I was going to get on here to post a "Where is the ACG shipment I paid for 2 weeks ago?" post but instead I will add my vote on next time letting us, the customers decide instead of making us sit and wonder what is going on. It would have been better if you had at least told us what was going on. Now I just need to wait for my tracking info to change from "Label printed but package not received by UPS."
Thanks for the update.
I don't have much to add, except that I've been saying for a week that I only want my PDFs, so I can prep for a new campaign that's been delayed two weeks now due to not having access to the new class book. For future reference, if you'd offered the option to charge my card sooner and provide access to my PDFs, I'd happily wait another couple weeks or longer for the physical materials. This does make me wonder at the advantage of subscribing.
That's my minor rant, and I hope that you can adjust the PDF process next time you have a month like this. It really would have avoided the majority of the discontent from your subscribers.
I'm going to chime in and say that I fully agree with you Erik - you all should have handled this much better, especially with regards to communication and letting the customer be the final decision maker on what we do with our orders. Given that I'm in Australia, depending on timing, customs issues, shipping issues, etc, it is now entirely possible that my September order will turn up before my August order does.
Going forwards, I expect there to be much more communication if-and-when there are issues that will effect subscriber orders, and I'd also like to see that we subscribers are given the power to say "yes, I'd like the products that are causing a delay to be moved into the sidecart so that they can be sent on their own or with the next month's subscription when they are ready to do so." If this doesn't happen, I don't expect that people will be so forgiving the next time around.
Just chiming in that I would happily postpone the 'iffy' product to a later ship date if it's what's holding things up. Not just this month, but any month.
I realize that might wreak havoc with the credit card processing because you would probably have to cancel the affected orders and start over, but I think it would result in fewer unhappy subscribers.
And thanks again for the explanation, Erik, especially since you had to know it wasn't going to be popular.
Well, I have to say thank you for finally telling us what's going on, but like a number of other posters, I feel drastically let down by the way Paizo has handled this. Not only does it look as if I'll be finally getting my subscription PDFs two weeks after street release, nobody at Paizo got around to admitting that there could be an issue.
People are generally pretty understanding IF, and only if, they are kept in the loop on potential issues. While I don't really like the idea of being at the back of the queue during a Gencon month, I can understand when there are issues, so long as I'm in the loop.
At this point, I have to rate Paizo's performance in customer service as somewhere around an F. Not only am I still waiting for my subscription shipment after the final estimated day, nobody at Paizo even hinted that there might be any potential issues or holdups until late in that last day. And for that matter, I don't seem to have received any sort of email as Erik suggested would be coming soon... If it's not coming by the end of the estimated last day of shipping, I'd rate that as another PR screwup.
All in all, while I am, I believe entirely justifiably, angry, I'm still not at the point of cancelling subscriptions because of a once-off blunder. But I won't accept this twice either. Please learn.
Dont forget, they will keep pushing out the organized play content. I expect the season will be just about over by the time I finally get my subscriber mailings.
Paizo, take a breath and step back. Stop trying to do too much and failing and do what you can but do it well. All the editing problems, serious quality control issues (cover of major release with AP name and lack of feedback incorporated into final product) as well as the mess with the card game...I think yall have lost focus on the ball. Keep it up and you will lose customers as well.
I don't get angry over much. I'm not angry now. I'm rather disappointed, but I understand why you as a company would have waited. Shifting a product to ship on the month after it's supposed to isn't something that I remember you having to do before.
What if we suppose you had made this decision early on in the month, as soon as you learned of manufacturer delays? You'd still have unhappy customers. And if the delay then sorted itself out after you'd already shipped everything else? That's a PR nightmare ("We delayed your stuff for no reason!")... so really, I think you made the right decision in waiting.
And the suggestion that you ask the customers I feel is a rather bad idea. It's impossible to please everyone unless everyone gets to make their own decision, which requires infrastructure to already be in place to allow individual decisions on what to do with peoples' orders.
I agree with the others that a bit more transparency would have been invaluable. Knowing that something is wrong but not what the problem is can be very frustrating.
I'm still a Paizo fan, and I believe that you make great products. Good luck getting all the adjusted orders out in a timely manner. I'm still looking forward to my order.
So, now the 22nd has come and gone, and still no shipment. At least we got an explanation, although I have a hard time following why Paizo can't allocate a contingent of the Add-On deck to their most important customers, when the deck is obviously available to be sold at GenCon. Shifting the Add-On deck to September is OK; but that could have been decided a week ago. I wonder why the promo cards get shifted as well, though.
Considering that the whole process of delivery to Germany including customs handling of such a big package is likely to take at least two, probably three weeks, it looks like my players are able to get their hands on new products, especially the ACG rulebook a full month earlier than me by simply buying it the games store here in Germany, and two weeks earlier than I'm even able to just look at my PDFs. That's not really what I'm subscribing for.
Anyway, I got no email as indicated by Erik.
(Gave an explanation)
Just want to say, thanks for the explanation. I know how positive hopes can be a double-edged sword when it comes to making project deadlines, but let's be honest: All in all, I'm still very content, seeing the current situation has been acknowledged and adjusted.
I thank you, Paizo, for finally letting us know why our PACG subscription has been delayed. I, like most others on this thread, feel like you have forgotten about your subscribers. Clearly August is a rough time for you guys when it comes to releasing product. I understand that you want new product to be available for GenCon, but it seems that you are more concerned with getting people the product there and not to subscribers or people who have preordered the products.
I do not believe it is asking to much to give everyone an upgrade on their shipping for the September subscription for free. I believe that this will satisfy many people and show them that you care about loyal subscribers and people who preorder from you directly.
Again, thank you for letting us know what the hold up has been and I look forward to receiving my subscription in the coming weeks. I still love your product and look forward to playing PACG for many years to come.
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Greetings again Everyone,
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You have our apologies that we let this occur. We let our optimism cloud our judgement when we should have taken action on this sooner. Many of you have been excitedly waiting for your August items, and we should have them processed and shipped as soon as possible. We should be sending out an official email to everyone effected by this in the near future, so please keep an eye on your inbox.
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Like others, I appreciate the explanation. What I don't know is, has anyone received the email? Under the circumstances, I would expect "near future" to mean Friday night, not the weekend or Monday. It's Saturday morning and still no "official" word on the status of my order, in spite of being past the anticipated shipping date. Again, in my case, I'm just waiting for release of my PDF for the ACG, and that's my personal frustration. I even debated running out to my local game store 20 miles away, but it's an expensive book at retail, so I think I'll wait.
My suggestion to you is don't make any more commitments on this issue until whatever it is, orders, emails, etc..., are flying out the door as you speak. It's not like the whole issue is killing me, but in my case it is affecting my ability to plan and deliver a gaming experience, so an "official" target ship date would help me keep my commitments.
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Thanks for the explanation but this is really really disappointing. Even after reading the explanation, I still have no email, and I still don't know when I'm going to have various parts of my order.
My frustration is compounded by the fact that I would have picked up all of these at GenCon, but didn't because I had no reason to think my sub would not ship.
Terrible way to treat your best, most loyal customers.
Edit: Will there be an option for subscribers NOT to wait until September for the Character Add On deck? That seems the right way to handle it.
Thank you for the update.
Could you at least give us the PDFs for now, or an estimate of shipping. "By next week" doesn't inspire confidence.
Could you at least give us the PDFs for now, or an estimate of shipping. "By next week" doesn't inspire confidence.
You have next week? Lucky you. Mine says late September or early October. Nothing like shipping a product 6-8 weeks late.
While your order or subscription might say September, Erik's post says orders (minus the character add-on) will bee shipped by early next week.
Thanks for link Hawk. I'll not hold my breath though.
So the Character Add-On deck was available for sale at GenCon, but Paizo "misgauged our ability" to have the decks "ready to fulfill subscribers orders." What exactly does that mean? Was there something wrong with the decks sold at GenCon? Was the entire stock shipped to Indianapolis and then lost on the way back to Seattle? Or is it, as some have feared, that the decks at GenCon were the only stock, nothing was reserved for subscribers, and subscribers got the "more will probably come in by the 22nd *cross fingers*" treatment?
This whole debacle is very unlike Paizo's usual transparency.
Gotta agree with Tanru and Anaro -- why did I have to hunt and search and come here to find this out?
Why didn't I receive an email?
To be fair, did you really have to "hunt and search"? Customer Service forum/August Shipment thread (They have done a monthly thread for quite some time in this exact way/place.).
Perhaps an email "in addition" to the thread would've helped, but let's not get too crazy.
Gotta agree with Tanru and Anaro -- why did I have to hunt and search and come here to find this out?
Why didn't I receive an email?
To be fair, did you really have to "hunt and search"? Customer Service forum/August Shipment thread (They have done a monthly thread for quite some time in this exact way/place.).
Perhaps an email "in addition" to the thread would've helped, but let's not get too crazy.
I think the shock continues to be that this event doesn't match Paizo's usual standards of either efficiency or communication. I still don't have an email. Honestly, I'm surprised that this isn't being addressed over the weekend.
Please, Paizo, send me am email about my shipment of Skull and Shackles Base set. I know the add-on deck is now back ordered. I have not recieved and email about anything except you are now processing my payment. I understand that you guys have been busy with GenCon but we as subscribers deserve to know what is going on with our base set. This has gotten to the point of ridiculousness.
You make available everything to people at GenCon, but not to your loyal subscribers. I remember a time when you preordered or subscribed to something you were promised that order before street date (back in the late to 1990's, no talking about paizo, a general statement on retail). Please answer this post and advise all of us that are waiting about their order.
Again I understand that things happen, but you cannot forget about your subscribers. I asked for an email about my shipment and have gotten nothing. No matter if it is a Saturday, you still have an issue on your hands and that should be addressed no matter what day of the week it is. This is poor customer service. "We did not realize we needed more copies" is not an answer. And to show people with them at GenCon is a slap in the face to all subscribers for any and all Paizo subscription holders across the world.
Thank you and I hope to here from you soon.
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Well, If I was Paizo, I would be the one feeling like I got slapped in the face. I work hard for 12 months every year to get you what you want, and make a mistake just once, and everyone comes knocking telling me how dissapointed they are, and betrayed they feel. Good Grief. If a 2-3 week delay on a GAME order is a big enough issues in your life to take time to whine about it publicly, than consider yourself lucky.
Paizo, I was affected by this, and I had stuff in my order that I was waiting on hoping to play this weekend that I missed, but that is ok, because you guys have done fine by me in the past. Thanks for letting us know what happened, when most places would say "The was an issue with your order, estimated delivery time 1-2 weeks"
+1 to noretoc
I'm disappointed I don't have the access, but I'm subscribing as much for Paizo as for myself.
And I realize this is a business - I certainly don't expect them to be responding to these remarks or continuing to fill orders on the weekend. From what I can tell, they are working well over 40-hour weeks already.
So the more I think about this, the more I think Paizo really ought to give a full accounting of what has happened. The way I see it, this passive voiced apology and stonewalled silence only invites customers to speculate on their own theories as to what has happened. The longer customers are left to speculate, especially while frustrated, the more hostile their theories are going to become.
I first have to say that I am a huge fan of Paizo. I've been with them ever since they spun off from Wizards, and as they've gone through their trials and tribulations, and their rise to prominence, they've always been on my radar. In recent years, I've had multiple subscriptions with them (until some employment issues) and always touted them as the best of the best regarding customer service. Their open customer service forums have only served to help anyone who cares to see how transparently they deal with complaints, mistakes, errors, and genuine concerns. So when a company with that kind of glow in my eyes does something to tarnish that, it isn't a simple blemish. It's an outright shock, and silence doesn't help to improve that.
So right now, my theory on what has happened is still somewhat sympathetic to Paizo. But as the 22nd of August grew ever closer, and then passed, that theory has definitely evolved from the totally innocent theory that originally had a hold in my brain.
I'm going to be saying "Character Add-On Deck" a lot. I'll abbreviate it CAOD.
My theory:
Shortly prior to August 9th - The printer tells Paizo there's a problem. Their entire run of class decks is messed up. Also, a lot of the CAODs are also messed up, but not as many. They're going to crank as many class decks as they can in the time before GenCon, but will have no trouble meeting the CAOD requirements for the entire allotment (GenCon plus subscribers).
A DECISION IS MADE: to push back store copies of the class decks to September, but to push through with CAODs, not mention the potential shortage, and trust the printer's promise
HOWEVER: Just in case, the decision is made to NOT ship subscriber shipments that include CAODs, so that supply for GenCon will be guaranteed. This includes stopping shipments for which the label has already been printed and the subscriber has already been charged. This is probably my biggest worry with this theory. In the past, people have asked to be charged on the first day of the shipping window, so they can have their PDFs unlocked quickly. They're fine with getting the physical books whenever, as long as they have the digital copy. Paizo have said they cannot do this, as it is ILLEGAL to charge for merchandise before it ships... so... yeah...
August 21st - GenCon begins. The rest of COADs haven't shown up yet, but the printer makes good on their promise to have enough class decks to cover certain obligations for GenCon. They promise they'll make sure to get all the COADs by the 22nd. Paizo breathes a sigh of relief, while subscribers unable to make pickup at GenCon have started to notice that their packages aren't moving...
A DECISION IS MADE: to stonewall communication regarding these issues, and give a token promise that all will be well by the 22nd.
The week after GenCon - The printer isn't communicating, customers are beginning to notice the stonewall policy and become very concerned.
A DECISION IS MADE: to maintain silence and cross fingers that it'll all work out on the 22nd.
August 22nd - It becomes apparent that the COADs are not going to arrive. With nothing to pack/ship, and the stonewall policy still in place, most of Customer Service goes home early to enjoy their weekend.
A DECISION IS MADE: To write a passive voice ("mistakes were made") message boards post declaring the COADs a wash for August, they'll get pushed into September, and we'll finish up all those held up orders first thing Monday... Or maybe Tuesday or Wednesday. Y'know, soon. The poster locks up for the night and goes home to enjoy the weekend. Hoping that the messageboard people will exhaust their vitriol over the weekend, and that subscribers who don't regularly follow the messageboards will be just fine with knowing absolutely nothing.
At any point, these decisions could have gone significantly different, and could have avoided a lot of disappointment and the blemish on their otherwise fine reputation. Instead, we find ourselves here.
Sorry for the long post.
I'm in the same boat as several other people, it seems. My shipping label was created for my full order back on the 7th. My card was charged on the 8th. My UPS tracking information shows that my shipment went out on the 22nd with a delivery date of the 29th (yay?). My big question is: what exactly is in this shipment? The label shows the full order, including the promo cards and add on deck. If I'm only being sent the base set, shouldn't the order have been amended to reflect that?
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My theory:
Shortly prior to August 9th - The printer tells Paizo there's a problem. Their entire run of class decks is messed up. Also, a lot of the CAODs are also messed up, but not as many. They're going to crank as many class decks as they can in the time before GenCon, but will have no trouble meeting the CAOD requirements for the entire allotment (GenCon plus subscribers).
A DECISION IS MADE: to push back store copies of the class decks to September, but to push through with CAODs, not mention the potential shortage, and trust the printer's(rest of theory snipped)
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Unfortunately, I believe your theory is largely correct. The one piece you left out of your timeline is the part that says watch your inbox for an email...which now apparently is going to go out Monday+. At this point, all I want that email to say is "here's a link to your digital purchases for the month of August and you'll get the physical components sometime in September."
To those who've stated that it's really not a big deal, I agree. The lesson learned in this case is - next August I won't bank on the usual early delivery of my PDFs for whatever August gaming I have scheduled. Instead, for August 2015 I'll tinker with my subs and plan to buy the digital product directly on the street ship date. Then in September I'll happily go back to my regular subs. Had I any inkling that I'd still be waiting on August 24th, that's exactly what I would've done this month, and for me there would have been zero stress.
For me, none of this is an indictment against Paizo's motivation. I literally adore this company and the products they make, and know they'll learn from this and improve their processes. Now, I'm going to go back to trying to beat that stupid Xanesha while I wait for my ACG to release. : )
What happened to August's comic (city of secrets 4)?Dynamite's website is now listing CoS#4 as "In Stock". When I checked yesterday it was "Coming Soon", so that's a step in the right direction.
In my experience Dynamite's publishing dates have a tendency to slip from time to time.
Regards,
Mike
Thank you for the answer.
So are we going to get a double feature on September or are we going to get them (shipped) now at late August?
Some information on the comics release - I picked up issue 4 from my local comic shop (in Australia) a couple of weeks ago, so it's definitely out in some places.
I havent got my subscription copies though - presumably they've all been caught up in the stock/shipping issues that paizo are currently grappling with.
Well, If I was Paizo, I would be the one feeling like I got slapped in the face. I work hard for 12 months every year to get you what you want, and make a mistake just once, and everyone comes knocking telling me how dissapointed they are, and betrayed they feel. Good Grief. If a 2-3 week delay on a GAME order is a big enough issues in your life to take time to whine about it publicly, than consider yourself lucky.
Paizo, I was affected by this, and I had stuff in my order that I was waiting on hoping to play this weekend that I missed, but that is ok, because you guys have done fine by me in the past. Thanks for letting us know what happened, when most places would say "The was an issue with your order, estimated delivery time 1-2 weeks"
As good and as friendly as Paizo are to us, at the end of the day they are not just our friends. They are a business and they will make business decisions based on many factors, not the least of which will be what is the most profitable for them. In this case, it is a business decision that has come around to bite them because it has resulted in there being people who have subscribed for product which have now gone well past the expected Shipped By date without receiving notification that their orders have been shipped.
Further to this, the feelings of disappointment and betrayal by some people stems from the fact that, up until now, Paizo has had a relatively good record in communicating various problems and potential delays that are being encountered. This leads to the presumption on our part that, if there is no communication from them then everything must be moving along as expected. To then be told at the 11th hour that "mistakes were made, and something went wrong", and the explanation as to what had happened is passive and vague at best, the feelings of disappointment are understandable.
Yes, there are many more important things in this world to worry about than whether we get gaming product on time. But as consumers, we do have the right to vent our disappointment on the appropriate forum. All we can do now is wait for a response from Paizo as to what will be happening now, and we can decide to go from there.
I think speculating on what happened, or opining on what Paizo ought to do or should have done, is pointless. They're running a business. All things considered they're pretty good at it. Stuff happens. We'll get our stuff, and sooner rather than later. Quitcherb&%!&in'. :-)
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For my part, when I ask for more information or express disappointment in the delay, I'm not just whining but I'm passing on feedback. Like many, I'm a devoted Paizonite and dont really care if there's the odd delay - I have over five hundred orders in my order history and less than ten of them have had any kind of glitch. I am surprised at the communication on this one specific delay and want to pass on that things like that matter.
I'm by no means saying "Paizo this is lousy" but just "Paizo, this would have been far less disappointing if I'd been told a week ago that there may have been a problem or if you'd spell out exactly what went wrong".
Having said that, I also realise it's weekend. Paizo the company may have a pressing issue, but that doesnt mean that Paizo's CS staff should drop everything after such a manic month and work on weekends just to satisfy my curiosity.
My biggest issue with the whole thing is they took my money when they knew they did not have the product. There should have been no payments taken and no shipping emails sent until the product was in the warehouse.
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I want to clarify that I was not asking for people to go into the office and ship out my Base Set. An email that was generated by a computer program would have been fine.
I love Paizo and their product. And I hope to be playing hpathfinder thill the day I die. I am done with this conversation. It will get here when it gets here. And when it does arrive it will be kick ass.
Some information on the comics release - I picked up issue 4 from my local comic shop (in Australia) a couple of weeks ago, so it's definitely out in some places.
I havent got my subscription copies though - presumably they've all been caught up in the stock/shipping issues that paizo are currently grappling with.
I don't have an issue with that, especially since my AP subscription wasn't held up but shipped alone even though i have the combine subscriptions thingy on, i just want to know if we are going to get them shipped together in September or we are going to get August's comic shipped seperately (sometime in August), becuase i want to make my sidecart for the next shipment (being a european customer i must not make big orders lest i get charged extra at customs).
My biggest issue with the whole thing is they took my money when they knew they did not have the product. There should have been no payments taken and no shipping emails sent until the product was in the warehouse.
No matter what's actually happened, I'm quite sure, THIS is not it.
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I would also put my voice in as "Not upset, just disappointed." (Like your mother would say :) )
This will not change my subscription status since there are plenty of other good benefits I get from it. And over the 6 years of subscriptions, this is, for me, the first serious delay. Even with past GenCons and Christmases, I never had more than getting my order shipped and PDFs more than a day or two after "street date."
Once there was a risk with any product, I would have expected an email regarding my order. Then once there was a serious issue, another email explaining the delay.
As it turned out, I had to come to the forums here to get information.
My biggest issue with the whole thing is they took my money when they knew they did not have the product. There should have been no payments taken and no shipping emails sent until the product was in the warehouse.No matter what's actually happened, I'm quite sure, THIS is not it.
This IS it. The payment was taken from my account on 8/8 and Erik just said they were hoping to get them by the 22nd.
My biggest issue with the whole thing is they took my money when they knew they did not have the product. There should have been no payments taken and no shipping emails sent until the product was in the warehouse.
Um, they didn't take my money and they have not sent a shipping email.
They have confirmed that my account was still a viable means of obtaining payment from me and they sent me an email that they intended to take said payment.
In fact, I believe the reason I don't have access to my PDFs is because they have not taken the payment yet. They don't want to sent out product (even electronic) until they receive their payment and they don't want to take payment until the physical product destined for me is in the box. It is the stuff that they couldn't put in the box yet that is causing the angst.
I agree with Steve - I'm not trying to complain so much as provide my perspective and feedback. I know I have posted here fairly often, so if I'm coming off as negative, that's more a result of other factors in my life than this shipping issue. Sadly, even if I had the book in my hands, I probably would not have had time to do more than admire the cover and read a dozen highly-anticipated pages.
Anyway, we are only one day past the predicted shipping date (in my email, anyway) and I remain hopeful that what is available will ship today! The rest can wait until my next big order, at least in my case.
I must add that, as frustrated as people are, I'm impressed how generally civil this thread has remained. Kudos, everyone, and I hope we keep it so.
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but the real issue it we havent been sent our stuff, even because they sold it out at gencon!!! if they had fullfilled all subscriber orders first, they would be in this mess. but they thought it more important to have product at gencon, then fullfill the promise made to each and every subscriber out there. ive subscribe for well over 5 years now, and i wont put up with this treatment any longer.
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I would also put my voice in as "Not upset, just disappointed." (Like your mother would say :) )
This will not change my subscription status since there are plenty of other good benefits I get from it. And over the 6 years of subscriptions, this is, for me, the first serious delay. Even with past GenCons and Christmases, I never had more than getting my order shipped and PDFs more than a day or two after "street date."
Once there was a risk with any product, I would have expected an email regarding my order. Then once there was a serious issue, another email explaining the delay.
As it turned out, I had to come to the forums here to get information.
This is almost exactly what I was going to write (except that I haven't been a subscriber for that long, and it was my father who tended to be "disappointed").
I expected better communication, but my other experiences with Paizo's customer service have been so good that they far outweigh this gaffe.
But it is a new data point. I will be paying attention. If it becomes a trend, my feelings may change.
I will say that I am now less likely to purchase the WotR path for the ACG than I was a month ago. A lot will depend on how the new organized play goes for the ACG in my area.
This IS it. The payment was taken from my account on 8/8 and Erik just said they were hoping to get them by the 22nd.My biggest issue with the whole thing is they took my money when they knew they did not have the product. There should have been no payments taken and no shipping emails sent until the product was in the warehouse.No matter what's actually happened, I'm quite sure, THIS is not it.
You might be misinterpreting your credit card statement. They never do that, because, as far as I understand it, it's against the law in the US to do so. What you are seeing probably is the the authorization pre-charge, which makes sure a customer's card has enough credit for when the day comes to actually charge the card.
If you're saying the amount was actually deducted from your account (and not your credit card) then there might actually be something fishy going on on the end of the card provider.