Paladin Smite Evil (Evil Outsider, Undead, Evil Dragon)


Rules Questions

Grand Lodge

"The bonus to damage on the first successful attack increases to 2 points of damage per level....

Does this mean
A} the first successful attack for the Smite -- this fight
or
B} the first successful attack each round
????

Thanks


A


The first successful attack.

Silver Crusade

Rynjin wrote:
The first successful attack.

???


Malachi Silverclaw wrote:
Rynjin wrote:
The first successful attack.
???

A in the OP's post.

Grand Lodge

Actually, the correct answer is: The first successful attack on this smite for this combat.

The Paladin can, of course, burn an additional smite use to get the bonus again in another round, but it uses their Swift to activate smite again, and one of their, usually, fairly limited number of smites.

Silver Crusade

Although the wording is pointlessly ambiguous, and is a change from the original text which doubled the damage bonus for those targets for every single strike, I find it difficult to believe that they nerfed it to such an extent that it went from every single hit to one single hit. It seems much more likely that they nerfed it to the first hit in each round.

Nerfing it to one single hit is rather pointless. If they were going to nerf it that hard then just take away the whole 'double bonus damage' text to save space. That would be much less of a nerf to the current ability than nerfing it from 'every hit' to 'one single hit'.


Not sure what's so pointless about essentially getting a free x2 crit (which is also multiplied on an actual crit) on your first attack after Smiting.

There's nothing ambiguous about this, hence my initial flippant response.

First successful attack.

Not first successful attack each round, or even this fight (that would imply that an enemy who escapes, but you track down before you recover Smites, would get hit for double damage again), your first successful attack after placing your Smite.


There's nothing hinting at rounds, just a rather absolute "first attack".
And also, Smite Evil is fine as is, strong but limited in usage. More free x2 would be crazy, as was initially.


What about manyshot? Do you get the double smite damage on both arrows or just one? The feat says that you apply bonuses such as favoured enemy to each arrow, but this is an always on ability.

I've always played it that both arrows get the extra damage as it is a single attack roll. This does mean though that higher level archer Paladins tend to drop any level appropriate enemy in a single round when smiting if using a bow with a strength bonus and deadly aim.

Grand Lodge

Earthpig wrote:

What about manyshot? Do you get the double smite damage on both arrows or just one? The feat says that you apply bonuses such as favoured enemy to each arrow, but this is an always on ability.

I've always played it that both arrows get the extra damage as it is a single attack roll. This does mean though that higher level archer Paladins tend to drop any level appropriate enemy in a single round when smiting if using a bow with a strength bonus and deadly aim.

As someone who's played a high level archer paladin applying that bonus only once, they still have a tendency to drop things in one round.


Malachi Silverclaw wrote:

Although the wording is pointlessly ambiguous, and is a change from the original text which doubled the damage bonus for those targets for every single strike, I find it difficult to believe that they nerfed it to such an extent that it went from every single hit to one single hit. It seems much more likely that they nerfed it to the first hit in each round.

Nerfing it to one single hit is rather pointless. If they were going to nerf it that hard then just take away the whole 'double bonus damage' text to save space. That would be much less of a nerf to the current ability than nerfing it from 'every hit' to 'one single hit'.

When the system was new threads proclaiming "Smite/Paladin" is OP/broken were being made at a faster rate than "rogues/monks" suck threads.

The intent really is once per fight.

One player landed a dragon in front of an archer and then complained when the archerdin murderized it because it was CR=APL+3. I tried to explain that the CR in the book assumes certain things and that when you downplay the strengths of a creature the effective CR is not as high. Anyway it is what it is now. There were other threads were the paladin's new found power surprised GM's and they were not happy about having to adjust their old 3.5 tactics for it.


Earthpig wrote:

What about manyshot? Do you get the double smite damage on both arrows or just one? The feat says that you apply bonuses such as favoured enemy to each arrow, but this is an always on ability.

I've always played it that both arrows get the extra damage as it is a single attack roll. This does mean though that higher level archer Paladins tend to drop any level appropriate enemy in a single round when smiting if using a bow with a strength bonus and deadly aim.

RAW both arrows get it since Manyshot is one attack but with two arrows. RAI it is probably the same, but I dont know if GM's actually run it that way.

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