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So I'm looking to build a mounted cavalry-type summoner, and I've got some good advice going from another thread, but I have a few questions about the build and I'd like to get all my ducks in a row before playing the character.
1) if my mount Eidalon gets dismissed/banished/unsummoned, and I still wanna fight, I figure I could use my summon monster ability to grab a celestial pony, but are they suitable mounts/combat trained? The docile trait seems to indicate that they aren't, so would I have to be making handle animal checks all the time? If so, can I ride a wolf and not have to deal with that? Are there any combat trained mounts I can get from summon monster?
2) How does wheeling charge interact with ride-by-attack? Ride by says that I can continue my charge from the charge after attacking. Wheeling charge lets me make one 90 degree turn as part of a charge. Can I charge, attack, then turn 90 degrees and run off to set up for the next charge?
3) The Eidalon description says that some Eidalons are not equipped to perform some skills. Does that mean my Pegasus-inspired Eidalon (quadrapiedal base form) can't climb unless I give it claws?
4) on that note, if I give my Eidalon a climb speed, can it charge up walls? Or ALONG walls? Or does it need spider climb for that?
5) My summoner is going to be small (so that my Eidalon can be medium and fit in most dungeons.) I know that weapon and armor weight is halved for small critters, but what about saddles? Does a military saddle still weigh 30 lbs for a small critter and a medium Eidalon? Can I even use a Military saddle on my Eidalon? Does it have to be exotic even if my Eidalon closely resembles a horse? Can my Eidalon even wear any saddle? (given how they can't wear armor.)
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1. A summoned monster attacks your enemies. It's not trained to do anything else, nor does it come with any gear except as listed in its standard stat block.
4. A creature should be able to charge if it has a listed speed for the form of movement it's using and otherwise meets the requirements of a charge.
5. Footnote 1 doesn't apply to saddles, so I assumed for PFS the weight was not modified. You might convince your GM otherwise. I assumed further that staying on a mount that's using something other than land speed requires an exotic saddle. Something that has a body shape and motion much like a horse, pony, camel or riding dog could use a regular saddle. In either case they can be military saddles (an exotic saddle is probably custom-made anyway, or if it can use a saddle made for a horse, it can use a military saddle made for a horse).
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1. A summoned monster attacks your enemies. It's not trained to do anything else, nor does it come with any gear except as listed in its standard stat block.
4. A creature should be able to charge if it has a listed speed for the form of movement it's using and otherwise meets the requirements of a charge.
5. Footnote 1 doesn't apply to saddles, so I assumed for PFS the weight was not modified. You might convince your GM otherwise. I assumed further that staying on a mount that's using something other than land speed requires an exotic saddle. Something that has a body shape and motion much like a horse, pony, camel or riding dog could use a regular saddle. In either case they can be military saddles (an exotic saddle is probably custom-made anyway, or if it can use a saddle made for a horse, it can use a military saddle made for a horse).
1) except you can get the celestial pony, the exact same creature, through the mount spell, and you are clearly supposed to be able to ride those.
1) except you can get the celestial pony, the exact same creature, through the mount spell, and you are clearly supposed to be able to ride those.
You can ride them out of combat just fine, but unfortunately as they do not come combat trained you cannot ride them in battle. This is somewhat of an oversight for the mount spell: RAW it cannot actually create combat-ready mounts.
Summoned monsters are fine if they are intelligent creatures, you can command them to be your mount and they have a suitable shape for riding (which is up to the DM): this means finding monsters that are intelligent enough to understand your commands (otherwise they only attack your enemies) and sharing a language in common. In early levels these do not exist: the earliest is a medium elemental at SMIV, which your DM may veto (there is a ridable example in the bestiary, but what form an elemental takes when summoned is ultimately up to the DM).
A better idea would be to take summon good monster, which opens up the blink or foo dog at SMIII and then pegasus and unicorn at IV and V respectively. In order to communicate your desire for these creatures to act as your mount, you will need to speak celestial and sylvan at the least. You will be bareback riding obviously, as they will not appear with a saddle. However, you should be able to summon, command and fast mount one of these creatures in a single turn, making them a decent substitute for your eidolon. There is also no doubt that their forms can be ridden.
You're out of luck then, sorry.
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Mounted Combat feats are not required to mount something in battle.
What you need is Ride skill and a crap-ton of it because if you are going to try and fight on an untrained pony you will need to spend move actions every round to make a DC 20 Ride checks. This will be next to impossible to do reliably at low levels.
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1) You could certainly delay a mounted combat feat two levels to make room for a "backup mount" feat, but you also might not need a backup mount enough to spend a feat on it. In my first PF game we had a summoner who used her eidolon as a mount. Mounted Combat and Indomitable Mount, on top of life link and buffs, protected the eidolon from being forcibly unsummoned in all but about 3 sessions of a two year, level 1-15 campaign. Another option is to try UMD and a wand of Wartrain Mount.
2) This should work.
3) GM discretion. A horse-like eidolon probably won't be able to climb, but Mountain goats can climb steep slopes pretty well so some hooved quadrupeds might still make most climb checks (ropes and overhangs would be a problem).
4. A creature should be able to charge if it has a listed speed for the form of movement it's using and otherwise meets the requirements of a charge.
The requirements of a charge are that "You must have a clear path toward the opponent, and nothing can hinder your movement (such as difficult terrain or obstacles)." A surface that must be climbed is an obstacle and even if you have a climb speed it hinders your movement.
A creature with a climb speed has a +8 racial bonus on all Climb checks. The creature must make a Climb check to climb any wall or slope with a DC higher than 0, but it can always choose to take 10, even if rushed or threatened while climbing. If a creature with a climb speed chooses an accelerated climb (see above), it moves at double its climb speed (or at its land speed, whichever is slower) and makes a single Climb check at a –5 penalty. Such a creature retains its Dexterity bonus to Armor Class (if any) while climbing, and opponents get no special bonus to their attacks against it. It cannot, however, use the run action while climbing.
I wouldn't call this a clear no because burrow specifically says you can't run or charge, and climb doesn't explicitly rule out climbing, but the general rule of hampered movement is enough for a GM to decide that if you can't run (and even hustling is hard), you can't charge.
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I wouldn't call this a clear no because burrow specifically says you can't run or charge, and climb doesn't explicitly rule out climbing, but the general rule of hampered movement is enough for a GM to decide that if you can't run (and even hustling is hard), you can't charge.
While your reasoning is solid, I'd like to point out that flying requires checks (such as flying less than half your speed, say only 10 ft (enough for a charge)) and you can clearly charge while flying. I'm not sure if needing a check automatically disables charging. I mean, there isn't an 'obstacle,' in the way. And nothing is hindering it's climb speed.
Again, you have a good point, I'm just presenting a counter-argument.
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I wouldn't call this a clear no because burrow specifically says you can't run or charge, and climb doesn't explicitly rule out climbing, but the general rule of hampered movement is enough for a GM to decide that if you can't run (and even hustling is hard), you can't charge.
While your reasoning is solid, I'd like to point out that flying requires checks (such as flying less than half your speed, say only 10 ft (enough for a charge)) and you can clearly charge while flying. I'm not sure if needing a check automatically disables charging. I mean, there isn't an 'obstacle,' in the way. And nothing is hindering it's climb speed.
Again, you have a good point, I'm just presenting a counter-argument.
It's not that a check is required (though I'll point out that flying only requires checks to perform special maneuvers while climbing always requires a check). It's that:
(1) you can't run at all, and charging is similar to run in benefits and restrictions.
(2) when hustling / accelerated climbing at twice your climb speed, you can't exceed your land speed if it's slower than twice your climb speed; thus you always climb slower than your land speed.
Flying doesn't have either of these restrictions.
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I wouldn't call this a clear no because burrow specifically says you can't run or charge, and climb doesn't explicitly rule out climbing, but the general rule of hampered movement is enough for a GM to decide that if you can't run (and even hustling is hard), you can't charge.
While your reasoning is solid, I'd like to point out that flying requires checks (such as flying less than half your speed, say only 10 ft (enough for a charge)) and you can clearly charge while flying. I'm not sure if needing a check automatically disables charging. I mean, there isn't an 'obstacle,' in the way. And nothing is hindering it's climb speed.
Again, you have a good point, I'm just presenting a counter-argument.
It's not that a check is required (though I'll point out that flying only requires checks to perform special maneuvers while climbing always requires a check). It's that:
(1) you can't run at all, and charging is similar to run in benefits and restrictions.
(2) when hustling / accelerated climbing at twice your climb speed, you can't exceed your land speed if it's slower than twice your climb speed; thus you always climb slower than your land speed.
Flying doesn't have either of these restrictions.
Actually, charging is a double move with an attack at the end.
(Edit). I seem to have found the answer:
Action: Climbing is part of movement, so it's generally part of a move action (and may be combined with other types of movement in a move action). Each move action that includes any climbing requires a separate Climb check. Catching yourself or another falling character doesn't take an action.
. Seems that you can combine climbing with other move actions. . . Including charging?
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Can you combine climb with flying if you don't have a climb speed?
You can combine climb with other forms of movement, but only if you are capable of performing those other forms of movement. If you can't charge, you can't combine climb with charge.
If charge is a double move with an attack on the end, then run is a double move with an extra move or two at the end. In exchange for the extra attack/movement, both charge and run are restricted to movement in a straight line and can't be performed if your movement is hampered. They also apply defensive penalties (-2 AC for charge, loss of Dex for run). These restrictions and penalties set both running and charging apart from other movement.
You can't run or charge through any square that would hamper your movement.
You must move before your attack, not after. You must move at least 10 feet (2 squares) and may move up to double your speed directly toward the designated opponent. If you move a distance equal to your speed or less, you can also draw a weapon during a charge attack if your base attack bonus is at least +1.
You must have a clear path toward the opponent, and nothing can hinder your movement (such as difficult terrain or obstacles). You must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent. If this space is occupied or otherwise blocked, you can't charge. If any line from your starting space to the ending space passes through a square that blocks movement, slows movement, or contains a creature (even an ally), you can't charge. Helpless creatures don't stop a charge.
If you don't have line of sight to the opponent at the start of your turn, you can't charge that opponent....
You can run as a full-round action. If you do, you do not also get a 5-foot step. When you run, you can move up to four times your speed in a straight line (or three times your speed if you're in heavy armor). You lose any Dexterity bonus to AC unless you have the Run feat.
You can run for a number of rounds equal to your Constitution score, but after that you must make a DC 10 Constitution check to continue running....
You can't run across difficult terrain or if you can't see where you're going.