Fixing Metamagic


Homebrew and House Rules


So, there are a quite a few issues people have with metamagic feats.

Some of the big ones are spontaneous casting time increases, broken feats, and the weird and arbitrary decision to nerf Maximize Spell despite it already being a suboptimal use of resources.

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While Quicken Spell was made available without additional feat investments in Pathfinder (which was the biggest limitation of the 3.0 metamagic rules), it still strikes me as inappropriate that it is more difficult for, say, a sorcerer to manipulate their spells than it is for a wizard.

After all, the sorcerer's small number of known spells are supposed to represent powers they have internalized, and can understand and control more thoroughly than any wizard of equal experience that is using the same spell.

Heck, in 5e, metamagic is a class feature of the sorcerer rather than a feat type, and is not available to other casters without multiclassing.

So, there are limitations on metamagic that aren't thematically appropriate.

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Meanwhile, certain feats are devalued due to a bizarre ruling that metamagic stacks in a manner least favorable to the caster. The only feats I can think of that suffer from this ruling are Empower Spell, Maximize Spell, and Intensified Spell. Intensified Spell is devalued because the extra damage dice are neither Empowered nor Maximized, and Empower Spell is devalued because the extra damage dice are not Maximized.

If I'm going to spend a 9th-level slot (or a 6th level slot and 54,000 gp), is it too much to ask for 135 fire damage instead of 70-120, average 95? On top of the lower save DC?

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But on the other hand, certain metamagic feats just bust the game in half.

The most common contenders for "most broken caster feat" are Dazing Spell and Persistent Spell (Spell Perfection also comes up, but only because it permits shenanigans with metamagic feats, such as free Dazing on chain lightning).

In a vacuum, Persistent Spell can work as intended. If a caster is not optimized for high DCs, then increasing the spell level by 2 to give them two chances for an effect to take hold is about right.

But it's usually combined with SoD/SoS that have high DCs due to optimization.

And Dazing Spell, especially with a metamagic rod or Spell Perfection, totally sweeps the floor with most encounters.

While the dazed condition is less detrimental than the stunned condition (you don't drop held items or suffer an AC penalty), many more creatures have stun resistance or immunity than daze resistance or immunity.

While a 7th-level wizard spending their 4th-level slot on a Dazing magic missile isn't broken, a level 18 sorcerer (or a lower level one with a metamagic rod) using Dazing chain lightning is quite broken, especially with Spell Perfection. Dazing a creature for 6 or more rounds on a failed save is rather heinous.

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Some fixes:

  • Spontaneous metamagic does not increase casting time. Arcane Sorcerers can instead spend uses of Metamagic Adept to achieve the same effect as the Metamagic Mastery ability of the Universalist arcane school. Uses per day are unchanged.
  • Arcane Apotheosis, instead of replacing Metamagic Adept, instead allows the sorcerer to use the level of the spell slot expended rather than the original spell level to set the DC of a metamagic spell. However, it is still considered its original level for effects such as globe of invulnerability unless Heighten Spell is used.
  • Persistent Spell gives the creature a +2 bonus on their second save.
  • Dazing Spell is limited to 1 round. Christ on a cracker.
  • Maximize, Empower, and Intensified Spell stack in the following order: Intensified, then Empowered, then Maximized.
  • And just to address a pet peeve of mine, Still Spell and Silent Spell should be folded into one feat. Bards still have to provide verbal components when using the feat, and can't use it on a spell without somatic components.

  • Grand Lodge

    I've always thought the feat tax on metamagic was unnecessary. What if metamagic worked like combat maneuvers? Anyone can try it, but it requires concentration checks. Actually having the feat makes it so you don't have to make the check.


    That...

    Is quite interesting and does have some potential.

    Though getting the numbers right will be very important.

    Grand Lodge

    Just a normal concentration check using the modified spell level? Prepared spell casters can memorize modified spells as per the normal rules, but they still have to make the check when they cast it. However, they can also attempt metamagic on the fly, increasing the casting time the same way it works for spontaneous casters (maybe with a +2 to the concentration DC just to balance them with spontaneous casters).


    I agree regarding Dazing Spell, mostly on Persistant Spell (I think it should be +4), Maximize/EmpowerIntensified, and your Silent & Still spell comments.

    Metamagic, originally (AD&D 2e), was a school of spells. It served two purposes:

    1. It granted spellcasters more versatility by altering spells on the fly; a spellcaster cast the metamagic spell and the next spell cast was modified by it, assuming it met certain conditions.
    2. It had a price - precious spell slots.

    I'd much rather see it return as a spell slot tax, removed as feats, and in lieu of something available to all with a Concentration check. Keeping Concentration checks relevant is very difficult; in addition, the number of tools available for Pathfinder spellcasters to bypass so-called "restrictions" is, at times, overwhelming.


    Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

    Agree on Dazing, also think Persistant should be +4, disagree on Max/Emp/Intensify and Silent/Still.

    One feat for Silent/Still is too easy. Although if +2 levels.. maybe.

    Stacking metamagics for damage gets out of hand very easily - and "the next 10 points of damage" is better than the last 10 points, when it's the one that prevents a whole round of enemy actions (perhaps all enemy actions) - so it's not diminishing returns in general, especially when it's a choice/resource to add or not add it.

    I also disagree about Sorcerers (spontaneous casters) - they can use metamagic MUCH more easily than wizards can, because they can do it on the fly, as needed, instead of deciding 1-24 hours earlier that they will need a particular spell to have metamagic. I perhaps agree that metamagic rods shouldn't require additional time for only spontaneous - probably should be required for all.


    I think that the mechanics for Metamagic rods are better than the mechanics for metamagic feats. In fact the rods mainly exist because the feats are unsatisfactory. Both feat cost and gold expenditure represent a significant investment of your character building resources, but gold expenditure is rewarded much better for some reason, especially given the affordability of some of the rods. Eating up high level spell slots sounds like a better balance than limiting the ability to times per day, until you think of the impact on the game.

    Usually casters' highest 2-3 levels of spells are the only ones making a big difference to the party in tough situations. Taking those away to power up lower level abilities usually won't do much more than breaking even with a properly selected high level spell. Caster's are going to provide the party with their big hat tricks less often and everybody has to nap more often. The adventure party becomes a sleepover party.

    Metamagic rods don't have a meaningful cost besides the gold you spend on them. Three times per day is way more use than most casters generally should get out of their Metamagic feats unless if they're spamming a single exploit of a low level spell (in which case buy two rods). True, metamagic rods are priced so that for most of the game you're only able to afford a rod that powers up spells that aren't your top highest level... but that's not any more restrictive than the feats. Rods are used to make your backup supply of low level spells more viable, while leaving your primary supply of high level spells in tact. Your not doing bigger things for the party, you're just doing moderately useful things for the party longer. Big dumb fighter and sneaky rogue don't have feel so narcoleptic, and the game becomes more about adventure and derring-do, than setting up camp watches in ever other room of the dungeon and seeing how much the martial character can do without magical support.

    SO... I think metamagic feats should just grant you some amount of free uses of their ability per day that only apply to spells of your highest level -X where X is the intended level adjustment for that metamagic feat.

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