Abraham Z. |
I've been working on a build for a halfling with a Griffon mount. I'm playing him tomorrow in PFS at level 2, so it's time to lock in some of my choices and I would greatly appreciate any feedback.
Mr. Proudefeets, would-be Knight of Lastwall
Alt Racial traits: Outrider, Adaptable Luck
STR 12
DEX 16
CON 14
INT 7
WIS 9
CHA 18
Traits: Fate’s Favored, Lessons of Chaldira
Level 1 Cavalier/Emissary 1 (Order: Sword)
Bonus Feat: Mounted Combat
Feat: Boon Companion
Mount: Wolf (Bodyguard)
Wolf Feat: ?
Level 2 Paladin/Shining Knight 1
Wolf Feat: ?
Level 3 Paladin/Shining Knight 2
Feat: Ride By Attack
Level 4 Paladin/Shining Knight 3
Stat Bump: CHA +1
Skilled Rider: Mount gains +CHA to Saves
Level 5 Paladin/Shining Knight 4
Feat: Monstrous Mount [In order to meet the prereq of Ride 5 and Handle Animal 5, all skill ranks from levels 1-5 go to those two skills and I use the Favored Class Benefit for levels 2-5 for an extra skill rank]
Mount: Griffon (Archetype: None)
Griffon Feats x3: Not sure, maybe: Power Attack, Imp. Overrun, Greater Overrun
Level 6 Paladin/Shining Knight 5
Divine Bond: Mount
Retrain Boon Companion to Wheeling Charge
Level 7 Paladin/Shining Knight 6
Feat: Monstrous Mount Mastery (Griffon gains the ability to fly while mounted)
Level 8 Paladin/Shining Knight 7
Stat Bump: CHA +1
Griffon Feat: Charge Through?
Level 9 Paladin/Shining Knight 8
Feat: Indomitable Mount
Level 10 Paladin/Shining Knight 9
Griffon Feat: ?
Level 11 Paladin/Shining Knight 10
Feat: Spirited Charge
Anonymous Visitor 163 576 |
Having done something similar with a celestial Pegasus, really want the griffin to have hover. It's the single most important feat.
I'd avoid overrun. If it goes bad, you and the mount could be in a world of hurt.
The mount is really there to allow you to deliver charge attacks. If it does damage too, that's a bonus.
Abraham Z. |
I think Hover is not PFS legal. Also, I'm hoping that his Fly skill will be high enough to make the DC 15 check when he needs to Hover.
I'm interested though in the idea that I shouldn't consider the mount as a major part of the damage dealing. I thought that with his ability to pounce I'd be able to charge with my lance and then have the Griffon follow through with five attacks from pounce. No?
Jaunt |
Try untangling the big mess of rules about where you make your charge attack from, when, and how this interacts with a non-reach mount's attacks. I'll wait. It's really important to know all the minutiae of charge, ride by, wheeling and reach before you then have to get a GM to understand it all.
Done? Okay. Second, try to find a better way to get a flying mount. Two feats is a pretty steep price. I don't know how wedded you are to 90% paladin, but between real Animal Companion lists stolen other classes, there's got to be a better way to get a flying mount faster. I'm not really clear on what's PFS legal these days, but I'm pretty sure it can be done.
Abraham Z. |
Try untangling the big mess of rules about where you make your charge attack from, when, and how this interacts with a non-reach mount's attacks. I'll wait. It's really important to know all the minutiae of charge, ride by, wheeling and reach before you then have to get a GM to understand it all.
Yes, it's definitely a confusing mess and I can't say that I've got it all figured out. By my reading, Ride By Attack should allow me to charge-attack with reach, and then move one more square so that the mount can charge-attack without reach. No?
Alternatively, if that doesn't work for some reason that I haven't understood, it seems like Wheeling Charge should definitely allow it, since it states "You may make an attack during any part of this move" (where "move" is clearly a charge action). No?
That said, I would greatly appreciate any help in making sense of the mishmash of rules about mounted combat. I've read a lot of the threads on here about it but they aren't too much help because a) there is a ton of back and forth between different people arguing different interpretations, with little actual resolution, and b) many of these arguments appear to have been superseded by the mounted combat faq (which, for me at least, still didn't clarify the most confusing parts of mounted combat).
Jaunt |
The rules are, in my opinion, ambiguous to the point of being unascertainable. A lot of the debate is over which requirements of charging are altered by feats, and carefully parsing what applies to the mount. By my read, using a Ride By Attack forecloses the possibility of your mount making any attacks. Wheeling Charge also allows you to make an attack at any point, not your mount.
The important thing is picking the interpretation you think is the right one, with the best evidence behind it and then accept that almost every other interpretation is roughly as correct as yours. Before playing at table with a new GM, ask him if he's made rulings about mounted combat, if he hasn't, explain your interpretation to him. If he asks you questions, that's why you have to know where all the weak points of your explanation are, and you should just disclose them. Get the rulings in advance of the game, ask a quick hypothetical question or two ("So I can move 15 feet, attack, 5 feet, mount attacks, move 20 feet, turn 90 degrees left, and then move 10 more feet, right?"), and then you should be set.
Anonymous Visitor 163 576 |
I read mounted combat as follows:
1) You never BOTH get a full round. If the mount double moves, the rider is limited. If the rider full attacks, the mount is limited.
I find that's a simple way to explain the drawbacks, and makes for very quick adjudication.
2) I would personally allow both rider and mount to charge on a ride-by attack, but ask your GM.
Having played a similar character, there's a time to use the ride-by and stay our of harm's way, and there's a time to charge directly in (the mount definitely attacks in this case), and occupy an opponents attention so it doesn't eat your friends. Mounted Combat is really useful for keeping your mount around, and it scales well throughout the game.
LazarX |
Try untangling the big mess of rules about where you make your charge attack from, when, and how this interacts with a non-reach mount's attacks. I'll wait. It's really important to know all the minutiae of charge, ride by, wheeling and reach before you then have to get a GM to understand it all.
Done? Okay. Second, try to find a better way to get a flying mount. Two feats is a pretty steep price. I don't know how wedded you are to 90% paladin, but between real Animal Companion lists stolen other classes, there's got to be a better way to get a flying mount faster. I'm not really clear on what's PFS legal these days, but I'm pretty sure it can be done.
Even a Summoner who's not Hafling sized has to wait until Level 8.