Question about Frugal Crafting Feat Interpretation

[RaizielDragon]

While looking over ideas for a character, I found this feat:

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/3rd-party-feats/kobold-press/general-feats--- 3rd-party---kobold-press/frugal-crafting

It states that "the cost of creating magic items is reduced to 1/3 its base cost in raw materials." This is of course a reduction in cost from the normal 1/2 the base cost in raw materials.

Other similar cost reductions are typically stated as a percentage reduction in the cost, such as 5%, 10%, 25%, etc. So, a 5% reduction of something that should cost 1000gp to create would instead cost 950gp, since 5% of 1000gp is 50gp and 1000gp-50gp=950gp. They also stack, so if you have 2 abilities that each reduce the cost by 5%, the 1000gp item in question would be reduced by 100gp.

My question is on the interpretation of Frugal Crafting, and how you would apply the cost reduction.

Interpretation 1 would be to treat it the same way any other cost reduction is used. Reducing the cost from 1/2 base cost to 1/3 the base cost is a reduction of 1/6, or approximately 16.67%. This means that if you combined it with the two abilities mentioned above, that each reduce cost by 5%, you'd have a total cost reduction of ~26.67%. This would make the 1000gp item cost approximately 733.33gp.

Interpretation 2 would be to treat the feat as changing the base cost. In this scenario, it would not stack with other cost reductions. Frugal Crafting would first change the base cost. So, for the 1000gp to craft item, the base cost to craft would now be about 666.67gp. Then, you could apply your 10% discount, which would only discount you 66.67gp, instead of 100gp, making the total cost to craft equal about 600gp.

I initially thought that it would be treated as interpretation 1, but after re-reading the feat and how it is worded, it seems like it should be treated like interpretation 2.

Thoughts?

[Blackstorm]

You pay 1/3 instead of 1/2 of the base cost. So a 1000 gp item would cost you 334 gp instead of 500. If you have any other discount bonus, you should apply to what you pay. So a 5% discount would be on 334 cost Of It says that creating item cost 5% less. If it instead States that you consider the discount on the base cost it would apply to 1000 gp cost.

[DonDuckie]

I didn't know that cost reducers stacked additively, do you have a source for this?

I would rule (lacking a formal ruling/rule) they stack multiplicatively (is that even a word?)

so the calculation would be: 0.95 x 0.95 x 5/6 x base cost.

Otherwise, enough sources of reductions could reduce costs to nothing.

I use a homebrew ad-hoc crafting system in my games, but I like crafting enough to be interested in this.

[Taku Ooka Nin]

Its a 3pp feat. Did you expect it to be balanced?

It would be the first interpretation. Traits and feats stack on one another. However, I would run them as acting in order. If an item's crafting cost is 1000 gp, and the PC had a trait that reduced the cost by 5% then the item now costs 950 gp. If the PC has a feat that reduced the crafting cost by 1/3 then that applies to the new cost post traits and any feats taken beforehand. Therefore the item now costs 627 gp or so to craft.

If you're going to allow something then go in all the way. Half measures are boring.

DonDuckie wrote:

I didn't know that cost reducers stacked additively, do you have a source for this?

I would rule (lacking a formal ruling/rule) they stack multiplicatively (is that even a word?)

so the calculation would be: 0.95 x 0.95 x 5/6 x base cost.

Otherwise, enough sources of reductions could reduce costs to nothing.

I use a homebrew ad-hoc crafting system in my games, but I like crafting enough to be interested in this.

I'd always do multiplicity as well. This way it adds in diminishing returns, and discourages stacking cost reducers.

Encourage crafting by making it more advantageous to craft instead of just buying things outright.

[RaizielDragon]

If it matters, there IS a way to reduce the cost to 0, though it requires 3pp, being 20th level, Interpretation 1 and a tad bit of cheesiness.

With Interpretation 2, I was only able to get it to about 90% off.

These would both assume that the % reductions are all added together before reducing the cost, so 5% off + 5% off = 10% off, not 9.75% off.

EDIT: Also, for the record, I would rule as adding the percentages together, because making magic items was basically all the character could do by 20th level. They would be contributing practically nothing to combat on their, so making items for the party was basically what the entire character was devoted to doing. If a player was willing to make and run such a character, I wouldn't want to stifle them by crimping their main schtick. That being said, the first interpretion, that ends up with 100%+ cost reduction would probably be a little too broken. The character would still need masterwork items to enchant, but being able to walk into an armorers shop, tap a Masterwork suit of plate and instantly transform it into effective +10 Plate seems a little overboard.