Handling Trap finding checks


Rules Questions


Hi,

As a new GM, I'm having a hard time handling trap finding perception checks by my Rogue player.

Let's say he is actively searching for traps. What area\radius\distance does his perception check apply to?
There is no mention of this in the rules that I can find...

Also, let's say the rogue wants to check a corridor of 30ft for Traps.
Does he need to make only one perception check, because that is his movement speed per turn? if he fails, does he activate the trap because he "walked" into it while trying to spot traps?

Any extra general help on how this is handled would be appreciated.

Thanks!


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Hello Teldil.

The perception-check to locate traps covers as far and wide of an area as the character in question is able to percieve. Perception checks recieve a +1 to the DC of its check per 10 ft of distance between the character making the check and the object that is to be percieved. So a character may be able to spot a well-hidden secret door (DC 20) from 200 ft away (increasing the DC of the check by 20 = DC 40) if he manages to roll 40 or higher on his perception check.

Let us say a character walks into a 30ft corridor, that just so happens to contain a trap. The trap is located at the other end of the corridor and the normal perception DC to notice it is 20. As illustrated above, the 30 ft of distance between the character and the trap, would mean the DC increases to 23. So if the character is searching for traps, have him make a perception check. If the character rolls 23 or above, he spots the trap from the other end of the corridor. If he rolls a 21, he does not spot the trap until he is within 19 ft of it. If he rolls a 20, then he only spots it once he's within 9 ft.

Now then, let us say that said character is walking into this corridor, not looking for traps and he is not alert to his surroundings. Usually, when you're just casually observing a place, you use your 'passive perception' as I like to call it. That means you're taking 10 on your perception check. So if the character walking down the corridor only has a +5 perception, then he's not gonna spot the trap at all, unless he starts searching for traps, and gets lucky enough to roll what he needs. If said character, however, had a perception bonus of 10 or higher, then him taking 10 on his perception check, would eventually reveal the trap, as he was walking down the corridor.

Hope it helps :)

-Nearyn


Thanks a lot!

So...in this case, how do you manage movement during the non-combat phases of exploring a dungeon ?

Are players supposed to take turns and move at their speed one by one even when out of combat?

We play on a VTT and my players just move their tokens around without any structure or order while exploring, so it is hard for me to keep up during an example like the one where the Rogue only sees the trap when he gets to a specific square in a specific distance etc.

Any tips?

Also, another question. Your explanation basically assumes the Rogue is checking for traps every time he moves another square. For example, if he stands 30ft away and fails to reach 23 DC he doesnt spot the trap. So I say to him "You dont notice any traps from here". Then, he gets closer, but according to you he does not need to make another check. I just tell him he notices the trap when he gets close enough to reach the appropriate DC (based on his one roll made before).

So, how long does this check "last" until he needs to make a new one?
Does it last forever as long as he is inside the area he was percieving when he made that one check ?

Thanks


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Absolutely my pleasure :)

When out of combat, or otherwise in circumstances where they're moving through the story in no particular turn order, you can check their passive perception, or you can call for checks as appropriate. Usually, if my players are alert and moving about a trapped dungeon, I call for the check the moment my players have line of sight or can otherwise percieve the trap. If the check is high enough they spot it, if it is high enough to spot it, but only once they get closer, I either incorporate it into my story, or ask who in the party is up in front. If they don't succeed in their perception check, I just wait until I they move across the trap and spring it.

examples of above narration:

Player enters room...
"You enter a dusty, old study. A single, mostly collapsed bookcase leans against the wall next to a cluttered writing desk. The domed ceiling is thick with cobwebs and their air in the room is heavy with age and mold."

...and spots trap.
"Tancred, as you peek into the room, your hairs stand on end, and you realize that you've spotted something out of place, although it takes a second for your mind to process what is wrong. A very vague, almost imperceptible shadow, long and thin, can be spotted on the wall just next to the writing desk. As you take a second to adjust your vision to the torchlight you brought with you, you realize it's a tripwire, connected between the ruined bookcase and something on the desk. What do you do?"

...and spots trap, but the distance is too great.
"Tancred, as you move about the room, looking for something relevant to your quest, you suddenly stop dead, unmoving, as if you'd spotted a snake in the grass. A very thing tripwire connects the writing desk and bookcase. Realizing the room is trapped, what do you do?"

...and does not spot trap.
"Tancred, as you move about the room, looking for something relevant to your quest, you rummage through the clutter on the writing desk. brushing away bits of scrap-paper and unreadable old bookpages, you find something, a magnifying glass. However, before you can reach for it your heart skips a beat, as you accidentally brush the clutter on the desk aside, you feel just the slightest bit of resistance and hear the faintest of clicks. With a loud bang the door falls shut, and an iron grate drops from an opening in the wide door-frame to cover it. Immediately you notice a green mist slide across the floor, being pumped from hidden vents in the old room, and it's rising. What do you do?"

Just some examples.

I too use a VTT, maptool specifically, and I initially had the problem of my players moving their tokens around too much for comfort. So I established the rule that when exploring buildings or dungeons, you are allowed to move your token freely within a room, but only once I've said what I need to say about it, from when they enter. That way, I give a short presentation of what they see from the doorway, and then they can move their tokens about, should they wish for it. That way, I can also call for perception checks right after I finish my description, so once everyone who enter has rolled, I know if someone spots the trap or not, and then I just ask my players what they want to do in the room, or look at where they place their tokens.

Hope it helps :)

-Nearyn

EDIT to address the extra question:

Usually if my rogue-player states he is looking for traps or there is an indication of being alert, I give her the benefit of rolling, because I assume a general level of rogue-ish awareness for as long as she remains in the general area. I could give her a new check with each square she moves, but that bogs the game down. So usually I give one perception check per room, or per trap (I'm not very consistent with which of these I use, I'll admit).

If my players then move around the room and manage not to trigger the trap, then I may give them another check when they leave and re-enter the room, or if one of my players tell me that they take an extra look around or work the room over with a fine tooth comb (anything that implies that they make an extra effort to look around, really), then I'll usually ask them to make another perception check. This has the benefit of pulling double-duty as a search-check, so I can cut down on the time spent rolling dice. And as long as I know the rogue's level, I can add his trapfinding bonus myself if I want to be sneaky about it, or just tell him flat out that he gets his bonus, if I want them to be tense with the knowledge that their characters are walking around in a trapped room >:)


Amazingly thourough and helpful answer. MUCH appreciated! :)

Sczarni

Once the Rogue picks up the Trap Spotter talent they'll also receive an additional chance to detect traps when they approach within 10 feet of one. You as the GM get to roll that one.

So, 30 feet away, the Rogue may roll and not see the trap, then move 10 feet, and his passive Perception does not see the trap, but then after another 10 feet you roll his Trap Spotter, and he may finally see it (or not!).

Grand Lodge

Hold on, are there actual rules for this "passive perception"?

This is the rules forum, so it should be addressed with rules.

If there is a rule for "passive perception" please point it out for me and forgive my ignorance.

Sczarni

Absolutely.

Look under the "Action" and "Try Again" sections of the Perception skill.

Actively looking requires a move action, but reactive checks do not. To speed up gameplay, and not require a check every round, many GMs rule that your "passive Perception" means taking 10 every round.

Sczarni

It's also how many modules are written. The DC to stealth past a guard that has not been alerted to your presence is his "passive Perception", though those actual words are never used.


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@Nearyn... I love your way of handling it. And I also loved your descriptions.


Dotting for Ne-dawg's explanations.

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