Serpentfolk not following the rules for disguise


Rules Questions


I've seen this so many times so I have to ask: Why do serpentfolk have disguise self as an at-will spell-like ability if they are monstrous humanoids? The description of the spell states this:

Quote:
You make yourself - including clothing, armor, weapons, and equipment - look different. You can seem 1 foot shorter or taller, thin, fat, or in between. You cannot change your creature type (although you can appear as another subtype). Otherwise, the extent of the apparent change is up to you. You could add or obscure a minor feature or look like an entirely different person or gender.

The problem I am having is that in the tactics for serpentfolk it describes them infiltrating by taking on humanoid disguises even though they are monstrous humanoids which, by the spell's description, doesn't do jack of anything since they are monstrous humanoids and not merely a humanoid subtype. They can't even use mundane disguises to look like humans since, once again, they don't share the same creature type.

I've come up with various ways to fix this problem. One of them was to exchange disguise self with alter self so they can appear as humanoids. Another was to give them a (Su) ability that allowed them to pass for humanoids using their disguise self ability or a disguise check.

You could houserule that serpentfolk can use this ability to appear as a humanoid but by RAW it doesn't work. Can anyone confirm this?

Liberty's Edge

That does seem to be an oversight. Alter Self would be a more appropriate ability, but maybe they got hung up on the mechanics when designing them. Disguise self purely effects appearance and perception checks to notice while Alter Self actually has stat modifications.

I would just houserule it as a modified version of Disguise Self that changes the caster to appear as the humanoid type.

Scarab Sages

Yeah. Alter Self would give them a STR bonus, which isn't appropriate for the ability. I'd just handwave the type limitation on Disguise Self as a blessing form Ydersius or something.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

The staff has addressed this before and suggested swapping out disguise self for veil.


The entry on the SRD says:

At will--disguise self (humanoid form only, DC 14)

Since specific rules override general, that would mean serpentfolk can use Disguise Self to appear as humanoids (and only humanoids). The wording is permissive as well as restrictive.

Scarab Sages

Serpentfolk use disguise self (an illusion spell) to appear as humanoids while keeping their monstrous humanoid qualities. They only appear to be humanoids, they don't actually change their type, because illusion spells don't produce actual physical changes. It's a disguise not a full change. A human character can use the Disguise skill to appear as a half-orc (with a -2 penalty), but that doesn't grant them orc ferocity or orc blood qualities. If it did, it would be a transmutation (polymorph) spell.
Alter self is a transmutation (polymorph) spell that actually changes the caster's type.
I think the disguise self spell just reads funny. I understand that the change is not actually physical but illusory. They don't actually change type, just APPEAR to do so. Bane weapons or favored enemy (monstrous humanoid) would still work against them. Someone with a successful Perception check might see through it or even a good Knowledge (nature) check may be able to see the reactions or mannerisms of a disguised monstrous humanoid compared to a natural humanoid.


John Mangrum wrote:
The staff has addressed this before and suggested swapping out disguise self for veil.

This seems to fix all of the associated problems. So I'll run it as:

at will - Veil (self only, humanoid form only, DC 19)


Serpentfolk were originally written as a 3.5 creature. 3.5 didn't have the creature type restriction on disguise self.

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