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By the text of magic aura, it don't work:
You alter an item's aura so that it registers to detect spells (and spells with similar capabilities) as though it were nonmagical, or a magic item of a kind you specify, or the subject of a spell you specify. If the object bearing magic aura has identify cast on it or is similarly examined, the examiner recognizes that the aura is false and detects the object's actual qualities if he succeeds on a Will save. Otherwise, he believes the aura and no amount of testing reveals what the true magic is.
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If you make your Will save as Diego mentioned, and you can perceive the spell effect (in this case by detect magic), you can make a Knowledge (arcana) check for it.
There requirement are more stringent than that: it require Identify to be able to make the Will save.
Checking the area at range isn't enough, you meed to interact with the actual object.
well it also says "or similarly examined" so id say detect magic might work as well, or any effect that would in some way allow you to see the aura of the item
Identify does state, "this spell functions as detect magic, except that it gives you a +10 enhancement bonus..." so yeah, it's hard to argue that they are not "similar."
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well it also says "or similarly examined" so id say detect magic might work as well, or any effect that would in some way allow you to see the aura of the item
And it reference Identify, a first level spell, as the way to examine it. Not Detect magic. So "or similarly examined" should keep into account that.
if "detect magic" was enough it would have said: "If the object bearing magic aura has detect magic cast on it or is similarly examined, the examiner recognizes that the aura is false and detects the object's actual qualities if he succeeds on a Will save."Remember a thing: Detect magic examine an area, it don't target a single object, so you aren't interacting directly with the object that is the target of mage aura.
detect magic can both cover and area and an indeviduaal object, all you have to do is study said object for 3 rounds. identify is just a super focused detect magic. so detect magic should work fine, or id argue any spell the would allow the sight of the magic aura of what ever is being blocked.
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Lets make a different example of a higher level spell that refer a lower level spell:
Deeper DarknessSchool evocation [darkness]; Level cleric 3
Duration 10 min./level (D)
This spell functions as darkness, except that objects radiate darkness in a 60-foot radius and the light level is lowered by two steps. Bright light becomes dim light and normal light becomes darkness. Areas of dim light and darkness become supernaturally dark. This functions like darkness, but even creatures with darkvision cannot see within the spell's confines.
This spell does not stack with itself. Deeper darkness can be used to counter or dispel any light spell of equal or lower spell level.
and
DarknessSchool evocation [darkness]; Level bard 2, cleric 2, sorcerer/wizard 2
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, M/DF (bat fur and a piece of coal)
Range touch
Target object touched
Duration 1 min./level (D)
Saving Throw none; Spell Resistance no
This spell causes an object to radiate darkness out to a 20-foot radius. This darkness causes the illumination level in the area to drop one step, from bright light to normal light, from normal light to dim light, or from dim light to darkness. This spell has no effect in an area that is already dark. Creatures with light vulnerability or sensitivity take no penalties in normal light. All creatures gain concealment (20% miss chance) in dim light. All creatures gain total concealment (50% miss chance) in darkness. Creatures with darkvision can see in an area of dim light or darkness without penalty. Nonmagical sources of light, such as torches and lanterns, do not increase the light level in an area of darkness. Magical light sources only increase the light level in an area if they are of a higher spell level than darkness.
If darkness is cast on a small object that is then placed inside or under a lightproof covering, the spell's effect is blocked until the covering is removed.
This spell does not stack with itself. Darkness can be used to counter or dispel any light spell of equal or lower spell level.
You guys would support the idea that Daylight will be countered and dispelled by darkness as Deeper darkness reference Darkness so they can counter the same spells?
Undetectable aura say something very similar: you can make a will save if you use identify or examine the item in a similar way.
A lower level spell isn't examining the item in a similar way.
Undetectable aura say something very similar: you can make a will save if you use identify or examine the item in a similar way. A lower level spell isn't examining the item in a similar way.
Using detect magic while you handle and examine an object for 3 rounds does constistute "examining the item in a similar way" - that was one change between DD3.5 and PF.
I would agree with Diego Rossi if the wizard were simply using the area version of detect magic. But it also has this special application to identifying items, as described in the spellcraft skill:
Check: Spellcraft is used whenever your knowledge and skill of the technical art of casting a spell or crafting a magic item comes into question. This skill is also used to identify the properties of magic items in your possession through the use of spells such as detect magic and identify. The DC of this check varies depending upon the task at hand.
AFAIK, this is the only means to "similarly examine" an item. It works the same as the identify spell, without the +10 mod.
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Undetectable aura say something very similar: you can make a will save if you use identify or examine the item in a similar way. A lower level spell isn't examining the item in a similar way.Using detect magic while you handle and examine an object for 3 rounds does constistute "examining the item in a similar way" - that was one change between DD3.5 and PF.
I would agree with Diego Rossi if the wizard were simply using the area version of detect magic. But it also has this special application to identifying items, as described in the spellcraft skill:
Check: Spellcraft is used whenever your knowledge and skill of the technical art of casting a spell or crafting a magic item comes into question. This skill is also used to identify the properties of magic items in your possession through the use of spells such as detect magic and identify. The DC of this check varies depending upon the task at hand.AFAIK, this is the only means to "similarly examine" an item. It works the same as the identify spell, without the +10 mod.
Arcane sight and greater arcane sight is a way to examine the item with a higher level spell.
We always return to the same point, that no one has really addressed.
The spell call for identify, a fist level spell, to be able to try a save. People want to use Detect magic, a cantrip to get the same benefit.
Where a cantrip is similar to a first level spell?
Or it simply that the people supporting that idea want to use a unlimited resource to get the same result of a limited one?
i would agree that detect magic cant jsut see the aura of undetectabel alignment as its undetectable, but if you took the time to study the object for 3 rounds then id count it as similarly examined. why you examined it you would probly have a reason to do so like you knew what you were looking for was disguised to have an undetectable aura of some kind.
but fundimentally i have no issue with a cantrip solving issues at all.
have you looked at what prestadigitation can do as a cantrip!? poison is typically bitter right? with a cantrip and a slow acting poison you could quite litterally poison a king even if he has tast testers, or change your apperance in small ways to throw offf pursuers by changing the colour of your cloths. cantrips have more use than you think nd im cool with that.