Dafydd |
A trick I like is the Bodyguard pet Lookout feat combination. Basically, your pet gets to act in the surprise round, and you do too, always, no perception checks needed.
A hunter can be a decent switch hitter (though it is probally always better to choose one or the other).
Tengu is a good race for a hunter (dex and wis boost, con penalty, natural attack, proficient in 2 of the top dex weapons, ECB and Aldori Dueling Sword)
For STR based, there are all the fun/best options for 2H (Greatsword, Earthbreaker and a personal favorite - Scythe) as well as the usual sword and board style.
Either melee path, you will want to pick up Lead Blades as one of your spells. It is honestly amazing in terms of damage output and Hunter is one of 3 classes who can use it.
Kifaru |
3 people marked this as a favorite. |
All right. You want Paired Opportunists, Outflank and Pack Attack. At third level your companion gets all of your teamwork feats for free.
This combo will allow you to flank while the animal companion is next to you. The flank bonus will be +4. Any critical hits allows both the hunter and animal companion an AoO at +4, so get something with a good crit range and make it keen. An AoO on a flanked enemy is at a total of +8 for both of you.
One of you should get vicious stomp and one of you should get good at tripping. That's another round of AoO's. And the enemy on the ground is at a -4 to armor class. AoO on a flanked prone enemy is effectively at a +12 to hit.
Around 5th level pick up Broken Wing Gambit. When you are attacked by someone you've already hit once, it provokes an AoO from both of you as long as you are adjacent.
Archon Style does similar nastiness
That should get you started.
KutuluKultist |
Any critical hits allows both the hunter and animal companion an AoO at +4
To do this, you need the feat Seize The Moment, which requires Improved Critical, which requires a BAB of +8, as well as Combat Reflexes. Pack Flanking on the other hand requires Combat Expertise.
So, reliably generating AoO via crits will only be possible at level 12 for a Hunter.
Here's a set up:
1st Combat Expertise
2nd Outflank
3rd Pack Flanking, Precise Strike
5th Power Attack
6th Shake It Off
7th Spirit's Gift
9th Paired Opportunist, Combat Reflexes
11th Improved Critical
12th Seize The Moment
For the AC:
1st Iron Will
2nd Weapon Focus: Claws
5th Weapon Focus: Bite
8th Power Attack
10th Combat Reflexes
At 13th and 16th add Improved Critical for claws and then bite.
This way, by level 3, you'll always count as flanking when threatening the same target, triggering +4 to hit, +1d6 damage. That to hit bonus will allow you to use Power Attack effectively despite your 3/4 BAB, so that's next. Shake It Off translates into a +2 to saves for you and your companion. Spirit's Gift is probably the best feat to strengthen a companion.
By level 9 you get mildly useful stuff, but you need it to make full use of Seize The Moment at 12th.
Eigengrau |
Eigengrau |
As an addendum: a valet familiar (via Eldritch Heritage) or two levels of Fighter with the Eldritch Guardian archetpye will grant you yet another "character" which shares your teamwork feats.
I'm not finding the Eldritch Guardian archetype you're speaking of anywhere. Where is it located?
Kifaru |
KutuluKultis was was completely right about using Pack Flanking instead of Pack Attack. I was pulling stuff up from memory instead of looking it up. My bad.
That being said, Seize The Moment is unnecessary. Outflank, which a hunter can get for free at second level, allows your flank partner an AoO when you score a critical hit. You need to also have Paired Opportunist and the aforementioned Pack Flanking to make it all work.
Kifaru |
I have a build that pulls this stuff together nicely by level four, but it takes some dipping. The dipping will delay your spell progression, but you stated you were focusing on melee for this character so this might work.
Start with a level of Cavalier. There are a lot of cool choices. You get a free Teamwork Feat. If your animal companion can also be a mount, then you can start right here. You would need to be small and have permission from your GM to use a tiger for a mount. So lets throw that out and go Daring Champion Cavalier at first level and go from there. It works like this:
1st Level: Daring Champion Cavalier--Paired Opportunists, Weapon Finesse(via Champion's Finesse) and Combat Expertise. You can also grab one of the fun Cavalier Orders.
2nd Level: Hunter-- Grab your new fury best friend here.
3rd Level: Hunter-- Outflank, Combat reflexes
4th Level: Hunter-- Pack Flanking-- Go nuts!
Jodokai |
Unless you're really sold on a Tiger, I would take a look at the firepelt cougar. With it's 24 DEX (26 DEX with Animal Focus). Take Weapon Finesse and Agile Maneuvers, then use the alternate advancement so at 7th level it gets +2 DEX/ +2 CON.
A Firepelt gets an automatic trip attack. Technically you don't need agile maneuvers since weapon finesse allows you to use your DEX for your CMB as per the FAQ.
EDIT: Found the FAQ and linked it.
Eigengrau |
Turns out I was wrong about Seize The Moment, indeed.
Eldritch Guardian is a from Familiar Folio. at 2nd level it shares all combat feats with a familiar within 30 ft.
OMG! I forgot about the Familiar Folio coming out, I had it sitting in my downloads! This is awesome.
I'm getting a Sprite Familiar with the Mauler Archetype. At 9th level the Diminutive Fey will have a STR of 10 plus whatever size bonus increase from Diminutive to Medium will give it. This is so funny. Not sure how screwed the DEX on the Sprite would be now though.
Cult of Vorg |
You could start as a wild child brawler instead, avoid the Int requirement and get a couple more HP. Then your 3 hunter levels to get the teamwork sharing.
I'd go human, so you can get CE and combat reflexes or lookout at 1st, then pack flank and bonus outflank at 3, paired opp and teamwork sharing at 4.
You could have the AC take the teamwork feats too, until you get to share them, at which point pay the gold to retrain out of them.
I'd try Str 15+2, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 14, Cha 7. You could definitely drop some int or wis for 1 more str, but I hate doing that personally.
Rodinia |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
The discussion of a pet build centered around Combat Reflexes and Paired Opportunists confused Rodinia. Rodinia has these feats and a pet, yet uses them in a totally different way. They use those feats constantly to devastating effect. She and her axe beak mount both have reach, so foes provoke AoOs whenever they try to get close. We both take yummy +4 AoOs and wind up routinely inflicting lots of damage. Rodinia and mount seem to average about one paired AoO each per combat round. It seemed really weird that someone would suggest a martial pet PC have the feats Combat Reflexes and Paired Opportunists without both also having reach.
Obviously that won't help notty235 at all: his pet is a tiger,which lacks reach, and he has no intention of riding it. Just had to express surprise at seeing those great feats suggested in what seems such a non-optimal way. Perhaps I misunderstand, and AoOs will come more frequently than just critical hits.
Jodokai |
So, now I need 13int for combat expertise right?
How can i build a stat? I know that i need to dump cha but what to choose between srt dex & conI use tiger because of pounce. Is a wolf is better?
Or there's another animal that suit the build?
*tap, tap tap* Is this thing on?
Unless you're really sold on a Tiger, I would take a look at the firepelt cougar. With it's 24 DEX (26 DEX with Animal Focus). Take Weapon Finesse and Agile Maneuvers, then use the alternate advancement so at 7th level it gets +2 DEX/ +2 CON.
A Firepelt gets an automatic trip attack. Technically you don't need agile maneuvers since weapon finesse allows you to use your DEX for your CMB as per the FAQ.
Kifaru |
You could start as a wild child brawler instead, avoid the Int requirement
This would work to get Combat Expertise,but unfortunately not with Pack Flanking. Brawler's Cunning only waves the 13 Int requirement for combat feats and Pack Flanking isn't considered a combat feet. Ran into this issue myself. Luckily my PFS character hadn't hit second level yet and I could fix the situation.
Personally I'd dump strength and take one of the dex to damage feats.
It seemed really weird that someone would suggest a martial pet PC have the feats Combat Reflexes and Paired Opportunists without both also having reach.
Valid point. This build has lots of ways to get AoOs, but there is no reason to not take advantage of reach.
Kifaru |
Perhaps I misunderstand, and AoOs will come more frequently than just critical hits.
The build I put together doesn't really do much until 4th level and beyond. And it's only theoretical as my character is only second level right now.
At 4th level all you are really getting is the AoOs on crits.
At 5th level I think I should be able to get my AC Vicious Stomp. Combined with the Upending Strike hunter trick, that's a couple more AoOs. By this point my AC will have reach and I'm weighing my options on ways to get reach for my primary character.
By 6th level I should have Broken Wing Gambit and that should give AoOs on anybody I've hit once already this combat.
I'm considering taking Archon Style at 7th level but that may be overkill. Snake Fang may be an option by this point, and that just turns things up to plaid.
The classes are/will be:
Daring Champion Cavalier
Hunter
Hunter
Hunter
Monk(Possibilities are Flowing, MOM, Kata)
Lore Warden Fighter
Lore Warden Fighter
This build should work are a melee hunter, but as I said, it's just theoretical at this point.
Drogos |
With a 25 point build he can afford to just dump CHA and still have decent other stats. You need a 13 INT. It's likely good to have a 14 in STR, DEX & CON. Presuming you are just going to focus on casting buff and summon spells, you don't need more than a 13 WIS at 1st. I'd suggest stats like:
STR 15(+2 Racial or CON would not be a terrible idea for survival)
DEX 14
CON 14
INT 14
WIS 13
CHA 7
Lvl 4 increase into STR, Lvl 8 into WIS. Worry about the rest if you get to that level. Combat Expertise is your first level feat. If you choose Human, you may just want to take Eye for Talent to increase the main stat of your companion, or you can just choose INT and get a butt load of tricks for them.
claudekennilol |
notty235 wrote:So, now I need 13int for combat expertise right?
How can i build a stat? I know that i need to dump cha but what to choose between srt dex & conI use tiger because of pounce. Is a wolf is better?
Or there's another animal that suit the build?*tap, tap tap* Is this thing on?
Jodokai wrote:Unless you're really sold on a Tiger, I would take a look at the firepelt cougar. With it's 24 DEX (26 DEX with Animal Focus). Take Weapon Finesse and Agile Maneuvers, then use the alternate advancement so at 7th level it gets +2 DEX/ +2 CON.
A Firepelt gets an automatic trip attack. Technically you don't need agile maneuvers since weapon finesse allows you to use your DEX for your CMB as per the FAQ.
What book is allowing the use of this thing as a pet?
Cult of Vorg |
Well crap, reading fail twice. Very sorry.
Still think brawler start is nice, 2 extra HP and martial versatility and +1bab. 25pts so: s15+2 d14 c14 i14 w14 ch8.
Reach is good, definitely take combat reflexes for that. Lookout is nice too, but can probably wait for the others. Bardiche has reach with 19-20 threat, so that's my favorite weapon (barring that one old book with the fauchard 18-20).
The mounted axebeak is very strong, but doesn't work for my aesthetics. Primal companion hunter can give any companion reach and pounce. Seems crazy powerful, albeit just for a few minutes per day; eidolon with better stats and base abilities leaving more points for madness. Might be worth skipping the dip to not lose progression on that.
You could start as a wild child brawler instead, avoid the Int requirement and get a couple more HP. Then your 3 hunter levels to get the teamwork sharing.
I'd go human, so you can get CE and combat reflexes or lookout at 1st, then pack flank and bonus outflank at 3, paired opp and teamwork sharing at 4.
You could have the AC take the teamwork feats too, until you get to share them, at which point pay the gold to retrain out of them.
I'd try Str 15+2, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 14, Cha 7. You could definitely drop some int or wis for 1 more str, but I hate doing that personally.
Papa-DRB |
Drogos wrote:Iirc, firepelt cougars are identical to the small cat in the CRB.You don't remember correctly. They have more DEX, and more natural armor.
Well, in the RotRL (AE) they list Firepelt cougars as Bestiary page 40 which is the page with cheetah and leopard, so it is a reasonable assumption that as an animal companion you would use small cat. Also, there is no entry for specifically a firepelt cougar animal companion with starting stats.
Do you have better information than what you have said already, like starting stats, etc?
-- david