themathwhiz |
[This is for a home campaign but I would like it to be a PFS legal character. Also, I apologize, this is my first post asking for advice so I’m not quite sure how to format this.]
Hey guys, just looking for some input on a new PC. Specifically which feats, spells, and skills would benefit him the most and what adjustments you would make to him. Thanks!
The only things I would really like to keep are the animal companion (Feather Domain), flag, and an interesting weapon like a net while being the best support character I can be. My basic goal is to buff attack as high as possible for my teammates. At lvl 8, I would like to have flagbearer (+1), Blessing of Fervor (+2), and Inspire Courage (+2) on turn 1.
Background: Shawn is a half-orc raised in the city (City-Raised) who was born with a longbow shaped birthmark on his inner wrist (Trait: Birthmark). While growing up, he apprenticed under Moody, the shaman, and learned the meaning of hard work (Shaman’s Apprentice). He went on to be a fighter (Trait: Defender of Society) but during his travels, he realized his love for nature and animals (Beastmaster) and decided to become a cleric of Erastil (Archetype: Evangelist). He has a pet kitty, Karen, who is too young to adventure with him (at the moment).
He is 6ft 10in 250lbs and would ideally wear full plate with a light shield. Both hands will have spiked gauntlets, one cold iron and one silver. His shield hand will bear a flag (flagbearer) and his right hand will carry a snag net (net adept).
Shawn will likely be super poor the whole adventure so I would love item recommendations, but mostly mundane or very cheap.
Ability Scores: (suggestions?)
Str: 10
Dex: 12
Con: 12
Int: 12
Wis: 15+2 +1 at 8th
Cha: 15 +1 at 4th
Race Feats: Exotic Net Proficiency
Endurance
1 Fighter: Flagbearer & Net Adept
2 Evangelist:
3 Evangelist: _____
4 Evangelist:
5 Evangelist: Boon Companion
6 Evangelist:
7 Evangelist: _____
8 Evangelist:
9 Evangelist: _____
10 Evangelist:
11 Evangelist: _____
The one level in fighter is for heavy armor proficiency, shield proficiency (which evangelists loose), and martial weapon proficiency so I can use my exotic net.
Feats that I am considering: Sacred Summons (lvl 7) & Divine Interference (lvl 11)
Possibly: Lingering Performance & Selective Channel (planning to channel when not fighting)
I am not currently considering the rest of the net feats.
Skills: I am taking 1 rank in Handle Animal at lvl 5 which will give me +9 w/ class skill (+3), charisma (+3), Beastmaster (+2) so I will never fail to give simple directions. The rest is up in the air.
Current thoughts on Spells
0 Detect Magic, Guidance, Create Water, Read Magic
1 Divine Favor (for my pet)
2 Pilfering Hand
3 Summon III (Chain of Perdition once I get Summon V)
4 Blessing of Fervor
5 Summon V
My main questions:
Do I need ranks in Perform(Oratory) to use the evangelist’s bardic performance?
What feats would you recommend?
Is birthmark enough of a divine focus to channel?
Can I cast somatic spells if my free hand has a spiked gauntlet? (dropping the net)
What skills should I put ranks in?
What spells should I prepare? (I’ve read the guides so I’m more asking for spells to benefit this build) Also, what are the best battlefield control spells available to a cleric?
Can I threaten with my net as a melee reach weapon with the net adept feat?
Can you “take” 4 on a channel out of battle?
Thank you all so much!
themathwhiz |
I forgot about kitty stats >.<
I'm thinking bodyguard archetype to boost party defense
1: Weapon Finesse
2: Combat Reflexes
5: Bodyguard
8: Adopted by Halflings, Helpful? (too cheesy?)
10: _____
13: _____ (if the campaign goes this far)
How important is it to get pets armor? and how hard is it to find exotic pet armor?
Ray-gun |
Looks like you have the basics down pretty good. If you do go the summoning route (not a bad idea) sacred summons is nice. So are spell focus conjugation, needed fo augment summons. At high level 12 or 13 might consider discordant note? Feat that adds 1d6 sonic to allies attacks. Your lawful good deity will let you summon some decent stuff at mid levels with sacred summons. Lantern archons and hound archons are decent until higher levels.
A couple other feeds to consider are Boon companion and craft wondrous item. A trait you might consider is fates favored. Might help when you try to hit something.
themathwhiz |
Wow Discordant Voice is awesome! I somehow misread it as dealing 1d6 once during the round I start singing to enemies within 30ft of me...
Augment summons doesn't seem to be too useful for archons, and I like Superior Summoning but is it really worth the 3 feats?
I'm definitely getting boon companion at lvl 5. Is craft wondrous item the most useful of the craft feats? I did consider a crafting feat since we will be quite poor,
What are some useful luck bonuses that fates favored could apply to? I think Divine favor was the only luck bonus I've seen and that's for my kitty (so a trait for me wouldn't apply).
I just realized that I wouldn't be strong enough to carry my armor with 10str...
Str: 14
Dex: 12
Con: 13 +1 at 12th
Int: 7 +1 at 4th?
Wis: 15+2 +1 at 8th
Cha: 15 +1 at 4th?
themathwhiz |
Race Feats: Exotic Net Proficiency
Endurance
1 Fighter: Flagbearer & Net Adept
2 Evangelist:
3 Evangelist: _____
4 Evangelist:
5 Evangelist: Boon Companion
6 Evangelist:
7 Evangelist: Sacred Summons
8 Evangelist:
9 Evangelist: _____
10 Evangelist:
11 Evangelist: Discordant Voice
Any thoughts on lvl 3 & 9 feats?
Magda Luckbender |
You have a solid character plan there! Here are a few comments and suggestions, from someone on Evangelist #3:
* Suggested tactic: Carry your flag on a longspear. Get AoOs vs foes who close with you. Then either 5' step or Move away (possibly drawing an AoO) to ~10' net range, take one hand off your spear (free action) and draw a net (part of a Move action). Throw the net for your Standard Action. Put hand back on longspear (free action). You now threaten the netted foe, and will probably get an AoO if they try to escape the net. Your flagbearer bonus is not interrupted, and you always threaten with your spear. Your STR 14 is just enough for this to work. This approach wants the Power Attack feat and/or the Combat Reflexes feat (probably still worth it with only 12 DEX).
* You might not want that level as a fighter. You might not need the extra 2 HP, +1 damage, and +3 AC in return for -10' movement. One can be quite effective with a net without even being proficient: one just needs to hit Touch AC +4, which is usually easy. By multi-classing you delay getting Inspire Courage as a Move action until 8th level, which will hurt. Multi-classing also gimps your spell casting ability and makes you less than a full caster.
* Neither of my flagbearer-style evangelists take a lot of HP damage in melee. If you use smart reach tactics you can usually get in your whacks yet rarely take a full attack in return. Some foes will choose to avoid your AoOs, aka stay away form you. Also, some foes will attack your mount, which soaks up HP. This all adds up to less HP damage. Thus, armor class is maybe not very important. YMMV.
* Perhaps consider an Axe-Beak as an alternate Animal Companion with your Feather subdomain. Ride it, but don't take any riding feats. The various published Animal Companion ratings don't consider that the axe-beak's reach synergizes perfectly with your flagbearing-longspear. Also, the AC ratings don't consider the huge boost an axe-beak gets from Combat Reflexes. Add the Paired Opportunists teamwork feat and your combined combat numbers get quite strong. This gives you some of the benefits of your companion's Combat Reflexes feat for free. You concentrate on spell casting and buffs, while your AC concentrates on melee effectiveness. At 5th level the pair of you get up to 6 attacks per round, all at 1.5x STR. By 9th level this goes up to a possible 11 attacks per round. You and your axe-beak together can inflict about as much damage as an optimized raging Barbarian.
* If you choose to ride an axe-beak you both have reach. Your attacks are weak, but your AoOs will will get an extra +5 to hit (+4 Paired Opportunists and +1 for height advantage). With both reach and such large bonuses you can safely attempt Trip and Disarm maneuvers. Your axe beak gets +4 on it's 4+ AoOs, too.
* A cat AC, with many attacks, will get much greater benefit from your buffs, but will always have trouble with DR.
* You don't need fancy gear. With just non-magical nets, longspear, light or medium armor, and possibly a buckler, you can be a melee terror. E.g. by 5th level, with your 14 STR, you can attack netted foes with your flagbearing-longspear at about +10 to hit for about 1d8+15 damage. At higher levels (8+) you can use Magic Vestment and Greater Magic Weapon to enhance your weapons and armor to +2, for free. A magical buckler works in combination with a two-handed weapon, such as your flagbearing-longspear.
* Your Birthmark is sufficient as a Holy Symbol for all purposes. That said, there's no reason not carry 5 more.
* A few magic items are especially desirable to you: Phylactery of Positive Channeling & Banner of the Ancient Kings. The Banner changes your buffs from +3 +3 to +5 +5. The Phylactery's +2D6 Positive CHannel energy is especially helpful with your high CHA and weak positive channels.
* You need 1 Rank in perform. Add more for role playing flavor, but there's no mechanical reason to do so.
* You can pull off some nifty tricks with Readied Actions.
Have fun with it! I've found this to be a very fun and effective type of character.
themathwhiz |
Sorry don't know how to quote things... =/
*GM said that longspear flag is something specific to banner of the ancient kings so I can't do that, BUT with Net Adept my net is a one handed melee reach weapon which he says I can threaten with (either before I throw the net or once I throw it I can continue to threaten the netted enemy) Do you know of a ruling that specifies that flags can be put on longspears? (it seems to be a balancing issue of bards becoming ridiculous) As for combat reflexes, I will be trying to position my pet between the enemy and I so that he can 1) bodyguard for me and 2) get AoOs without me having to take the feat. (he is also going to be way more likely to hit with his 20+ dex weapon finesse)
* I will have to re-evaluate heavy armor. Without net proficiency, I can't get net adept. Without net adept, I take a -8 to my attacks (after the first throw) since I 1) have to fold the net up in between throws, 2) it's a ranged weapon and I wont have precise shot, and 3) I would put my str points into dex meaning that I won't be able to carry multiple nets to avoid folding them up. I could just be human and take exotic weapon proficiency as my extra feat... but it seemed so efficient with boon companion to take a non-cleric level xD
* Axe beak might be awesome! But it would also make me want to take lvl 1 fighter as a dragoon >.< With an axe beak, if I can't find a ruling for longspear flag, I could potentially use a small longspear (one handed) at a -2 penalty. Btw, are axe beaks common around korvosa? My GM might make me go out and find one. which will be a pain if it dies =/ and we will be in a city for most of the adventure so... he doesn't fit through doors xD
* Even if I can use a longspear, can I hold a rope in my hand while I hold my longspear? Or are you suggesting I drop my net after a successful netting of my foe.
* What reason(s) would I have to carry additional divine focuses?
Thank you so much for your input! I've read many of your posts (which you linked to your other posts xD)
Magda Luckbender |
Sorry don't know how to quote things... =/
*GM said that longspear flag is something specific to banner of the ancient kings so I can't do that, BUT with Net Adept my net is a one handed melee reach weapon which he says I can threaten with (either before I throw the net or once I throw it I can continue to threaten the netted enemy) Do you know of a ruling that specifies that flags can be put on longspears? (it seems to be a balancing issue of bards becoming ridiculous) As for combat reflexes, I will be trying to position my pet between the enemy and I so that he can 1) bodyguard for me and 2) get AoOs without me having to take the feat. (he is also going to be way more likely to hit with his 20+ dex weapon finesse)
Too bad your GM doesn't like the idea. There's no official ruling on this either way. As GM I'd call it a slam-dunk to use a longspear to hold a flag. Here are a few historical reasons. The Bayeux Tapestry is a historical artifact that describes the 1066 AD Battle of Hastings. Note the many warriors, both mounted and on foot, wielding lances and longspears with attached banners.
As for this
You must hold the flag in one hand in order to grant this bonus.
If you hold something in two hands you also hold it in one hand. This 'one hand' clause is clearly there to keep one from doing this.
In terms of game balance, it seems like a non-issue. No one is claiming that either Bards or Clerics are over-powered. I've certainly seen assorted longspear-wielding Flagbearers in PFS play, and no one said 'Boo!' about it. It seems like how the feat is supposed to work, although people dispute this on the Paizo boards.
Of course, it's your GM's call.
* I will have to re-evaluate heavy armor. Without net proficiency, I can't get net adept. Without net adept, I take a -8 to my attacks (after the first throw) since I 1) have to fold the net up in between throws, 2) it's a ranged weapon and I wont have precise shot, and 3) I would put my str points into dex meaning that I won't be able to carry multiple nets to avoid folding them up. I could just be human and take exotic weapon proficiency as my extra feat... but it seemed so efficient with boon companion to take a non-cleric level xD
If you're certain you want to specialize in net use, then go for it and take the level in Fighter. Just be aware that you are giving up a lot to do so.
* Axe beak might be awesome! But it would also make me want to take lvl 1 fighter as a dragoon >.< With an axe beak, if I can't find a ruling for longspear flag, I could potentially use a small longspear (one handed) at a -2 penalty. Btw, are axe beaks common around korvosa? My GM might make me go out and find one. which will be a pain if it dies =/ and we will be in a city for most of the adventure so... he doesn't fit through doors xD
The axe beak is one of few mounts with reach. This animal companion only becomes truly outstanding when you ride it, wield a reach weapon, and both have the Paired Opportunists feat. In that situation it's fantastic. Combine with Narrow Frame for effective dungeoneering. Used otherwise it's a 'meh' animal companion.
Suggested 5th level Animal Companion Axe Beak feats: Combat Reflexes, *possibly Paired Opportunists*, and Narrow Frame. Any Large creature can squeeze into 2 squares (instead of 4), but there are normally substantial penalties. Narrow Frame allows you and your mounted pet, both, to fit comfortably in 2 squares.
* Even if I can use a longspear, can I hold a rope in my hand while I hold my longspear? Or are you suggesting I drop my net after a successful netting of my foe.
You can't hold anything in either hand while wielding a two handed weapon. It didn't occur to me that you would hold on to your net after throwing it. I thought the point of it was to inconvenience a foe, and to give you and your allies AoOs versus that foe.
* What reason(s) would I have to carry additional divine focuses?
Thank you so much for your input! I've read many of your posts (which you linked to your...
Why would one ever not carry spares, even if one is a Birthmark? E.g. You take a wound to wherever your birthmark is, and must cover it up to treat the injury. E.g. A foe Sunders your birthmark, rendering it useless until you get healed. E.g. You encounter a co-religionist who has lost their symbol. I've seen NPC clerics crushed after their holy symbol was sundered and they had no backup.