Goblinworks Lead Game Designer
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So this week we had some movement up and down at the top end, but no displacement until we get to Kabal. Kabal decided to put on their sassy pants and move to AC, bumping out Agents of Erastil despite their hunker down bonus. Agents of Erastil ended up in A as they also did not have enough to displace Librarians of Doom thanks to the Librarians substantial hunker down bonus. Also the Librarians fought off an attempted move by Hand of Abraxas thanks to their hunker down bonus. This caused a chain reaction that caused pretty much everyone in the last eight slots except Terra Australis Incognito to move.
I've ordered the settlements this week not by pure numbers but by numbers plus hunker down bonus (hence the Librarians placing so high).
Talonguard (NG) K
Golgotha (LE) W
Keepers of the Circle AB
Ozem's Vigil (LG) E
Aragon (CN) X
Dagedai Alliance L
Forgeholm B
Emerald Lodge V
Tavernhold F
Blackwood Glade Y
Sunholm O
Hammerfall Z
Les Compagnons AD
Kabal AC
Elkhaven G
Freevale I
Eastern Sun H
Mystical Awakening AA
Librarians of Doom Q
The Gauntlet C
Hammerfist Clan M
Agents of Erastil A
Quadrivium S
Hand of Abraxas U
Reading Between the Lines P
Brains and Brawn D
Terra Australis Incognito J
vVv Gaming N
The Guardians R
The Iron Gauntlet T
Then this sheet is wrong with its hunker down bonus number?
Because we should have gotten Q, even if their hunker down bonus was 87%
8*1.87 = 14.96.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Then this sheet is wrong with its hunker down bonus number?
Because we should have gotten Q, even if their hunker down bonus was 87%
8*1.87 = 14.96.
I wouldn't fight for "Q", it is the worst hex on the map.
My apologies, Try that.
Also how did they even get a hunker down bonus that high, they moved spots up until week 4.
Week 3 they were in A.
Week 4 they were in Q - and in 28th - which should be 18%?
Week 5 they were in Q - and in 30th - which should be 20%? so 38% total.
Week 6 Q - and even if you give them the 20% again for 30 that's 58%.
that and if you are counting hunker down into placement, they are in 19th, which is only 9%... so....???
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Goblinworks Lead Game Designer
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Then this sheet is wrong with its hunker down bonus number?
Because we should have gotten Q, even if their hunker down bonus was 87%
8*1.87 = 14.96.
I have their hunker down bonus as 91%
week 2: 29th place so 19% bonus
week 3: 27th place, but tied with the 26th place guild, so 16% bonus (35%)
week 4: 29th place so 19% bonus (53%)
week 5: 28th place so 18% bonus (71%)
Week 6: 30th place (since they are still smallest by raw numbers) so 20% bonus
So 91%, which gives them a total value of 15*1.91 or 15.28, which beats your 15 barely (and if I rounded down, they are the older guild so they would still win).
That sheet says 92% which is probably off 1% due to the tie week.
How does a hunker down bonus from before week 4 apply?
Clearly they did not have q as their primary choice previous to that week.
Also they moved spots till week 4 so how does a hunker down bonus make sense to a spot you were not previously in.
Obviously you are adding the bonus previous to them actually defending and staying in their spot. Which the sheet does not do.
They have been in Q since week 2
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Goblin Squad Member
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The second tab of Caldeathe's Excellent Spreadsheet shows they've been at Site Q since they got bumped there by Reading Between the Lines in Week 2. Lee also announced last week a clarification/alteration of his treatment of Hunker Down:
Going forward, the hunker down bonus only applies if you are remaining in a settlement that is your first choice of settlement. Basically if you get into a less than ideal spot you can choose to try and keep it by hunkering down there and making it your first choice, or you can shoot for bigger fish if you want to risk losing the spot you have. Currently we have some guilds on the lower end of things that before this week were consistently ending up in their tenth choice, and trying to figure that out while also figuring out of all the slightly smaller settlements that may end up with a hunker down bonus due to ending up in their eighth slot for the third week is a lot of confusing math work that will lead to mistakes and confusion. So instead if you end up on the lower end of things but you like where you are, be like the Librarians of Doom and go Q all the way, all day, all the time such that they now need a guild nearly twice their size to displace them or knock them off the list. That is the type of strategic choice we're shooting for; the Librarians may not have the best spot, but by being consistent in their choice they will remain on board long after their size would warrant.
That is wrong?
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Goblin Squad Member
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That is wrong?
Yes, Lee corrected himself a few posts deeper than his original annoucement.
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Goblinworks Lead Game Designer
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How does a hunker down bonus from before week 4 apply?
Clearly they did not have q as their primary choice previous to that week.
Also they moved spots till week 4 so how does a hunker down bonus make sense to a spot you were not previously in.Obviously you are adding the bonus previous to them actually defending and staying in their spot. Which the sheet does not do.
If you look at the corrected version of week 3 later on in the same thread you will see that they are still in Q.
The rule about the hunker down bonus only applying if you have where you are as your first choice was only instituted last week, but they have had Q as their first choice since the 16th of June rounds (so week 3).
.... awesome.
Fair enough then.
So for week 7 their maximum possible hunker down bonus will be 111%.
The sheet actually said probable week 6 bonus was 72% (it has been updated to week 7), which is why I recalled enough people to beat it by more than a fraction of a number.
Its still incorrect as its not reflecting the 'probable' bonus, but the current bonus.
Which gets the hunker down added before comparing numbers.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Black_Arrow, it appears the spreadsheet may be calculating a week off. What's in as Week 7 appears suspiciously like what Lee used this morning, given what he's told us about his numbers.
The salmon-columns have been Caldeathe's territory, especially in the early weeks, so I'll leave it to him to address what might need addressing: him da Master. Plus, being Canadian, he automatically gets every benefit of a doubt; an argument can be made that Lee's numbers are right only because he's a south-Canadian, hanging out in Seattle until Canada comes to claim it.
I will be more through next time around. I presumed someone would have caught any error in calculation given the general 'nerdiness' we all share.
But it appears the sheet is close enough, but does not account for the bonus added for the current week, which is done previous to seeing if you keep your spot for the week.
Also how will it be rated from here on in.
According to the ranking listed, or according to members of guilds holding land.
So in week 7, you take the guilds currently holding the 30 hexes and rank them according to raw membership. Apply a hunker down bonus according to their position, and then resort them in order of modified membership and then start looking at the draft lists.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Did Black_Arrow just admit he's an offshoot of a bigger guild trying to steal another settlement spot? If not why would you only "recall" enough to just beat it, why wouldn't you guarantee it by using your full numbers?
If so isn't that against the rules?
(If just confusion sorry about the accusation)
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Goblin Squad Member
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I will be more through next time around. I presumed someone would have caught any error in calculation given the general 'nerdiness' we all share.
But it appears the sheet is close enough, but does not account for the bonus added for the current week, which is done previous to seeing if you keep your spot for the week.
Also how will it be rated from here on in.
According to the ranking listed, or according to members of guilds holding land.
So in week 7, you take the guilds currently holding the 30 hexes and rank them according to raw membership. Apply a hunker down bonus according to their position, and then resort them in order of modified membership and then start looking at the draft lists.
The bonus can only be added reliably if the 1st picks are somehow revealed. Spies or volunteered.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If so isn't that against the rules?
I *so very absolutely* do not want to re-visit the old arguments, but for newcomers who may be un-certain: I don't recall any restriction placed on anyone except the three who got Settlements in Land Rush 1. Everyone else's free to scheme their little hearts out, but we hope--some, I believe, pray--that they don't, and just throw their numbers up in one glob.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Did Black_Arrow just admit he's an offshoot of a bigger guild trying to steal another settlement spot? If not why would you only "recall" enough to just beat it, why wouldn't you guarantee it by using your full numbers?
If so isn't that against the rules?
(If just confusion sorry about the accusation)
This was my concern after reading several posts over the weekend, and how quickly a few of these guilds FLEW up in number.
But I'm a lawyer, so I'm trained to be a Devil's Advocate.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Reviewing Ryan's posts in the "Concerning Pax" thread, it's clear that his intention and hope was that one out-of-game organization would claim only one settlement slot, but that it would be up to the community to establish a culture which would enforce disapproval of anyone playing silly buggers.
Just because the game system permits it does not mean that the players will not visit consequences in response. If we don't like what Abraxas is doing, it'll be up to us to compel disclosure of information and compliance with social norms in whatever manner we are able and see fit.
I do think the language of "recalling" players makes it pretty obvious that something interesting is going on.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I'm sure GW since they control the site's database can quickly figure out if accounts have suddenly switched allegiance.
Someone who has been keeping tabs on the population can probably give a guess if people have been moving around.
Could be nothing, wouldn't mind more evil on the board just disappointed if it's someone playing games and messing with people.
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Goblin Squad Member
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So this week we had some movement up and down at the top end, but no displacement until we get to Kabal. Kabal decided to put on their sassy pants and move to AC, bumping out Agents of Erastil despite their hunker down bonus. The Iron Gauntlet T
Wait a minute! Pants!?!?! No one told me we had to wear pants! I've been following the Tarzan dress code all this time! Pants. What a weird concept.
Did Black_Arrow just admit he's an offshoot of a bigger guild trying to steal another settlement spot? If not why would you only "recall" enough to just beat it, why wouldn't you guarantee it by using your full numbers?
If so isn't that against the rules?
(If just confusion sorry about the accusation)
I said no such thing.
Those that are paying attention would see that multiple guilds lost members when the hand increased.
There are a few weeks left to play out, and we have had several enticing offers from other guilds to join them and work, out of sight so to speak. Or not so out of sight in our current favorite.
If we cannot attain our goals in one fashion we shall choose another.
We like Q, for reasons some will clearly not understand.
The current occupants are welcome to stay if they wish, either by choice or in chains, but they have not seen fit to respond to my very generous offer.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Wait a minute! Pants!?!?! No one told me we had to wear pants! I've been following the Tarzan dress code all this time! Pants. What a weird concept.So this week we had some movement up and down at the top end, but no displacement until we get to Kabal. Kabal decided to put on their sassy pants and move to AC, bumping out Agents of Erastil despite their hunker down bonus. The Iron Gauntlet T
No, the lack of pants is a requirement of the Penis Brotherhood of Rust. Is that the origin of Kabal?
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Goblin Squad Member
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No, the lack of pants is a requirement of the Penis Brotherhood of Rust. Is that the origin of Kabal?Wait a minute! Pants!?!?! No one told me we had to wear pants! I've been following the Tarzan dress code all this time! Pants. What a weird concept.So this week we had some movement up and down at the top end, but no displacement until we get to Kabal. Kabal decided to put on their sassy pants and move to AC, bumping out Agents of Erastil despite their hunker down bonus. The Iron Gauntlet T
Actually as reveled in a previous episode, it was the Rancorous Ash Crickets... but close guess,, I will give you half points.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Wait a minute! Pants!?!?! No one told me we had to wear pants! I've been following the Tarzan dress code all this time! Pants. What a weird concept.Not just pants, Bunibuni! The sassiest of pants. ;)
This?pants.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I remember some weeks ago I received a PM... well I will just quote it:
I would like to talk to you about some possibilities during the land rush, and into the future.
We are looking for a little bit of support in the land rush to displace someone currently hold the spot we want. You hca soem extra members above and beyond what you need for your position, and there is the fact that basically everyone is avoiding your hex anyway. So its unlikely to change.
In exchange we can provide for a predetermined time supplies that you cannot get where you are.
Let me know if you are interested.
After I tried to get information, the individual demanded for my secrecy. Unbeknownst to him, I don't take demands well.
So I imagine there is some "maneuvering" of votes going on behind the scenes.
Maybe Golgotha likes the Librarians. I think we may take offense to anyone displacing them.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Also the fact that they made the announcement with a brand new account that doesn't have any history or a Goblin Squad indicator which indicates it's either a front or bought it's membership since the paizo store was closed.
That said, they could just have been seeding themselves elsewhere when they didn't think they could get a spot at the time, but the sudden appearance seems a little suspicious. Wouldn't be surprised if a larger guild's spy network just coalesced itself into a settlement when they realized they could do it and look like they just came from a bunch of guilds on their own.
Could be nothing, I'd just be bitter if it happened that way as my settlement concept was dropped because I wouldn't stoop to that type of swapping.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I have been pretty much telling everyone that things like this were happening from before the Landrush 2.0 started.
No matter how well some of these people think they are keeping things closed tight there are people who like to talk, and some of them like to hint to people they think they are out smarting. I am not 100% sure who is doing the maneuvering, but I am fairly sure it isn't the "Big Three," as a matter of fact, I might be suggesting something of an alliance of the big three, if things turn out like I believe they will.
Doesn't matter if we are good and they are evil, doesn't matter that a lot of you are neutral, and lot of you are friendly to all sides, and it doesn't matter some of you want to start your own shindig else where, at the end of the day it is OUR land that we are helping forge. To that sentiment, anyone trying to muscle in, plant seeds, and destroy what everyone here has worked for, will see the full might of the server aligned against them.
Some people don't like what they have worked for taken from them, and those people usually don't like to see it happen to their neighbors either.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I have their hunker down bonus as 91%
week 2: 29th place so 19% bonus
week 3: 27th place, but tied with the 26th place guild, so 16% bonus (35%)
week 4: 29th place so 19% bonus (53%)
week 5: 28th place so 18% bonus (71%)
Week 6: 30th place (since they are still smallest by raw numbers) so 20% bonusSo 91%, which gives them a total value of 15*1.91 or 15.28, which beats your 15 barely (and if I rounded down, they are the older guild so they would still win).
That sheet says 92% which is probably off 1% due to the tie week.
Sorry for the confusion in the spreadsheet, folks. I seem to be a week behind somehow.
I'm totally rooting for the Librarians to stay in the running at this point. I admire their pluckiness.
Wow. Mad drama. It's like the CW in here.