Thoroughly debunked, let me guess, by a foaming plethora of anticapitalist think tanks? Colour me not impressed. For starters, you have no clue how bad it would have been with a market that did not self-correct. Such as... The old soviet union. Capitalism has many flaws, but if bread grows too expensive, someone will produce it cheaper and outcompete the previous companies. There has to my knowledge not been bread queues in the US. Consider yourself blessed that you did not grow up in the old eastern bloc, my friend.
Modern food production technology is to thank for that, not economics. Soylent green isn't people.
Thejeff: Yes, yes. I see you have heard and learned well the story of Trofim Lysenko, top name in American biology and agriculture.
Well, there haven't been bread queues for 80 years. We have had them, just not recently, and I doubt anyone who frequents the boards is old enough to have experienced them.
Hedges does the common thing, he takes a complex thing (human behavior and sex) and looks at it through a singular lens and arrives at only a single cause of what creates the problem. I agree with his take, but only if you then limit it to one aspect of the issue and not the whole issue. It explains some of the influences on modern sexuality and it's manifestation within porn, but it doesn't explain all of them.
For example, the issue of race in porn is super obvious and easily observed. It isn't necessarily in ALL porn, or even all porn with multiple races, but it does exist and there are thousands of examples that would back up most of his claims.
In a way, porn is useful as a way of highlighting the "bad thoughts" in society. It's already something that is inherently taboo, and often it delves into deeper taboos, or exploits them to achieve reactions. I don't point this out to say that porn is bad, rather that in some ways it can be a revealing mirror to hold up and expose the expectations and prejudices of society.
Thejeff: Google and wikipedia are your friends.
As I said, capitalism has problems. Solving those by digging through the utter failures of history is not an improvement. Blaming capitalism for things that were far worse in the economic system that is held up as THE alternative (planned economy) is dishonest.
Just as bad??? Seriously, how much kool aid have you drunk? Wake up. Think. Learn about daily life in the old Soviet Union. Preferably from someone who lived there.
Meanwhile, let us return to discussing porn, as we should.
What does any of this have to do with the topic?
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There has to my knowledge not been bread queues in the US.Well, there haven't been bread queues for 80 years. We have had them, just not recently, and I doubt anyone who frequents the boards is old enough to have experienced them.
As an aside, some iconic photos.
You Europeans and your stereotypes of the amber fields of grain. :p We've certainly had bread lines in this country.
However, there may be a distinction here between bread shortages (as is more characteristic of the collapsing USSR) and bread lines caused by sheer poverty (as is more characteristic over here). The former has not been as commonplace, what with said amber fields of grain and all.
Still happened, though.
More than once.
Recurrent in my Boston up through the early 1800s.
Bread lines became endemic in major American cities during the Gilded Age.
I'm not going to drown you in links, but there's enough to fill a book, not a post.
As bad as the USSR? Nope.
What does any of this have to do with the topic?
It came from the Hedges essay. There are useful linguistic elements of how communism/socialism talks about capitalism that lay over the pornography industry quite well, since it's talking about power and it's distribution.
Plus, this is an internet forum, we wouldn't be fulfilling our purpose if we didn't go off-topic as rapidly and as far as possible.
What does any of this have to do with the topic?It came from the Hedges essay. There are useful linguistic elements of how communism/socialism talks about capitalism that lay over the pornography industry quite well, since it's talking about power and it's distribution.
Plus, this is an internet forum, we wouldn't be fulfilling our purpose if we didn't go off-topic as rapidly and as far as possible.
I suppose....
Yeah, I've noticed Hedges's Presbyterian ministerism has really been coming to the fore lately....not to mention his political activism, his wartime correspondentism, his investigative journalism, his bestselling authorism, His Pullitzer Prize winningism, his socialism, etc etc etc.
Yeah. I'd hazard a guess I've posted more articles by Comrade Hedges than all of the rest of you put together, including his earlier one on pornography in the 50 Shades thread.
He's an interesting liberal.
Hmmm.. how would Powers Distribution work as a porn name?
Article I much preferred about the recent experiment in decriminalization of prostitution in Canada:
Just as bad??? Seriously, how much kool aid have you drunk? Wake up. Think. Learn about daily life in the old Soviet Union. Preferably from someone who lived there.
Meanwhile, let us return to discussing porn, as we should.
Hmm, yes... porn.... what about piracy by proxy videos where premium content gets splattered on free streaming sites?
It is tasteless to dump japanese eel porn on horrible piracy sites. After all, works of art deserve to be treated as such.
Hmm, yes... porn.... what about piracy by proxy videos where premium content gets splattered on free streaming sites?Just as bad??? Seriously, how much kool aid have you drunk? Wake up. Think. Learn about daily life in the old Soviet Union. Preferably from someone who lived there.
Meanwhile, let us return to discussing porn, as we should.
hm.
I am of two minds on it. On one hand, people should be paid for their time and things should be procured legitimately where possible. On the other hand,as someone who had been bilked by adult sites before, there are a lot of dishonest practices on the legit side of the industry that encourages piractical practices if only out of practicality. That said, the world is changing. With more actresses(and actors!) going on their own and offering everything from private shows to a chance to direct(sometimes these are the same thing), I continue to encourage people to be as legit as possible when seeking out material. If something piques your interest, seek out the talent behind the scene and become a patron.
If something piques your interest, seek out the talent['s] behind
sorry, couldn't help myself from quoting out of context and adding editorial grammar.
If something piques your interest, seek out the talent['s] behindsorry, couldn't help myself from quoting out of context and adding editorial grammar.
no, the original phrasing is correct when used in this context, provided my scene-specific vernacular is up to date. Talent is the word used be it singular or multiple performers.
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I'm denoting possessive in this instance, to make my misinterpretation clearer, with the assumption that "behind" means butt.
Aaaaah.
I'm sorry. I'm being too serious.
I could care less about your cynicism.
If I did, I wouldn't have made this post.
History shows pretty clearly that in countries with a planned economy, the poor are even poorer than in capitalist societies. Sadly, the rich people in a planned economy own relatively more than the poor too. The income cleft in the USSR was bigger than the worst of the US periods. Of course, capitalism is still worse evil, according to some schools of thought...
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During the times after the 50s in the USSR however, after the bad times had passed, even if they were poorer, wasn't everyone basically assured food and a place to live.
At least they had the necessities in that light, as opposed to capitalist societies where there is no safety net and you have people with no assurance of food or shelter.
I hear that's one of the biggest complaints some of the older people had was the loss of those assurances, even if the possibilities of having a more comfortable life or more amenities was far greater for the populace as a whole afterwards.
Not that I dislike the US, but the US today is hardly the capitalistic nation it was in the nineteenth and early 20th century, which is also true for many of the nations in Europe. A LOT of socialism and socialistic ideas (such as it's bad to let your citizens die of starvations and exposure in the wilderness or on the streets) have crept into the Western forms of government.
(PS: Yes it's off topic, but this topic actually interests me FAAAR more than the original topic).
The income cleft in the USSR was bigger than the worst of the US periods.
Heaven knows I hate to fuel a communism derail, but where was that past thread, Madame Sissyl, where I asked you about this claim and you couldn't substantiate it?
I assume that you, being more studious than me, have done your homework better. Were the income clefts smaller?
More studious? I dropped out of college three times.
Anyway, I just spent 20 minutes typing variations of "Soviet Union, USSR, Gini coefficient, income inequality, etc." into the search engine but I can't find it. Did I dream it?
I remember (dreamed?) that you threw down a number like .something or other and I google searched it and came across a source with the same number that included a disclaimer that said it didn't take into account such things as cradle to grave health care, free education, etc. and I remember Comrade Jeff chiming in, something about "Has there ever been a time in American history when the top only made 7x the amount of the lowest," etc., etc.
Any of this ring a bell? Or am I hallucinating?
I vaguely remember it too. Anyways, thejeff is right. Soviet was dirt poor, and I suspect there were reasons for it. Maybe even... their economic system.
Because Russia--before, during and after the Soviet Union--was poorer than the Western powers?
[Composed pre-edit]
Well, I am embarrassed that my Search Engine-fu has been found wanting, so I'll drop out of the Soviet income inequality derail and steer things on-topic:
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During the times after the 50s in the USSR however, after the bad times had passed, even if they were poorer, wasn't everyone basically assured food and a place to live.
At least they had the necessities in that light, as opposed to capitalist societies where there is no safety net and you have people with no assurance of food or shelter.
I hear that's one of the biggest complaints some of the older people had was the loss of those assurances, even if the possibilities of having a more comfortable life or more amenities was far greater for the populace as a whole afterwards.
Not that I dislike the US, but the US today is hardly the capitalistic nation it was in the nineteenth and early 20th century, which is also true for many of the nations in Europe. A LOT of socialism and socialistic ideas (such as it's bad to let your citizens die of starvations and exposure in the wilderness or on the streets) have crept into the Western forms of government.
(PS: Yes it's off topic, but this topic actually interests me FAAAR more than the original topic).
Having lived in Lithuania immediately post-Soviet, and spoken to those who lived there for years, I can definitively say that Lithuania was in a bad way and had been for decades by the time the USSR had released its grip.
We ministered to several who, due to the fact that it was (previously) illegal for people not to have homes... were imprisoned.
We ministered to many who were absolute alcoholics due to depression and lack of anything else.
We brought trained, aged doctors to the U.S., and brought them shoes-and-clothes shopping. After four shoe stores (when they couldn't find anything) we realized it was because the display shoes couldn't fit. At our request the fifth store showed them the back. They cried for quite some time.
We had translators and native guides who asked, genuinely, if fish came out of the faucets when we turned them on in the U.S. (this was, you know, a good thing, considering the water couldn't have been worse*).
* It needed boiling to become "not toxic" (and we boiled it several times and skimmed off the top in order to get out all the hardness impurities).
We had people ask us is Baptist and Jews really kidnapped and ate children. Some folks (and most places in one particular city) refused to deal with us because of this.
We were marked as Americans no matter how fluent or accent-free we were, because we were talking and smiling way too much (even when we thought we were quiet or subdued).
We saw many houses who had bountiful gardens... because they couldn't get enough food in the stores and had to supplement on their own.
When my father ordered soup, because he was American, he was considered rich and important... so they gave him "the meat" (the piece of meat that served as flavoring for the soup) which was about a fingernail in length and half that in width. This was cause for great excitement.
Universally, sentiments of those who lived in Lithuania during this time, is that things were better than they had been for the 50 years previous (with the exception of, in the first two years, a very few Russian-heritage citizens within the first two years who didn't like the linguistic change and two notably die-hard "communists" who vocally hated the "religious freedom" that we represented; after the first two years, however, almost all of those who didn't consider it better changed their minds).
------
In Cuba we met a pastor who had been under house arrest for most of a decade (you see, he was a pastor). We had secret police claim "seditious materials" that we'd handed out (the horror of American Baseball Cards and animal-shaped balloons).
In China (where I spent less than one full day), we were taken on a "guided tour" of Shenzhen, one of the "newest, nicest cities" in which we had many, many, many walls along the side of the relatively empty streets on our bus tour. This would not have been notable, except we came across one that had collapsed. What was behind is best described as a "slum" or "shanty town". There was a pretty big deal made out of said fallen wall (a large tarp was quickly pulled over the gap), and we departed the location immediately (which was half an hour earlier than planned). This was a very, very notable contrast to... Hong Kong.
------
I've lived in Lithuania, been to Latvia, Poland, Belarus, and Russia (the eastern edge only) and found absolutely nothing to commend "Communism"* ever to anyone. Those who were the oldest hated it (and suffered under it) and those who were the youngest hated it (and suffered under it). I spoke to many in Cuba who hated it. I saw at least a slum-full in China who... were not well off (by far, my weakest example, as I spent no real time there).
Yeah, no. I can say with absolute certainty that the supposed guarantees of those countries were rubbish, and that the wealthy (or perceived-wealthy) were treated differently than the "poor" and that most people had it pretty unpleasant lives in the USSR. Today? Can't say. China seems to be moving away from its staunch policies (this change appears to have come about after the acquisition of Hong Kong), and I've not been to Cuba in over a decade. Maybe everything's changed, in those places - certainly, in recent reports Cuba looks like it's doing relatively well.
Whether "Communism"* can work, or not, I don't know. None of those states who have ever striven for Communist ideals have ever successfully gotten there, and, from everything I've seen, it's been something of a nightmare in their attempts to get there.
This is, incidentally, not a push or vote in favor or whatever for absolutely no-restraints Capitalism. It is merely, "Those things the USSR, Cuba, and China supposedly did that were great? They weren't great." from personal experience.
* It's worth noting that, it's true, there has never successfully been a truly "Communist" country. They were all Soviet Socialist countries, part of the "necessary steps" toward "Communism". It sucked.
Anthony Bourdain had an episode of his current show in Russia, filmed just prior to the invasion of Crimea. It was interesting.
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During the times after the 50s in the USSR however, after the bad times had passed, even if they were poorer, wasn't everyone basically assured food and a place to live.
At least they had the necessities in that light, as opposed to capitalist societies where there is no safety net and you have people with no assurance of food or shelter.
I hear that's one of the biggest complaints some of the older people had was the loss of those assurances, even if the possibilities of having a more comfortable life or more amenities was far greater for the populace as a whole afterwards.
Not that I dislike the US, but the US today is hardly the capitalistic nation it was in the nineteenth and early 20th century, which is also true for many of the nations in Europe. A LOT of socialism and socialistic ideas (such as it's bad to let your citizens die of starvations and exposure in the wilderness or on the streets) have crept into the Western forms of government.
(PS: Yes it's off topic, but this topic actually interests me FAAAR more than the original topic).
Having lived in Lithuania immediately post-Soviet, and spoken to those who lived there for years, I can definitively say that Lithuania was in a bad way and had been for decades by the time the USSR had released its grip.
We ministered to several who, due to the fact that it was (previously) illegal for people not to have homes... were imprisoned.
We ministered to many who were absolute alcoholics due to depression and lack of anything else.
We brought trained, aged doctors to the U.S., and brought them shoes-and-clothes shopping. After four shoe stores (when they couldn't find anything) we realized it was because the display shoes couldn't fit. At our request the fifth store showed them the back. They cried for quite some time.
We had translators and native guides who asked, genuinely, if fish came out of the faucets when we turned them on in the U.S. (this was, you know, a good thing, considering the water...
woooooooooooooooooooooooooow...amazing experience.
woooooooooooooooooooooooooow...amazing experience.
** spoiler omitted **
Also, folks...we ARE here to discuss porn, yes. Other strangeness is what other threads are for.
Sorry, Comrade Freehold, but I must bow to Comrade Jeff's Google-fu.
[Bows]
(If there are any pornographic acts that you would like me to perform while I'm down here, just say the word.)