakazashi rogue (or swashbuckler for early Imp Crit) with Butterfly Sting and a burly ally with a x3 or x4 weapon, like a nagaji samurai or paladin with a naginata.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Shizuru (one of the gods of Tian Xia) has katana as his favored weapon... So you could build a sacred fist who crit fishes with a katana, and who gets as many attacks as TWF but only needs one weapon (and who can self buff as a swift action). Still take butterfly's sting and have a burly friend... Naginata or Tetsubo are great weapons for that...


I have a Tengu Zen Archer that rocks it pretty hard! The sword/claws racial ability pretty much is useless but otherwise the stats are great for it and other abilities/feats. He has wings he can grow now once a day!

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