1. 4-5 is the most workable. AP's are written for 4, 15 pt buy.
2. 1st level. PF front-loads the classes, so they have plenty they can do (except take hits) at first level.
3. Rise of the Rune Lords, Burnt Offerings, is a good 1st-4th lvl AP. There are others, but this lends itself to an ongoing campaign. You might want to look at a Module (which is a one-off) vs an AP.
4. Hero Lab is a great tool, BUT you have to watch what Feats and so on people are using because HL will display everything that is in Pathfinder. I got burned by that when I started out with PF with players choosing Traits and things that were non-Core.
5. You have to tweak the encounters, usually by adding 1 or 2 more mooks and upping the hp's of creatures, especially if you have 5+ players.
6. Rogue is fine, especially if you are playing Core. It's all the new classes and archetypes that have taken over the Rogue's place.
Last: have the group help out by: tracking initiative; someone with the rulebook handy to reference things; etc. You don't have to do it all yourself! AND be sure to admit when you don't know something, and be flexible and willing to retcon when you may have got something "wrong."
Have fun - and intend that your players have fun as well!
Consider the Beginner Box - I know you have the core rules already but it comes with multiple short adventures, a more limited set of options, pregen handouts (if you decide to use them), and pawns and a printed map for the adventures. It's a few more $$$ but it's made for exactly this kind of situation.
The plan was to stick to the core classes, they seem to be the easiest/most balanced, with fairly clearly defined roles.
Thank for all the help :)
As frustrating as this is, this statement is completely untrue. The CRB is the most imbalanced set of classes Paizo has released. I would recommend at least opening up the Advanced Player's Guide for use. On a related note, the Rogue is only fine in Core if literally the only thing you expect your Rogue to do is disable traps.
I agree with others that it would be wise to start off with one or two one-off scenarios to acclimate the players to the game since they're all brand new. Crypt of the Everflame is good for this.
Rogue's get a bad name on these boards due to certain playstyles.
These playstyles don't seem to come out IRL as much as it may seem on these boards.
Unless you are playing with a group of munchkin powergaming optimizers on your first go, first time players probably will not be utilizing these types of tricks or playstyles.
That said, it doesn't matter if you are core only or use other books, if you have munchkin powergaming optimizers...they'll outclass the rogue and everything else regardless of which books are in use.
From your descriptions, I'd say it's VERY unlikely you'll even see this type of playstyle (and as I said, it's rare off the boards even with experienced players...so it's not as common as these boards make it seem). The players aren't going in knowing every nook and cranny and wanting to maximize every little thing (or even having the knowledge to do so).
AS for a module, Crypt of the Everflame is a GREAT introductory module. It is also part of a mini-Adventure path (Path to immortality) and as such, if you want to go further with it, you can by expanding it with other adventures.
As for number of players...it's already been touched on...for someone new GMing PF I would say that you should stick to 4 players...with a maximum at 5 if you go that far.
Once you get the rules under your belt better, you can expand it to more players than that.
...You don't really need to be a "power-gaming munchkin" to be disappointed when "hitting things at all" and "being able to use your primary combat class feature without putting yourself in a situation that will get you killed" are constant issues with your character selection.
...You don't really need to be a "power-gaming munchkin" to be disappointed when "hitting things at all" and "being able to use your primary combat class feature without putting yourself in a situation that will get you killed" are constant issues with your character selection.
You know these are first time PF players we are talking about...right.
And I haven't seen Rogues get into that situation to tell the truth, the most useful to use SA isn't from stealth, but from flanking, and with the right group that happens quite regularly.
Welcome! =]
I really like the AP's, but I'm not sure they're what you should be looking at to start with. Modules would probably be better to dip your toes in the water, so to speak.
Here are a bunch of good modules, many of which are on sale at the moment for only $2 apiece, plus shipping. There are even free pdf copies of some modules, designed specifically to bring new players in.
Good luck! =]
...You don't really need to be a "power-gaming munchkin" to be disappointed when "hitting things at all" and "being able to use your primary combat class feature without putting yourself in a situation that will get you killed" are constant issues with your character selection.You know these are first time PF players we are talking about...right.
And I haven't seen Rogues get into that situation to tell the truth, the most useful to use SA isn't from stealth, but from flanking, and with the right group that happens quite regularly.
Yeah, and my first time playing Pathfinder was a Core Monk. I try to make sure new players don't have the same sort of experience I did.
And I was actually talking about getting into flanking with my SA remark. Most situations I've seen where the Rogue gets to flank end up with the Rogue getting flanked.
...You don't really need to be a "power-gaming munchkin" to be disappointed when "hitting things at all" and "being able to use your primary combat class feature without putting yourself in a situation that will get you killed" are constant issues with your character selection.You know these are first time PF players we are talking about...right.
And I haven't seen Rogues get into that situation to tell the truth, the most useful to use SA isn't from stealth, but from flanking, and with the right group that happens quite regularly.
Yeah, and my first time playing Pathfinder was a Core Monk. I try to make sure new players don't have the same sort of experience I did.
And I was actually talking about getting into flanking with my SA remark. Most situations I've seen where the Rogue gets to flank end up with the Rogue getting flanked.
Ah well, sorry about that. Most GM's aren't jerks like that...sorry you seem like you might have had one.
Of course, if I were being a jerk, I'd kill off the spellcasters at the beginning of combat immediately with archers, and then kill the others...perhaps even leaving the Rogue till last (as without SA they may be less of a threat than the other martials even) and get TPK's regularly...but luckily for my players...normally I have the mooks and others focus on the armored guys first and am not out to massacre the party (can do it even to the most optimized...if they seem they are good against a normal CR...toss em against a CR 15 at level 1...that typically does the trick).
Rogues can get flanked occasionally, but a GM that does it constantly and always...is really just out to screw the rogue IMO...and from the brief description sounds somewhat like a jerk.
I expect the original posters of the thread are more normal and won't go out of their way to target the Rogues (or spellcasters or any other specific PC class they might have a grudge against).
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
1. What is the maximum number of players you would recommend? Considering that this is my first time as a GM, and the players would be new to Pathfinder?
4-6 is okay. I wouldn't go much lower than that either. Two few people also puts a lot of stress on the GM
2. At what level would you recommend I start the adventure? I feel that level 1 would be the easiest for me, but looking at the forums I get the feeling that most GM’s start their parties at level 3, to make it more fun for the players.
Start with level 1. If you look at a level 20 character that leveled from 1 to 20, and look at a level 20 character that was built at level 20, they will be vastly different.
3. With question 1 and 2 in mind, can you recommend me a free or published AP that would be suitable? Since this will be a short game (max 3 sessions, with the possibility of picking it up again later) I would prefer a free one, but realise that professional work comes with a price.
I would pick up Dragon's Demand. It's not free, but takes players from levels 1-6 (pretty sure it's 6) and is a REALLY good time.
4. Which tools would you recommend for the players to create their characters?
the only thing they really need is D20PFSRD. There are some free apps out there, and a cheap character creator that I used all through 3.5 days was The Only Sheet. It does Pathfinder now too.
5. What do you usually do to prepare as a GM?
Read the module and make sure you know the rules :) Really there's no short cuts here. Preparation is key. There are a lot of GM's that will say they wing it and are awesome, but in my 30+ years of playing RPG's the best GM who wings it, can't hold a candle to a good GM who's prepared.
6. Rogue was my favourite character in 3.5, but it gets a bunch of flack on the forums. Should I look into house rules to boost rogue, or is it viable in a core only team?
I hate saying this about any class, but Rogue's suck, and that's coming from a guy who knows monks are amazing. I say that so you don't think I'm just saying rogues are awful because that's what is hip and cool. They really are awful. Their damage is dependent on Sneak Attack, except there is no way to consistently get sneak attack. They don't get enough out of combat things to make up for their poor showing in combat.
I haven't given a lot of thought to it, but off the top of my head:
If a Rogue takes Weapon Finesse, they get DEX to damage as well for free.
If a Rogue isn't flanking give them a static precision damage equal to their level (this is what a swashbuckler gets). So if they're flanking they get, xd6 damage, if they aren't, they get their regular damage plus their level. All of it is precision so anything that stops that would stop both forms .
I think those might help, but again I haven't put a lot of thought into it so I'm not sure what the ramifications would be, or if even that would be enough.
The Rogue's biggest issue is with hitting things. Changing it to a full BAB class can go a long way towards making it usable without significant house rules. I'd also give it a to-hit bonus on sneak attacks equal to the number of sneak dice (so a rogue with 3d6 sneak attack gets a +3 to accuracy).