The Necromancer is first group material for me.
Yeah, wow. I'm having a hard time deciding where to go, but Necromancer is on the short list.
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After going through all these characters, I just want to thank everyone on the design team. There are so many new and interesting powers and designs here that I don't know where to start. Whatever comments/complains/confusion I may have, this is a fantastic job.
Necromancer is on the top of my list, seconded by War Priest
Contemplating using the Class Decks in our standard S&S play :D That necromancer can assist and decimate
I want my Darago mini.... Reaper get on this....
Is there a Darago in one of the npc codex boxes?
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Found him. Pawn 218 in the Codex Box....
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After going through all these characters, I just want to thank everyone on the design team. There are so many new and interesting powers and designs here that I don't know where to start. Whatever comments/complains/confusion I may have, this is a fantastic job.
You are not kidding...this whole set of characters is awesome. So many different and flavorful ways to explore even Rise of the Runelords, it's exciting! There are some characters in these class decks that have powers that seem specific to Skull & Shackles (even regarding defeating specific types of banes)...but a lot of others would be great to run through Runelords. So many cards now have useful traits...like Agna's powers with the Offhand trait - I can't remember...do Runelords daggers and whatnot have that trait? I mean, I'm sure cards of that type are in the class deck, but...
A ranger that starts with the Divine trait; another one focuses on two-handed weapons. One wizard has the Diplomacy skill; another has Disable and Stealth. A sociable rogue that uses allies...and uses for the poison trait! A fighter with the craft skill. There's just so much here!
And Seoni's Dragon Initiate role is a BEAST! Roll 1d6 + 8? If you have all the CHA boxes checked, that's +2 and +4...so +14 without any other cards! FORZARE!*
*Yes, I know Harry Dresden is a wizard.
There are so many that are cool... Even if I wanted to stick to playing Divine casters (my favorites in RotR by far were Lem and Lini, though I did hate *THAT* Kyra [new one is cool]), there are what, 10 new divine casters? Crazy!
There are so many that are cool... Even if I wanted to stick to playing Divine casters (my favorites in RotR by far were Lem and Lini, though I did hate *THAT* Kyra [new one is cool]), there are what, 10 new divine casters? Crazy!
4 Clerics
5 Bards1 Druid
1 Warpriest
1 Oracle
1 Ranger starts with Divine
=
13 new Divine Casters by my count
There are so many that are cool... Even if I wanted to stick to playing Divine casters (my favorites in RotR by far were Lem and Lini, though I did hate *THAT* Kyra [new one is cool]), there are what, 10 new divine casters? Crazy!4 Clerics
5 Bards
1 Druid
1 Warpriest
1 Oracle
1 Ranger starts with Divine
=
13 new Divine Casters by my count
Sounds about right, I wasn't actually counting them lol
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Any thoughts on Seltyiel, the Magus?...I'm just worried he'll have issues dealing with barriers and acquiring boons other than spells and weapons due to low skills elsewhere.
Seltyiel's Marauder role does have a powers feat that helps deal with barriers. I would tend to think that Seltyiel will be able to overcome the limitations that may concern you, if he's played smartly - although it might be wise for him to carry non-Attack spells to do so. A card like the Spyglass from Runelords would be really helpful for him, too, to avoid those things he can't deal with. On that same note, he might be better paired with Alahazra than Oloch, if his skill deficiencies are a concern.
I do have many more thoughts about Seltyiel, as I think I liked him the best out of all the Skull & Shackles characters, but for my own reasons I will not share them at present. Give him a try!
Trouble with Barriers? That's what 'tools and Abadars are for!
:3
Cleric deck list has Scrying 4.
Wizard deck list has Augury twice, once as B.
Guess which spells I like.
Cleric deck list has Scrying 4.
Wizard deck list has Augury twice, once as B.Guess which spells I like.
That's odd, the Bards have "scrying (3)." Its odd because I think, judging by the (B) on some cards, that it's the adventure deck number, not the number of copies in the deck.
That's odd, the Bards have "scrying (3)." Its odd because I think, judging by the (B) on some cards, that it's the adventure deck number, not the number of copies in the deck.
Yes, the number listed is the deck number, not the number of copies.
In the skulls and shackles card list, it has turtle as adventure deck number 6, but I think it should be "C" since it's in the character add-on deck.
I was just reporting errors that I saw. Like 'Sajan (Puppet Master)'on Radillo. Note that banishing a card to acquire to your discard (from that role) would be great in regular play but terrible in OP. The rebuilding rules force you to take Basic cards if possible after the one new card you are allowed, so you don't want to use it on class deck cards.
Wrathack has the best flavour text ever.
I assume you can't tick the "any Boon" on Zarlova before the "Blessing" one- but I'm now struggling to remember how the rules work on ticking feats- I know +1 always has to come before +2 etc, but i thought otherwise it was more flexible?
- for example, on the same feat - i assume we can take the +1, +2, before we take the "blessing" / "any boon" upgrades?
If they're adjacent, you must take the one on the left first.
[]You must take ( [] this one)( [] before this one).
Oops - looks like we've been playing that one wrong.
So, just to confirm, RotR Sajan needs to add magic before fire to his fists, and Evoker Ezren needs to add to Arcane with Acid and Cold before Electricity and Fire?
will have to re-read the rules thoroughly when S&S arrives.
After going through all these characters, I just want to thank everyone on the design team. There are so many new and interesting powers and designs here that I don't know where to start. Whatever comments/complains/confusion I may have, this is a fantastic job.
Start with thanking Tanis, who did the initial design on everything in the class decks. We all threw in ideas and helped with cleanup, but she's the brains behind this batch of awesome.
Wrathack has the best flavour text ever.
Now that you can thank me for.
What about Wu Shen's extra power if she picks Prey Hunter? (She gets a free power without paying a power feat. She has 12 power feat boxes already so I don't think it's just an omission)
Not an error. Prey Stalker has everything correct as far as I can tell.
There are so many that are cool... Even if I wanted to stick to playing Divine casters (my favorites in RotR by far were Lem and Lini, though I did hate *THAT* Kyra [new one is cool]), there are what, 10 new divine casters? Crazy!4 Clerics
5 Bards
1 Druid
1 Warpriest
1 Oracle
1 Ranger starts with Divine
=
13 new Divine Casters by my count
Damiel sort of half counts too, since he can get the divine skill for non-attack spells.
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16
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What about Wu Shen's extra power if she picks Prey Hunter? (She gets a free power without paying a power feat. She has 12 power feat boxes already so I don't think it's just an omission)Not an error. Prey Stalker has everything correct as far as I can tell.
Huh. I also assumed that must have been a mistake. Interesting...
How does Lesath's ability to display banished monsters work? Trying to figure out how this will be useful.
How does Lesath's ability to display banished monsters work? Trying to figure out how this will be useful.
Lesath can recharge a card to roll an additional d6 for each monster he beat earlier in the turn. The character rewards big turns where you take multiple explores and encounter a series of monsters, gaining larger and larger bonuses as you progress.
[edit] In addition, Lesath benefits immensely from characters that allow him to encounter monsters out of turn, like Razak.
How does Lesath's ability to display banished monsters work? Trying to figure out how this will be useful.Lesath can recharge a card to roll an additional d6 for each monster he beat earlier in the turn. The character rewards big turns where you take multiple explores and encounter a series of monsters, gaining larger and larger bonuses as you progress.
[edit] In addition, Lesath benefits immensely from characters that allow him to encounter monsters out of turn, like Razak.
Another use for Restoration (letting him get a big turn)!
:3
I love that card.
Another fantastic use for the best spell in the game!
I know you're the uncontested Resto super-fan, but you've got an acolyte waiting in the wings. My wife's Kyra grabbed two by game's end, and I don't think she really enjoyed her Lem play until she picked one up--he's especially suited for it, what with all his card recharging--and I wonder what her Lini will be in the hunt for once she and Seelah hit AP4.
Me, I was always a Augury man.
All of the interactions with monster cards across these characters seem really cool. I especially love a lot of the new characters' ability to display cards for buffs. I really thought there wouldn't be much left to surprise me, but almost every character had some mechanic that made me think "I want to play that." Bad enough to have 11 guys in Skull and Shackles to tinker around with, my life's gonna be empty knowing how many class deck characters I'll have to leave unplayed.
After going through all these characters, I just want to thank everyone on the design team. There are so many new and interesting powers and designs here that I don't know where to start. Whatever comments/complains/confusion I may have, this is a fantastic job.Start with thanking Tanis, who did the initial design on everything in the class decks. We all threw in ideas and helped with cleanup, but she's the brains behind this batch of awesome.
Wrathack has the best flavour text ever.Now that you can thank me for.
Well, then, further applause to Tanis. I know how long it took me just to get 6 characters, and I was really struggling to come up with new ideas by the end of it. Obviously, she had the luxury of some overlap, but there's also a lot new.
Also, I really enjoy a pattern I noticed in the class decks: it seems that each class has a 'signature ability' (Fighters help others on combat, Bardic Performance, Sorceror Spontaneous fireball, etc.) which 3 characters have some kind of variant of, and then there's a 4th character that fully breaks from that, but still feels thematically of that class. I don't know whose idea that synergy was, but it is very aesthetically appealing, at least to me.
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Also, I really enjoy a pattern I noticed in the class decks: it seems that each class has a 'signature ability' (Fighters help others on combat, Bardic Performance, Sorceror Spontaneous fireball, etc.) which 3 characters have some kind of variant of, and then there's a 4th character that fully breaks from that, but still feels thematically of that class. I don't know whose idea that synergy was, but it is very aesthetically appealing, at least to me.
There are definitely patterns in the class decks that Tanis used to make things awesome. I'm not sure they're all as easily articulated as that, but you're definitely onto one of them.
Another fantastic use for the best spell in the game!
Dang straight!
XPI know you're the uncontested Resto super-fan, but you've got an acolyte waiting in the wings. My wife's Kyra grabbed two by game's end, and I don't think she really enjoyed her Lem play until she picked one up--he's especially suited for it, what with all his card recharging--and I wonder what her Lini will be in the hunt for once she and Seelah hit AP4.
Me, I was always a Augury man.
I've got dozens of hours of play time on Lem and Lini, they're the two characters I enjoyed leaps and bounds more than the others in RotR. Both of them love restoration, you're right. Also bear in mind I like to play as a spellcaster on these characters.
Lem - Lem usually does best as a support role. His d8 Dex and d10+1 Divine/Arcane allow him to hold his own, but not really plow through monsters like the big ones, such as Amiri or Seoni. Restoration allows you to either prep yourself for a successful turn of exploring and not dying by having more cards to spend on combat (Incendiary cloud is great), or, more often, pump up a buddy. (My most successful campaign with Lem is a two person game where I play Lem and my buddy plays Seoni. Seoni slaughters everything and explores a ton, and Lem offers support. They work really well together if built right.) Because of his "mending" power, Lem often will avoid his recharge checks altogether or not mind if he fails them so that he can get whatever spell he needs the next turn; this makes Restorations biggest downside, the Divine 14 recharge, not so bad.
Lini - This chick is a total baus when built right. 8 spells and d4+x to everything she does? Yes please! She likes Restoration because she can not only hold her own in combat to make use of turns with extra cards in hand, but she can actually make that Divine 14 check (If you're going to go this route, I'd suggest a cat or two). There's not a whole lot else to say on the matter, really. She's just good.
Would you say Lem and Lini are the best overall characters in RotRL, or just your favorite to play? I think they are the most powerful, but take a little bit to reach their full potential, although personally I think Lini is really boring to play (oh, yay, a bonus to all my checks without having to do anything).
Looks like Lini in S&S loses her +yes to everything power, so I'm curious how she'll compare to the rest of the S&S characters.
Would you say Lem and Lini are the best overall characters in RotRL, or just your favorite to play? I think they are the most powerful, but take a little bit to reach their full potential, although personally I think Lini is really boring to play (oh, yay, a bonus to all my checks without having to do anything).
Looks like Lini in S&S loses her +yes to everything power, so I'm curious how she'll compare to the rest of the S&S characters.
Just my favorite, although I might tentatively offer Lini alone as the best character from RotR. Between six spells and how powerful her reveal animal ability is, she is very, very good. Lem is solid, but difficult to build so that he handles combat well while still exploring often enough. Like I said, he works best as a support role. Did I mention that the game with Lem and Seoni is one that we're doing with 8 locations and adjusted ratios of banes for higher difficulty? :P
I'd say the best characters in RotR are, off the top of my head but in this order: Lini, Seoni*, Merisiel, and Ezren*.
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S&S Lini is decidedly mediocre, in my opinion. If the choices were more limited maybe I'd use her once in a while, but... She's lost her powerful reveal ability and dropped down to 4 spell cards but has gained nothing special to draw you to her in return. I wouldn't say that she's the worst character, but with 47 (I think?) other characters to choose from and nothing "wow" about her, she's not exactly begging to be played. Which is a shame, I was really looking forward to a new Lini.
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*Not at the same time. A good deal of Ezren and Seoni's strength (in my opinion) comes from Haste, and there's only two of those per box (so far).
Would you say Lem and Lini are the best overall characters in RotRL, or just your favorite to play? I think they are the most powerful, but take a little bit to reach their full potential, although personally I think Lini is really boring to play (oh, yay, a bonus to all my checks without having to do anything).
Looks like Lini in S&S loses her +yes to everything power, so I'm curious how she'll compare to the rest of the S&S characters.
Just my favorite, although I might tentatively offer Lini alone as the best character from RotR. Between six spells and how powerful her reveal animal ability is, she is very, very good. Lem is solid, but difficult to build so that he handles combat well while still exploring often enough. Like I said, he works best as a support role. Did I mention that the game with Lem and Seoni is one that we're doing with 8 locations and adjusted ratios of banes for higher difficulty? :P
I'd say the best characters in RotR are, off the top of my head but in this order: Lini, Seoni*, Merisiel, and Ezren*.
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S&S Lini is decidedly mediocre, in my opinion. If the choices were more limited maybe I'd use her once in a while, but... She's lost her powerful reveal ability and dropped down to 4 spell cards but has gained nothing special to draw you to her in return. I wouldn't say that she's the worst character, but with 47 (I think?) other characters to choose from and nothing "wow" about her, she's not exactly begging to be played. Which is a shame, I was really looking forward to a new Lini.
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*Not at the same time. A good deal of Ezren and Seoni's strength (in my opinion) comes from Haste, and there's only two of those per box (so far).
what do you think lies behind the nerf? did they decide that RotR Lini was overpowered and just panic?
my wife played Lini in RotR, so I'd shotgunned her for S&S - now wondering whether I should just stick with original Lini.
Well, personally I think taking away that power made sense. Getting a bonus to literally every check you make by only having to reveal an animal is extremely powerful, but uninvolved, and lacks any serious consideration whether to us it or not.
S&S Lini is decidedly mediocre, in my opinion. If the choices were more limited maybe I'd use her once in a while, but... She's lost her powerful reveal ability and dropped down to 4 spell cards but has gained nothing special to draw you to her in return. I wouldn't say that she's the worst character, but with 47 (I think?) other characters to choose from and nothing "wow" about her, she's not exactly begging to be played. Which is a shame, I was really looking forward to a new Lini.
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*Not at the same time. A good deal of Ezren and Seoni's strength (in my opinion) comes from Haste, and there's only two of those per box (so far).
what do you think lies behind the nerf? did they decide that RotR Lini was overpowered and just panic?
my wife played Lini in RotR, so I'd shotgunned her for S&S - now wondering whether I should just stick with original Lini.
Let's slow down before we decide she was "nerfed" and look at what S&S Lini actually gained.
First, her ability to upgrade her physical dice got a ton better. She gets a d12 for str and dex now (insted of a d10) and gets to use that power on a recharge against animals and aquatic banes, which should come all the time in S&S.
Second, her ability to play animal upgrades got a huge boost. I can't say enough about how useful it it is to place cards on top of your deck. This means that S&S Lini is a far better explorer than her RotR version, and will gain additional benefits depending on the animals int he set.
Yes, she lost two spells, but she gained a weapon an an armor. Frankly, as a druid, this card spread makes a ton more sense. It also makes Lini far more viable in the early game than she had been before.
So, yes, she lost her boring and powerful ability, but gained some interesting stuff. She is still a solid character and actually more interesting and dynamic than she was before.
edit: I didn't even get into her advanced abilities, but it's worth noting that the ability to place a recharged attack spell on the top of your deck is character defining ability. Don't underestimate it.
Well, personally I think taking away that power made sense. Getting a bonus to literally every check you make by only having to reveal an animal is extremely powerful, but uninvolved, and lacks any serious consideration whether to us it or not.
CCD Heggal has the same ability, only it's "Diplomacy in its check" instead of "animal trait." This leads me to think that they weren't getting rid of the power due to its strength, but rather because they felt her other power was more integral to her character, leading the reveal ability to be the one replaced by her new power.
Also, you must remember the downside. At the very best, this ability cost you 1 card of hand size. At the worst, you're deciding between which allies to take, trying not to lose them to damage, etc. It's an ability very well worth the downsides, but it does have them.
Let's slow down before we decide she was "nerfed" and look at what S&S Lini actually gained.First, her ability to upgrade her physical dice got a ton better. She gets a d12 for str and dex now (insted of a d10) and gets to use that power on a recharge against animals and aquatic banes, which should come all the time in S&S.
Second, her ability to play animal upgrades got a huge boost. I can't say enough about how useful it it is to place cards on top of your deck. This means that S&S Lini is a far better explorer than her RotR version, and will gain additional benefits depending on the animals int he set.
Yes, she lost two spells, but she gained a weapon an an armor. Frankly, as a druid, this card spread makes a ton more sense. It also makes Lini far more viable in the early game than she had been before.
So, yes, she lost her boring and powerful ability, but gained some interesting stuff. She is still a solid character and actually more interesting and dynamic than she was before.
edit: I didn't even get into her advanced abilities, but it's worth noting that...
I'd agree that she wasn't necessarily nerfed, but she's certainly less powerful*... particularly to those who, like me, virtually ignore situational/specialized abilities. The vs aquatic/animals thing I consider a once in a while ability, not a most of the time ability, espicially since I'm evaluating characters based on all adventures, not just S&S.
Furthermore, the "transform into a bear" thing may have gotten better in a vacuum, but A) it's not that great of an ability to begin with, and B) it's actually weaker - you don't have that d4+x do back it up anymore.
Lastly, while some say the "keep an animal in your hand" thing is boring, I find drawing the same card over and over boring. Powerful, to be sure, but boring.
And while I'd call the spell vs weapon a wash, I'd take another spell over an armor any day on any character (even those without arcane/divine).
So no, she's not god awful terrible, but she's nothing to write home about either, I think. And everything she does someone else does better, in my opinion.
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*These may sound like the same thing to you, but I wouldn't say so. For one, you can still use the old one, she wasn't REPLACED with a weaker version. For another, they do different things now... they just happen to have the same name. I think the new one isn't as good, but I don't think they were trying to "nerf" her.
*Warning for GF, anyone else can ignore: Churr, this contains Druid spoilers, read more at your own risk.
Lini in S&S, much moreso than in RotR, is completely dependent on the quality of animals in the set. As long as RotR|Lini had any animal, she was happy. In order to be successful S&S|Lini NEEDS animals with good effects (especially ones with a power level that normally entails burying, like the Badger, since the power will always become shuffle in, no matter what it was to start with). Since I have no idea what animals are available, I cannot begin to guess how good S&S|Lini is, but I wouldn't be surprised if she's still good.
*Warning for GF, anyone else can ignore: Churr, this contains Druid spoilers, read more at your own risk.
Lini in S&S, much moreso than in RotR, is completely dependent on the quality of animals in the set. As long as RotR|Lini had any animal, she was happy. In order to be successful S&S|Lini NEEDS animals with good effects (especially ones with a power level that normally entails burying, like the Badger, since the power will always become shuffle in, no matter what it was to start with). Since I have no idea what animals are available, I cannot begin to guess how good S&S|Lini is, but I wouldn't be surprised if she's still good.
That's a fair point, if there are some bonkers animals that have normally debilitating downsides of bury/banishing, then her stock goes up a lot. But still... She's just not as appealing as most of the other characters.
Stop thinking about what S&S Lini can't do, and start thinking about what she can do.
Think for a moment, about how Toad works with with S&S Lini. That interaction alone should start to make combo players start to salivate.
I'd agree that she wasn't necessarily nerfed, but she's certainly less powerful*... particularly to those who, like me, virtually ignore situational/specialized abilities. The vs aquatic/animals thing I consider a once in a while ability, not a most of the time ability, espicially since I'm evaluating characters based on all adventures, not just S&S.
Furthermore, the "transform into a bear" thing may have gotten better in a vacuum, but A) it's not that great of an ability to begin with, and B) it's actually weaker - you don't have that d4+x do back it up anymore.
Fair enough, but if S&S Lini has huge beneficent against the S&S set, I don't think you can simply dismiss her as less powerful. Those conditions will come up a ton (sharks... all of those sharks), and even if you don't want to rely on random chance, it means that S&S Lini benefits more from scouting.
As you point out, the transforms mechanic in RotR Lini sort of sucked. The S&S version is marginally better on the surface, and has the potential to become a lot better if you build a deck/team to exploit it. It requires more creative deck building than the RorR version of lini, which relied on 1d4+x and was very powerful and very boring.
I would give new Lini a chance. If she gets good animals, she could be a powerhouse. Even if you play her with non-S&S scenarios cards like toad mean that can reliably cast any spell in your hand every single turn. If that doesn't count as powerful, I don't know what is.
Stop thinking about what S&S Lini can't do, and start thinking about what she can do.
Think for a moment, about how Toad works with with S&S Lini. That interaction alone should start to make combo players start to salivate.
can someone remind me of the text on toad?
can someone remind me of the text on toad?Stop thinking about what S&S Lini can't do, and start thinking about what she can do.
Think for a moment, about how Toad works with with S&S Lini. That interaction alone should start to make combo players start to salivate.
"Bury this card to put a spell from your discard pile into your hand."
can someone remind me of the text on toad?Stop thinking about what S&S Lini can't do, and start thinking about what she can do.
Think for a moment, about how Toad works with with S&S Lini. That interaction alone should start to make combo players start to salivate.
It's the weaker, but easier to acquire, Robe of Runes.
Bury this card to add a spell card from your discard pile to your hand.
Discard this card to explore your location.
can someone remind me of the text on toad?Stop thinking about what S&S Lini can't do, and start thinking about what she can do.
Think for a moment, about how Toad works with with S&S Lini. That interaction alone should start to make combo players start to salivate.
Toad (roughly, I don't have it in front of me):
Bury this card to return a spell from your discard pile to your hand.
Discard this card to explore your location.
(You can see why it's being brought up. It perfectly illustrates the potential here.)
can someone remind me of the text on toad?Stop thinking about what S&S Lini can't do, and start thinking about what she can do.
Think for a moment, about how Toad works with with S&S Lini. That interaction alone should start to make combo players start to salivate.
Bury this card to put a spell from your discard pile into your hand.
EDIT: super ninja'ed!
Aquatic trait in S&S:
Edit: Also, there's no toad in S&S.
If you can put toad on top of your deck, it's ability to grab cards is far superior to robe of runes.
Alright, so I'm mildly convinced. Toad does work great with her, leading to another reason for the Restoration Errata.
I still stand by her being weaker than RotR Lini, and there's still a lot of characters I'd put above her, but I'm more convinced that she's of value.
No toad in S&S is a hard pill for her to swallow, though.
Edit: Also, there's no toad in S&S.
Wasn't toad in deck 2, though? No reason to rule the little guy out yet ;-)
Wasn't toad in deck 2, though? No reason to rule the little guy out yet ;-)Edit: Also, there's no toad in S&S.
The character sheets have a list of all boons. There are no toads in S&S.