Greater Bloodrage and Combined Spells

[Avoron]

Character: Bloodrager/Oracle/Mystic Theurge

Abilities: Greater Bloodrage, Combined Spells

Question: Which of the following spells could they cast on themselves while entering a rage?

A. Oracle spells cast using bloodrager spell slots.

B. Bloodrager spells cast using oracle spell slots.

C. Neither.

D. Both.

Greater Bloodrage:

At 11th level, when a bloodrager enters a bloodrage, the morale bonus to his Strength and Constitution increases to +6 and the morale bonus on his Will saves increases to +3. In addition, upon entering a bloodrage, the bloodrager can apply the effects a bloodrager spell he knows of 2nd level or lower to himself. The spell must have a range of touch or personal. If the spell's duration is greater than 1 round, it instead lasts for the duration of the bloodrage. This use consumes a bloodrager spell slot, as if he had cast the spell; he must have the spell slot available to take advantage of this effect.

Greater bloodrage counts as the barbarian's greater rage ability for the purposes of feat prerequisites, feat abilities, magic item abilities, and spell effects.

Combined Spells:

A mystic theurge can prepare and cast spells from one of his spellcasting classes using the available slots from any of his other spellcasting classes. Spells prepared or cast in this way take up a slot one level higher than they originally occupied. This ability cannot be used to cast a spell at a lower level if that spell exists on both spell lists. At 1st level, a mystic theurge can prepare 1st-level spells from one of his spellcasting classes using the 2nd-level slots of the other spellcasting class. Every two levels thereafter, the level of spells that can be cast in this way increases by one, to a maximum of 5th-level spells at 9th level (these spells would take up 6th-level spell slots). The components of these spells do not change, but they otherwise follow the rules for the spellcasting class used to cast the spell.

Spontaneous spellcasters can only select spells that they have prepared that day using non-spontaneous classes for this ability, even if the spells have already been cast. For example, a cleric/sorcerer/mystic theurge can use this ability to spontaneously cast a bless spell using a 2nd-level sorcerer spell slot, if the character had a prepared bless spell using a 1st-level cleric spell slot, even if that spell had already been cast that day.

[Calth]

I would say A, but not B. Normally you need a bloodrager spell in a bloodrager spell slot. However, with Combined spells, oracle spells can be treated as bloodrager spells if you consume a higher spell slot. This lets you cast them through greater bloodrage, as they are now effictively bloodrager spells and bloodrager spell slots. But nothing lets you change the spell slots from class to class, so only those spell slots you gain from bloodrager casting progression are eligible for greater bloodrage.

[Avoron]

Thanks, that's what I was sort of thinking too.

Now my next project is to examine the feasibility of using rage cycling (with allnight or a scarlet and green ioun stone) in order to cast cure light wounds on yourself as a free action. When combined with life link and fast healer, this could be a potential high level alternative to the Oradin concept, sort of an "Orager" I guess.

[Weirdo]

It's an interesting concept and I think it works as Calth describes, but it is pretty darn high level: 16th as a Bloodrager 11 / Oracle 4 / MT 1. And then because you don't have many bloodrager slots, you'd only be able to cast Cure Light Wounds up to 3 or 4 times/day using Combined Spells (or about the equivalent of a single Cure Serious or Cure Critical, plus a bit of a bonus from extra uses of Fast Healer).

Also, if you're an oracle/bloodrager, just take the Lame curse and become immune to fatigue no later than level 9 (oracle 1/ bloodrager 8).

As an alternative, you could play a Samsaran and add CLW and CMW to your list from the witch or bard list (depending on what else you want to steal). Then you'd be able to ragecycle heal right at level 11 (or 12 if you dip oracle for life link and the lame curse) and not have to burn a higher spell slot. Samsarans normally make poor martials due to their +2 Int +2 Wis -2 Con, but it might be worth it to get your concept working 4 levels earlier, especially since many campaigns don't last until level 16 in the first place.

[Avoron]

Wow, I didn't even think of Samsaran. It can be sort of awkward, especially because it's probably better to go into oracle anyway to get more life links at once, but I think it's definitely worth it.

And yeah, Lame curse does the trick, I somehow forgot about non-oracle levels counting for half.

Actually, this brings up an interesting question: Would you use your normal or raging Constitution score to determine the healing from a spell cast "upon entering a bloodrage"?

There are some simple ways to increase spells/day. If you can get a ring of wizardry 1 and 2 (assuming Samsaran), you can get Cure Light Wounds 5/day or 6/day and Cure Moderate Wounds 3/day or 4/day by level 12.

By level 15, you can get Spell Perfection, which can be used with Echoing Spell to essentially get Cure Light Wounds between 16/day and 28/day, depending on how many levels you put in bloodrager.

And of course, a pearl of power can also help things.

I think this concept could be worth investigating further. Probably won't end up being as good as the standard paladin build, though.