Engineer archetype brainstorming


Homebrew and House Rules

Sovereign Court

I've been wanting to make an engineer/tinkerer class for a while now, but there's a few other things I'm working on first - like my group's next campaign. In the meantime, however, partly as a stopgap until I can sit down and make a solid one, and partly as a way to playtest a couple of my ideas for it, I've decided to come up with alchemist archetype for the concept.
Basically, instead of using infusions and mutagens, the engineer would use various gadgets and inventions (respectively, more or less). My initial, general idea is this:

Gadgets: Basically repurposed infusions. A new "spell" list would probably need to be made since some infusions wouldn't work well, flavour-wise as gadgets and some spells that wouldn't work well as infusions would as a gadget. Otherwise, the mechanics would probably be largely the same.

Inventions: Taking the place of mutagens, inventions (or something like this) are what I consider to be the bread-and-butter of the engineer class/archetype. The simplest way to deal with them is to basically make them as copies of magic items, but with a few differences. First off, inventions, being primarily based off of science rather than magic, are either entirely immune or at least highly resistant to dispel magic and similar effects. Secondly, as something of a counterbalance to this, they are subject to the misfire rules of firearms (or something similar). Each time an invention is used, there is a chance that the gears or other mechanisms don't work quite as intended, and it may even break permanently.
Beyond this, I have two main ideas for dealing with this: engineers can make inventions just like any other magic item can be made (but probably get a more-or-less free one that only they can ever use), or engineers can make a limited number of inventions which expands as they gain levels, perhaps based on a total equivalent caster level of inventions combined.

The Inventions mechanic is the one that will really need balancing, and I may need to resort to just coming up with an entirely new system and even set of items just for it, however I'd like to avoid that if all possible. Simplicity is prerequisite for reliability.

So, these are my basic ideas. I kindly ask that you guys help me hammer them into something that might at least approach balance so that they may be effectively playtested.


https://sites.google.com/site/pathfinderogc/extras/community-creations/grea terthantwo-s-lab/engineer-alchemist-archetype

Someone's done something like that-ish. I hope it helps you as a kind of template for your future archetype!

Inventions don't have to be magic items too. Maybe stuff like... goggles that give you low-light vision, then dark-vision as you upgrade them and then finally a limited lifesense of sorts. Or maybe they allow you to make a knowledge check against a single creature as an immediate action once per round, symbolizing a kind of database of info he's tapping into.

Or like, automated turrets with a steampunky feel that shoot once per round. Perhaps as he upgrades them, they increase in damage and take less to set up. So at first one would take a day to set up, then an hour. Then a minute. Then the engineer learns to store them in mechanical unfolding capsules and can do it in a full-round action.

Perhaps he could have a firearm that acts like a lego builder. As a full-round action he can switch the standard firearm barrel for a different one, which can grant him an increased misfire chance, but effects like Keen, to represent long-barrel rifles, Fire damage and in a cone - flamethrower, shoot bombs at a greater distance - grenade launcher (also the most dangerous thing to use due to the misfire chance!), Electric damage - something like a plasma-like rifle thing.
As the engineer upgrades, it turns into a standard action, then into a move action and then the misfire chance decreases.

Or a jetpack! Giving him a low maneuverability limited fly speed and height at first. Then growing higher and higher. Perhaps taking a full-round action to wind up and activate at first, then a standard, then a move action, then a swift action!

Maybe a steam-punk armor thing that gives him resistance to all the elements. So at first it would be something like resist 3, then 5, then 7, then 9 and up to something like 15, perhaps. And while that increases, he could get additional features such as fortified armor (increased AC or DR) or an air filtration system, allowing him to breathe in environments he normally wouldn't and giving him immunity to various noxious gasses, or perhaps a small bonus to strength (no more than +2). Endless possibilities.

Perhaps you could also give him the option of making vehicles. Something like funky contraptions on wheels and steam, then progressively into cars, bikes and the final thing being a helicopter or a steam-mech.

Perhaps you could give him melee options, such as the iconic battlewrench!

Perhaps the variety of turrets such as healing turrets, explosive turrets, firearm turrets, mobile turrets...

Perhaps you could limit the engineer to either taking alot of these inventions in a small fashion, or invest in one or two at most while, but having nothing for the others. Perhaps you could then give the Engineer a Grand Invention, which grants unrelated things he can make, things that require you to have maxed out a single invention fully, or things that require you to have maxed out two, or just ones that you can take without having done anything else. Like inventing random, but useful stuff.

Yeah.


Gulian wrote:

https://sites.google.com/site/pathfinderogc/extras/community-creations/grea terthantwo-s-lab/engineer-alchemist-archetype

Someone's done that already. Hope it helps.

I'd still like to see that one made more dynamic, though. Maybe steampunk-feely auto-turrets and whatnot.

Dynamic? Autoturrets? What, like the Machinesmith?


The machinesmith is too magical, man. It's not manly enough.

Sovereign Court

That archetype is more like splicing in a bit of Gunslinger to the Alchemist, which isn't quite what I had in mind. Although, it reminds me that when I was saying "infusions" above, I meant extracts. Although it's likely you could figure that out.

Of course, the ideas that Gulian mentioned have certainly crossed my mind, it would require creating a new set of mechanics which I'd rather avoid. As any good engineer knows, the more mechanics you have, the more likely things are to fall apart. (While they know this, however, it is frequently ignored.)

That said, I do have some rudimentary ideas for how I would go about making such a system - probably granting the engineer a certain number of points with which to make an invention (which could be taken several ways - either like a summoner with their eidolon, or merely totalling up to figure out how difficult and expensive it is to build, some combination, or something else entirely). Certain effects and bonuses would be listed as continuous (low-light vision, bonuses to Climb or Perception...), or activated on use (attacks, bonuses to saves or Acrobatics...). But these are just thoughts that have formed idly in my head and are even further from being ready than the main idea, above.


One of our party is a goblin engineer, which is a hybrid Archaeologist and Grenadier, with the Improvisational Equipment and Improvised Defence traits, but it'd be nice to see something a created for purpose.

She does have Engineer's Workgloves, robe of infinite twine, traveller's Anytool, a tidy toolbox (a repurposed handy haversack), and it's a fun in game character.


I made a class not too long ago called the gadgeteer. You can find it here. You might be able to pick a few ideas from it.


Dotting for interest.


I was halfway through creating something similar for D&D 4e when my old group broke apart, Definitely interested.


Im also working on a similar idea.

Mine, they'll start with a constructed companion, using build points similar to the evolution points of the eidelon.
Spell list is tiny, but they also get a cleric domain using engineer as their cleric level.
6 " schools", which decide their domain.
Clockwork - Construct Domain
Elemental Binding - Corresponding element's domain
Enslavement - Soul subdomain

Depending on their school, their companion has different traits. Elemental resistances and vulnerabilities for the elements, no bonuses or drawbacks for clockwork (other than winding), and a higher chance of an enslaved spirit construct turning against you.

They'll have a smaller than normal spell list. Enslavement gains the wizard necromancy spells, Elemental-focused gets conjuration-(elemental of choice), Clockwork has no school limit.
Spells per day and known are -1 the wizard, with no bonus for high int.

"Spells" must be built into a gadget, which are built for 500 x spell level. All gadgets use rules for "timeworn", but with no chance of regaining charges. That spot on the table is replaced with modified misfire rules. (First time Broken, second time explodes, doing 2d6, reflex save for half..

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