Now with all those feats, classes, archetypes, PrCs etc. what's the best way to make an unarmored and unarmed melee combatant?
I forgot to say preferably STR based but not necessarily.
Also about style feats, which styles would better suit such a character?
I am thinking dragon and pummeling.
Is there any way to have two styles active and use feats from both?
Oddly enough, Swashbuckler with a dip in monk can be effective and should be fun to play.
Kata Master and Master of Many styles stack. Master of many styles allows you to use multiple style feats at once and Kata Master allows you to use unarmed strikes in place of swashbuckler weapons.
Oddly enough, Swashbuckler with a dip in monk can be effective and should be fun to play.
Kata Master and Master of Many styles stack. Master of many styles allows you to use multiple style feats at once and Kata Master allows you to use unarmed strikes in place of swashbuckler weapons.
How exactly would this work? As a normal swashbuckler that uses his fists instead of a weapon?
I assume that this would work as a lightly armored DEX based melee combatant, correct?I'd recommend Sacred Fist with a dip in Master of Many Styles if you want an unarmed and unarmored combatant that uses both Dragon and Pummeling styles at once.
Very interesting, what about defenses? Specifically AC (since his saves + blessed fortitude + spells should be enough for the other defenses) defenses, are the WIS to AC and the monk deflection bonus to AC good enough?
How exactly would this work? As a normal swashbuckler that uses his fists instead of a weapon?
I assume that this would work as a lightly armored DEX based melee combatant, correct?
Yep. Just use fists instead. Generally this would be a dex build, but it doesn't need to be. If you are going to go unarmored though, having a high dex to improve your AC is a good idea. Monk will give you wisdom to AC also. Both classes are designed to have low or no armor. Eventually swashbuckler will give you level to damage. Opportune parry and riposte will help with the AC issues. Dodging Panache helps with that too.
What happens when you multiclass but both classes have the same mechanic?
For example how much ki pool does a WIS 18 sacred fist 8/monk 4 has? Does he have two separate ki pools? What about the damage die of unarmed attacks?
It's not going to be great, especially if you more or less ignore dexterity. But you can use things like Shield of Faith to buff yourself up with Fervor until you're a high enough level to have better defensive items.
And if you can get someone to either cast Mage Armor (or UMD it from a wand yourself) that would go a long ways.
I guess that you mention shield of faith for until such time that the AC bonus catches up, correct?
Yes UMDing mage armor (or giving a pearl of power to the wizard) would definetely help.Would 3 styles be viable? If yes what's a good defensive style?
Yep. Just use fists instead. Generally this would be a dex build, but it doesn't need to be. If you are going to go unarmored though, having a high dex to improve your AC is a good idea. Monk will give you wisdom to AC also. Both classes are designed to have low or no armor. Eventually swashbuckler will give you level to damage. Opportune parry and riposte will help with the AC issues. Dodging Panache helps with that too.How exactly would this work? As a normal swashbuckler that uses his fists instead of a weapon?
I assume that this would work as a lightly armored DEX based melee combatant, correct?
I don't think that WIS to AC is going to help a lot since we are already straining the ability scores (even in a DEX build).
Anyway, interesting build, thanks.
there isn't really a best im afraid. And the definition would need refinement because does using natural attacks or magic count as unarmed?
Sorcerers with natural attacks and magic be slashing, goring, mawing with 50ish strength and have 8th level spells. Likewise lunar oracles, druids, polymorphers, and anyone with form of dragon can put monks to shame. Heck you can even make an unarmed ecclisitheurge cleric based on trickery/deceptions mirror image to be nearly unhittable.If basic, no magic, unarmed combat is your style then monk is the standard.
Of course no to "no magic", but you are right on the others.
I meant an unarmed or lightly armored, preferably STR based dude who punches and kicks his enemies, so no natural attacks and no polymorph/wildshape.
Eldritch Knight. Focus on polymorphing yourself and defensive buff magic. I'm not sure if this is what you meant, but to me unarmored = Mage Armor and unarmed = either monk/brawler or 3+ primary natural attacks. The ability to cast spells for offense rather than melee is just gravy, but it might not be the build you are looking for.
EDIT = and this is why you refresh before you post...
@Renegadeshepherd
I didn't say no to magic, i said no to the "no magic", that means yes i don't have an issue with being a spellcaster.
Can you be a little more specific on that dragon disciple build?
Wouldn't the sacred fist/MoMS character have issues with his too many swift actions?
There's a feat tax just for that.
edit: sacredfisted
It's a pity that combat style master isn't a style feat so that a sacred fist could pick it up at 6th level, without that (assuming a 2 level dip in MoMS) a sacred fist can pick it up at 9th character level.
After a MoMS gets combat combat style master he can have both of his styles up with his first action and still have his swift, correct?
What happens when you multiclass but both classes have the same mechanic?
For example how much ki pool does a WIS 18 sacred fist 8/monk 4 has? Does he have two separate ki pools? What about the damage die of unarmed attacks?Ki Pool has an answer built in. You get the base that each class gives, but only add your Wisdom mod in once.
As for the damage die? Uh, no idea.
I think I have found the answer for that, the sacred fist gains the damage of the monk (which is higher than the warpriest's), so since the sacred fist uses his warpriest levels as monk levels for his unarmed damage then it makes sense that when he gains monk levels (of an archetype that retains the increased unarmed damage die) he gets to add his sacred fist levels and his monk levels in order to determine his unarmed damage die (it's essentially the same class feature).
the damage die is redundant and don't stack. You can choose which class to get the damage from.
That is correct, Chess Pwn.
I personally enjoy my theorycrafted Eldritch Scion 10 / Ninja 4 / Snakebite Striker 6, but that may just be me. (yes, unarmed magus)