Question about empty hand monk


Advice

Grand Lodge

Hey, I just started working up a monk of the empty hand, and I was wondering if they were automatically considered proficient with Improvised weapons (I.E. no penalties for using them), and if there was any official verdict on this question.

The text of the class would suggest it, but I can't see anywhere that it says they are, and the "proficient only with shurikens" bit makes me wonder.

I'm using catch off guard right now just because I don't want to go to a new GM and have him tell me my main weapons are off the table due to lacking proficiency, but I don't want to waste the feat if I don't have to, and as I'm still level one with this character, I still can respect that feat into something more useful.

Lantern Lodge

I'm also making an empty hand monk character too.

From the text, it seems while you are given the ability to use any normal weapon as an improvised weapon (with specific damage types), aka you can use a dagger and it will functions as a light hammer for a monk of the empty hand.
You still suffer the penalties of using an improvised weapon. Meaning you must pick up Catch off Guard or Throw Anything to use improvised weapons properly at level.

It can be assumed that since Catch off Guard and Throw Anything are on a monk's list of bonus feats. You are expected to pick them up via bonus feats.

A precedent could be seen in the Zen Archer archetype. Zen Archer adds the Precise Shot, and Rapid Shot feats (2 of the very basic archery feats) to the list of bonus monk feats, but don't just "give" them to you.

Since Monk of the Empty Hand uses improvised weapons and those are already on the bonus feats list, no extra feats were added at lvl 1.
Improved Dirty Trick*, Improved Steal*, and Improvised Weapon Mastery are missing and those are added at lv 6.

Scarab Sages

Per James Jacobs, they do not need Catch Off Guard.

As always, JJ is not a rules guy and this is not an official FAQ, so YMMV.

Edit: Catch off guard is still worthwhile for a Monk of the Empty Hand, because of the ability to treat unarmed opponents as flatfooted. Combine with disarm or stunning fist, and it's a great way to improve your accuracy.

Lantern Lodge

@Imbicatus,

I did post a follow up question to JJ, but I think when he made that post, there may be some differences between that ideal for that archetype and what actually got into print.

Cos what got into print is the ability for Monks of the Empty hand to use normal weapons as improvised weapons, but any part that might have clarify that the monk of EH does not requires Catch Off Guard, seems to be missing... :(

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