"homebrew" ninja archetype


Homebrew and House Rules


I want to trade away the ninja's no trace, uncanny dodge, light steps and improved uncanny dodge for the hungry ghost monks steal ki, life funnel, life from stone, and sipping demon abilities. It would look something like this. I'd appreciate any feedback.

hungry ghost ninja
01. sneak attack 1d6. poison use
02. ninja trick. ki pool
03. sneak attack 2d6
04. ninja trick
05. sneak attack 3d6. steal ki
06. ninja trick
07. sneak attack 4d6. life funnel
08. ninja trick
09. sneak attack 5d6
10. ninja trick. master tricks
11. sneak attack 6d6. life from stone
12. ninja trick
13. sneak attack 7d6. sipping demon
14. ninja trick
15. sneak attack 8d6
16. ninja trick
17. sneak attack 9d6.
18. ninja trick.
19. sneak attack 10d6.
20. ninja trick. hidden master

Another idea I've been tossing around was allowing Qinggong Monk Ki Powers to be picked up as Ninja Tricks. In both cases replacing uses of wisdom with charisma.


Dotted for interest! I like the ninja. I think it needs more archetypes.


Anyone with balance or fairness input?


Looking it over, it looks great. The Hungry Ghost Archetype is really flavorful (but not terribly powerful IMO) and fits the Ninja as an archetype well.

You are still going to have the traditional problems of the Ninja or Monk (difficulty hitting mostly). In this build using a wide crit range weapon (such as a wakizashi) would be advised. You'll get a lot of ki and I forsee spending most of it on Vanishing Trick and taking extra attacks.

Some may say you are trading a lot of defensive abilities for some more offensive abilities - and that is true. However, I think when compared to other classes occupying the same niche (especially Qinggong Monk, Slayer, Investigator, Sandman Bard, and Vivisectionist Alchemist) it does not threaten to overpower other options.

As a suggestion, if you are looking to get the Punishing Kick ability as well, I think trading your first d6 of Sneak Attack at 1st level and your 10th level Rogue trick would be a fair trade. (But I never thought it fit the archetype that well anyway)

-After writing the above I saw your comment about the Quingong Monk abilities as Ninja Tricks. I personally don't think there would be any problem with that at all. Many of the Qinggong abilities would fit a Ninja perfectly.

The overall power level would push it to equal the Qinggong Monk in power (as you are picking up his shtick) but it would be nice to see the Rogue co-opt something from another class rather than everyone just stealing from the Rogue. It would probably bypass the Sandman Bard in combat damage, and maybe the Investigator as well. However, I think it would still lag behind the Slayer or Vivisectionist.

All in all, I would let both ideas into my campaign.


White Templar wrote:

love:
Looking it over, it looks great. The Hungry Ghost Archetype is really flavorful (but not terribly powerful IMO) and fits the Ninja as an archetype well.

You are still going to have the traditional problems of the Ninja or Monk (difficulty hitting mostly). In this build using a wide crit range weapon (such as a wakizashi) would be advised. You'll get a lot of ki and I forsee spending most of it on Vanishing Trick and taking extra attacks.

Some may say you are trading a lot of defensive abilities for some more offensive abilities - and that is true. However, I think when compared to other classes occupying the same niche (especially Qinggong Monk, Slayer, Investigator, Sandman Bard, and Vivisectionist Alchemist) it does not threaten to overpower other options.

As a suggestion, if you are looking to get the Punishing Kick ability as well, I think trading your first d6 of Sneak Attack at 1st level and your 10th level Rogue trick would be a fair trade. (But I never thought it fit the archetype that well anyway)

-After writing the above I saw your comment about the Quingong Monk abilities as Ninja Tricks. I personally don't think there would be any problem with that at all. Many of the Qinggong abilities would fit a Ninja perfectly.

The overall power level would push it to equal the Qinggong Monk in power (as you are picking up his shtick) but it would be nice to see the Rogue co-opt something from another class rather than everyone just stealing from the Rogue. It would probably bypass the Sandman Bard in combat damage, and maybe the Investigator as well. However, I think it would still lag behind the Slayer or Vivisectionist.

All in all, I would let both ideas into my campaign.

that's how I've felt about the rogue/ninja and I think I love you


If I could get more support from like minded individuals my DM Will let me run free with it. Right now he's on the fence he's afraid of the scales of balance flipping


I am all for archetypes for the ninja class. Honestly, the samurai and ninja classes don't get enough love in my opinion. I am not entirely knowledgable on the hungry ghost monk but both the ghost monk and quingong monk's abilities fit really well with a ninja as long as you shuffle around some of the buffs and such like people have mentioned above. Seems like it could be a pretty neat little archetype to play with. Maybe make it so if you were to take a ninja talent instead of it being one of the ones currently allow you to take one of the quingong monk's ki spells as the ninja talent instead. seems like that could be pretty reasonable.


Tayse wrote:
If I could get more support from like minded individuals my DM Will let me run free with it. Right now he's on the fence he's afraid of the scales of balance flipping

Honestly, the overall power level of your group is really what will determine if you upset the balance. Do you know what the other people in the group are playing? That should tell us if you are going to "tip the scales".

I wouldn't think most groups where everyone has been playing for a little bit would be unbalanced by what you propose. With access to the PRD, there are a lot of far more powerful options out there.


We've played for a long while. my DM is arguing in order to gain ki power options for ninja trick options the class needs to lose something Despite my arguing it's not in inherently gaining anything it's just a book of combat feats for a fighter


Great news! My DM fully accepted and agreed to the Hungry Ghost Ninja with Qinggong Ki Power options. Now I need to completely redo my ninja plan because I didn't expect him to. Thanks for the support.

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