PFS Mystic Theurge - Assistance Requested


Advice


I’m looking to remake a 1st level PFS character. Currently it is an Aasimar of the Sovereign Court cleric of Abadar with a channeling focus, but I’m not really happy with the build.

I’m thinking about making an attempt at a mystic theurge. Yes, I know it is not the most powerful concept, but I am partially doing this to challenge myself. Things have been a bit too easy lately. ;)

Some of the personality is worked up. (This is unusual for me, I usually don’t have a personality until after the build is mostly done. But the stuff with the Sovereign Court rang with me. So I’ve got a noble working to reclaim the glories of the old days.)
Upper class – Possibly noble, but at least very sure of his own place at the top.
Hands are for hiring – Common things like fighting, killing, and healing are better done by those born to it. Managing/Directing the problem resolution is what he should be doing.
Noblesse Oblige – The world has been going to hell lately (figuratively and literally) because those of us in charge have gotten lax. We can only restore stability (and our place at the top) by resuming our responsibilities with a verve and completeness that will ensure understanding of the correctness of our position.

Therefore…
Buff, debuff, battle field control, and utility spells. Not direct kill or healing. Light armor since he intends to stay out of the fighting as much as possible.

My initial thoughts on build
Alignment would be neutral. He will generally behave in a good manner, but only because he is concerned about presenting the proper image of the Sovereign Court. Not because he is really interested in being a champion of good. Lawful tendencies since he wants to restore the proper world order, but will do what is necessary to accomplish his goal.
Cleric 1 / empyreal bloodline sorc 2 / mystic theurge 8
Cleric is a prepared caster for the spells that are useful today for what we expect to encounter. Can always be exchanged for a heal if I prepared the wrong spells.
Empyreal Sorc can spam the generally useful spells that are almost always needed.
Aasimar are one of the easiest races to get the early entry into MT.
Single casting stat of wisdom. So DC’s should still be decent though obviously not as stellar as a focused single class caster. And can still get survival stats and intelligence (for skills) into a useful range.
MT doesn’t advance channeling, so that will never be good anyway. Tired of being the face character, I want this guy more of a planner, so I can dump charisma.

I know arcane wizard has more of the ‘specific for today’ kind of spells than is on the cleric list and I prefer the intelligence casters. However, then I couldn’t have single casting stat and I am really learning to loath dealing with a wizard’s spell book. (I retired my wizard and will keep playing my magus. But after that I don’t think I will ever take a spellbook class again. Though in my home game, they are really encouraging me to play a witch because they like the concept I came up with.)

This is as far as I’ve gotten at this point. Any suggestion or critiques?


Looks fine. Make sure you take magical knack as a trait to offset whatever lost caster levels sting the most - probably sorc. Not much more to it, really. You clearly have a solid idea of how to build.

What are you doing for feats? I wouldn't recommend too much metamagic as you will be hurting for higher spell slots, and the usual crafting is out for PFS.


I had not got as far as the Aasimar heritage, deity, domains, or feats yet.

Although obviously the early entry to MT will restrict those (except the feats) quite a bit. I haven't looked through the lists of what works yet. I understand there is a guide for those that I will try and look through this weekend.

You have an opinion on which ones seem to work best for this type of concept?

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I adore the idea. I very much appreciate that you included your character's flavor as well, as it allows us to give you more direct advice, especially with such an option heavy class. Although you seem to have a solid idea of how you want to proceed.

As for specific advice, I would look at your routes of early entry first. You can qualify for early entry on the divine side easiest with either the fate inquisition or the trickery domain, which unfortunately limits your deity choices a little bit. You already chose Aasimar for your race, which can easily get you delectable arcane early entry. My favorite for wisdom based selection is Archon blooded for PFS, but Garuda blooded is splendid as well. Really the best choice would depend primarily on whether you think you'll be more likely to take damage, or attack things more directly.

You may also consider taking one of the domains that gives you Scribe Scroll as a bonus feat, as you're playing PFS and it will become Spell Focus. That allows you to get ahead a little more on your DCs over other theurge builds at the lower levels. This works wonders with your stat synergy between classes. There is also the option of taking a domain that gives you access to a familiar. The druid domains are technically open to clerics, even if this option is largely ignored. Not only could you get access to a great and functional pet now, but you could take improved familiar and upgrade it into a fantastic and functional friend later.

For buffing builds, I'm fond of the Flagbearer feat. It's effectively a +1 to hit and damage, making it slightly better than bless, but it stacks with inspire courage and it's always on. It's not much of a bonus, but it makes a great start and can mix well with the flavor of carrying the banner of your noble house.

Do you have a preference in how you would like to do your battlefield control? I know some would prefer to lean more on things like glitterdust, wall of stone, and create pit over rime spell flurry of snowballs. Both can work wonderfully, although a rod of persistent spell will eventually be an ideal purchase for both builds.

Don't forget that you can still wear armor! A haramaki and a mithril buckler leaves both hands free and incurs no arcane spell failure chance.


I don't think I want a familiar for this build. It would be stuck at the 1st level cleric abilities unless I burned a feat on boon companion. Even then it would only be at the 5th level abilities. I'm also not quite sure if it fits with my stuck-up noble personality.

I don't think I want to rely on something like rime metamagic for my battlefield control. As an MT, I will be hurting for higher level spell slots. So I think I need the spell to do it's job on it's own. I have a sorcerer that has been getting high use out of persistent grease, glitterdust, and spiked pit. So I guess I'd prefer different spells than those exact ones. And I'll probably eventually get a rod of persistent spell rather than the feat.

Yes, a haramaki and mitral buckler sound like an excellent idea.

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ElterAgo wrote:
I don't think I want a familiar for this build. It would be stuck at the 1st level cleric abilities unless I burned a feat on boon companion. Even then it would only be at the 5th level abilities. I'm also not quite sure if it fits with my stuck-up noble personality.

Fair enough, I've gone that route several times for the UMD uses of an improved familiar, but there is no point to investing in something you won't enjoy.

ElterAgo wrote:
I don't think I want to rely on something like rime metamagic for my battlefield control. As an MT, I will be hurting for higher level spell slots. So I think I need the spell to do it's job on it's own. I have a sorcerer that has been getting high use out of persistent grease, glitterdust, and spiked pit. So I guess I'd prefer different spells than those exact ones. And I'll probably eventually get a rod of persistent spell rather than the feat.

I'm fond of Ear Piercing Scream, Sound Burst, Battering Blast, Mad Monkeys, and Aqueous Orb as well. I'm mostly just fielding ideas to try and figure out what sort of battlefield control style you're looking for. Whether it's something debilitating and sudden or widespread and assured.

If you can't find another domain that really catches your interest, and healing doesn't seem that interesting, you might try the Evangelist archetype. Sure the inspire courage doesn't progress and that does hurt, but with Harmonic Spell, the low number of bardic performance rounds won't be a problem. I've played a mystic theurge that did fairly successfully that used Cleric and Sorcerer with the flagbearer feat and the Banner of the Ancient Kings to quickly throw out buffs to the party. The best part about Harmonic Spell is that as long as you're casting, it will never run out. It will also let you convert your prepared cleric spells into various enchantment spells. This may not be exactly what you're after, but it is another idea.


Hmm... Never looked at Harmonic Spell before. Sounds intriguing.

I've always wanted to give mad monkeys a try. I think that just ended up on the list.
Aqueous orb also sounds worth while.
Sound burst and earpiercing scream are staples and almost nothing has sonic resistance.
I can't find battering blast.

I have found a lot of parties don't like the big battlefield control spells like the walls, webs, and cloud effects since it could interfere with them also.

RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32

Revolving Door Alternate wrote:

Hmm... Never looked at Harmonic Spell before. Sounds intriguing.

I've always wanted to give mad monkeys a try. I think that just ended up on the list.
Aqueous orb also sounds worth while.
Sound burst and earpiercing scream are staples and almost nothing has sonic resistance.
I can't find battering blast.

I have found a lot of parties don't like the big battlefield control spells like the walls, webs, and cloud effects since it could interfere with them also.

Battering blast is from Dungeons of Golarion and is the favored spell of a local PFS arcane trickster. He has obliterated whole encounters with it at times. It doesn't seem too special on it's head, but the real winning feature is that if you fire multiple blasts at the same target you can get a +10 bonus to your CMB per additional blast, effectively crushing the CMB/CMD gap that tends to make these sort of spells lose effectiveness.

I understand that. It can definitely break up the effectiveness of certain party strategies. Battlefield control has to be used carefully to be effective. It makes it more difficult in PFS sometimes when our party isn't used to our abilities and ready to act around them. But then again, if we weren't up for the challenge, we wouldn't be playing Mystic Theurges.


Angry Wiggles wrote:

...

I understand that. It can definitely break up the effectiveness of certain party strategies. Battlefield control has to be used carefully to be effective. It makes it more difficult in PFS sometimes when our party isn't used to our abilities and ready to act around them. But then again, if we weren't up for the challenge, we wouldn't be playing Mystic Theurges.

I think more of the problem is PFS parties often don't have ANY party strategy. I will still be willing to take a few of those type spells, but not too many of them. Some of the guys in my home group really like to pile them on, making the battlefield into a layered labyrinth of various effects.

Silver Crusade

Nice to see a Mystic Theurge being trained. My next PFS character is a wannabe Mystic Theurge.

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