Thelemic_Noun |
I've always wondered why miracle didn't have a lesser version, the way wish does.
Here:
School evocation; Level cleric/oracle 7
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, DF
Range see text
Target, Effect, Area see text
Duration see text
Saving Throw none, see text; Spell Resistance yes, see text
You don't so much cast a minor miracle as request one. You state what you would like to have happen and request that your deity (or the power you pray to for spells) intercede. A minor miracle can do any of the following things.
Duplicate any cleric/oracle spell of 6th level or lower.
Duplicate any non-cleric/oracle spell of 5th level or lower.
Undo the harmful effects of many spells, such as insanity.
Produce any other effect whose power level is in line with the above effects, such as a single creature automatically hitting on its next attack or taking a -7 penalty on its next saving throw.
In any event, a request that is out of line with the deity's (or alignment's) nature is refused.
A duplicated spell allows saving throws and spell resistance as normal, but the save DC is for a 7th-level spell. When a minor miracle spell duplicates a spell with a material component that costs more than 100 gp, you must provide that component.
Was there a balance issue with such a spell?
Dracovar |
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Having played a few clerics, I'd have to say that at 7th level, barring any circumstantial specific reasons for taking a particular spell from the cleric/oracle 7th level spell list, I'd load up on nothing but Minor Miracles.
Access to 6th level cleric/oracle? Great - lots of useful spells there. Access to all others from 5th level/lower - awesome. Packing a couple of these around makes my cleric pretty much ready for almost anything and there is no great material component cost involved.
If the spell is so good that you'd take it in favor of almost all the other spells on the list for that level - it might have a balance issue.
Maybe that's why they left Miracle for the 17th level casters - and as a 9th level spell, there are other good contenders on the 9th level list. A 17th+ level cleric would probably keep at least one Miracle at the ready, but might also have Mass Heal or other spells prepped too.
Lathiira |
I agree with Dracovar. Though I feel that the reason Minor Miracle would be so good is the overall weakness of that particular level of clerical spells, as many of them are circumstantial at best. From experience, I'd have taken it and nothing else if it'd existed last time I played a high level cleric. Especially since I was the only full caster for half the campaign.
Rub-Eta |
I just love the idea if "minor miracle", so funny. How is it minor when it's a miracle? Was it only granted by a demi-god? Is it something that is a miracle but still not that good?
Miracle: World peace!
Minor Miracle: The world will no longer be bothered with minor feuds and bad-mouthing in traffic!
TarSpartan |
Having played a few clerics, I'd have to say that at 7th level, barring any circumstantial specific reasons for taking a particular spell from the cleric/oracle 7th level spell list, I'd load up on nothing but Minor Miracles.
Access to 6th level cleric/oracle? Great - lots of useful spells there. Access to all others from 5th level/lower - awesome. Packing a couple of these around makes my cleric pretty much ready for almost anything and there is no great material component cost involved.
If the spell is so good that you'd take it in favor of almost all the other spells on the list for that level - it might have a balance issue.Maybe that's why they left Miracle for the 17th level casters - and as a 9th level spell, there are other good contenders on the 9th level list. A 17th+ level cleric would probably keep at least one Miracle at the ready, but might also have Mass Heal or other spells prepped too.
There's no might about the balance issue. You have now turned the Cleric into a full spontaneous caster with access to all Cleric spells up to level 6, and all other spells up to level 5, by level 13. OK, so a Level 13 Cleric only gets one or two 7th level spells, but the flexibility is a no-brainer.
The other issue with "Limited Miracle" is that it implies a limit on divine power. I always thought the reason you got a "Limited Wish" is because the spell casting itself was less complex than full Wish, and could be mastered by less capable mages. "Limited Miracle" sounds like an arbitrary limit on a divine favor. While it could work mechanically, the flavor seems off.
houser2112 |
The other issue with "Limited Miracle" is that it implies a limit on divine power. I always thought the reason you got a "Limited Wish" is because the spell casting itself was less complex than full Wish, and could be mastered by less capable mages. "Limited Miracle" sounds like an arbitrary limit on a divine favor. While it could work mechanically, the flavor seems off.
Going by that logic, why don't all divine casters get infinite slots to cast all spells at 1st level? After all, the gods would want their followers to have all possible power to further their aims.
Stark_ |
Because with a few exceptions, Miracle being among them, the cleric spell list is designed to be weaker than the wizard spell list, and it's built into their design, with the divine casters being able to wear armor and having 3/4ths BAB. Limited Wish is an exceptionally powerful spell, and the lack of a Limited Miracle is just part of that design, straight from 3.5.