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I agree with Kydeem that psionics, and particularly DSP psionics, do a really great job of representing a wide field of fantasy (and sci-fi, and that stuff in the middle) characters who really have nothing in common with the core Wizard beyond the fact that they're both called wizards. As he mentioned, Dresden and the other spellcasters from his universe- would be much easier to emulate in play with a psionic character than a core wizard, probably even more than a sorcerer. If you're going for a Jedi or Sith vibe, again, psionics does it better. The wizards in the Malazan Book of the Fallen series are often better emulated through psionics, as is much of the magic from the works of authors like Brent Weeks, or anything from George R.R. Martin that isn't more closely aligned with divine magic; really any bit of fantasy where magic starts internally and retains that basic idea of a spellcaster having the ability to "throw everything he's got left into one big spell", or where words like "supernatural" occupy the same conceptual place as words like "ectoplasm".
I think psionics does have some overlap with the core casting classes, but generally if it's doing the same thing, it isn't doing it in the same way, which can be a big plus in and of itself.
Plus, I like that there's a place to go where all the adventurers are really into the power of crystals and tattoos.
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The only time you see anything even close to the magic system in PF is when the author is obviously making a DnD based story or the old Jack Vance novels (which I have never read, but I heard they are good).
This is a long time pet peeve of mine, but I know it isn't changing any time soon.Michael Moorcock generally uses a heavily Vancian system in his books.
"Memorise the spell on this stone and use it when the time comes."
Virtually all of the magic cast in the Elric books is of the prolonged ritual variety, not spammed video game style.
I think I read MM's first Swords trilogy. But really can't remember anything other than the titles and cover art look familiar.
Yeah, neither system has anything very good for ritual magic. I have occasionally hand-waved something for NPC's doing some sort of ritual.
...
Plus, I like that there's a place to go where all the adventurers are really into the power of crystals and tattoos.
I recently met a friend's girlfriend. He seemed rather nervous about us meeting and I couldn't figure out why.
Until... She informed me that the crystal jewelry wasn't jewelry. They were powerstones with bindings to hold them in the focal points of her aura. The tattoos where to guide the flowing power of her surroundings into the powerstones and replenish them.
There were just so many things I wanted to say that I couldn't decide where to start. But, I looked at my friends nervous expression and decided I didn't want to start a fight. So, I just smiled (I tried very hard to not smirk or sneer) and said I had never seen anything like it. Which was very true.
On my way home I was laughing so hard I almost wrecked my car.
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Design Manager
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I recently met a friend's girlfriend. He seemed rather nervous about us meeting and I couldn't figure out why.Until... She informed me that the crystal jewelry wasn't jewelry. They were powerstones with bindings to hold them in the focal points of her aura. The tattoos where to guide the flowing power of her surroundings into the powerstones and replenish them.
There were just so many things I wanted to say that I couldn't decide where to start. But, I looked at my friends nervous expression and decided I didn't want to start a fight. So, I just smiled (I tried very hard to not smirk or sneer) and said I had never seen anything like it. Which was very true.
On my way home I was laughing so hard I almost wrecked my car.
That story made me laugh out loud, because I've had almost the exact same thing come up, but the story ended with me getting punched after asking my buddy if the Expanded Psionics Handbook (back in 3.5) doubled as a relationship manual.
That story made me laugh out loud, because I've had almost the exact same thing come up, but the story ended with me getting punched after asking my buddy if the Expanded Psionics Handbook (back in 3.5) doubled as a relationship manual.
I recently met a friend's girlfriend. He seemed rather nervous about us meeting and I couldn't figure out why.Until... She informed me that the crystal jewelry wasn't jewelry. They were powerstones with bindings to hold them in the focal points of her aura. The tattoos where to guide the flowing power of her surroundings into the powerstones and replenish them.
There were just so many things I wanted to say that I couldn't decide where to start. But, I looked at my friends nervous expression and decided I didn't want to start a fight. So, I just smiled (I tried very hard to not smirk or sneer) and said I had never seen anything like it. Which was very true.
On my way home I was laughing so hard I almost wrecked my car.
Bravo, sirs. Bravo.
...then again, maybe it's a psi-like effect.
I've played with Dreamscarred Press' psionics since they first came out with Psionics Unleashed. I generally play a psion, and my last 5 new characters have been psions of varying disciplines. Only two have lasted past 2 levels of PbP time, however.
My absolute favorite as a player is Psion (Nomad)/Elocater. Such a player has so many options open to him or her, as long as they like to be the party "transporter" and "spring attack" type. Having a psicrystal as a familiar without the painful drawback of losing a familiar in the heat of battle is also nice.
I'm testing out various psion types right now, and in one of the PbP games I play in everybody is a Dreamscarred Press psi-type. That's a first for me, usually I'm the loner who has to be the self-sufficient Jack-of-All-Trades, from lockpicking to healing, so it's nice having some psionic teamwork. I've become very interested in our team's Soulbolt, an archtype of the Soulknife, because the way she plays the character is like so many of the anime "gun at a moment's notice" characters that it's awesome. (See My HiME's Natsuki Kuga, Jo Jo's Bizarre Adventure: Stardust Crusader's Hol Horse (Emperor), Puella Magi's Mami Tomoe, or Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha's Teana Lanster)
Right now, I'm playing a Psion (Shaper) who specializes in Astral Constructs, but who's also having to become the party's Jack-of-All-Trades because...everybody else is specializing too. :) Lessons learned: don't be afraid to "dip" a level of Vitalist, or the Tactician's archtype Battle Medic, if you are a Tactician. The party needs a healer, period. Skill-roles (Diplomat or party "face", Disable Device, Survival, Heal (non-psionic, non-magical), etc) can be taken by anyone. You've got a high INT as a psion - use it on skills. Being the Astral Construct shaper, I have to stay in the back, when I'm not lockpicking or rescuing fallen players. It's been an eye-opener. Usually I play the blaster/conjurer/crafting Sorcerer.
The downsides: everyone else at my RL gaming table has traumatic memories from D&D and AD&D, and approaches psionics like it was raw sewage. They won't even discuss the new Dreamscarred Press' Pathfinder-compatible system with me. I'm stuck with Play-by-Post only for gaming psionics. The 2nd downside is what Kydeem de'Morcaine said above. You try to do some research on "psychic crystals" for the game, so your psicrystal is a topaz instead of a mere quartz, and you end up with all the flower-power nut cases on the Internet talking about "crystal energy" and "ley lines". Argh.
@Kydeem, Last month the missus and I took a getaway long weekend, and found ourselves checking out a local, I dunno, I guess flea market. I was standing in the little rock/gem/fossil shop, checking out the trilobites and smiling to myself as a remarkably similar conversation unspooled across the way. My only gripe (kept to myself) was that whoever's CDs were playing had Rush's Grace Under Pressure on, and this was so very 2112 of a conversation. :)
As to the actual original question, when my buddy gets around to starting his game, I am almost certain to be playing a metaforge, and I'm pumped for it.
-Ghorrin Redblade
That story made me laugh out loud, because I've had almost the exact same thing come up, but the story ended with me getting punched after asking my buddy if the Expanded Psionics Handbook (back in 3.5) doubled as a relationship manual.
I recently met a friend's girlfriend. He seemed rather nervous about us meeting and I couldn't figure out why.Until... She informed me that the crystal jewelry wasn't jewelry. They were powerstones with bindings to hold them in the focal points of her aura. The tattoos where to guide the flowing power of her surroundings into the powerstones and replenish them.
There were just so many things I wanted to say that I couldn't decide where to start. But, I looked at my friends nervous expression and decided I didn't want to start a fight. So, I just smiled (I tried very hard to not smirk or sneer) and said I had never seen anything like it. Which was very true.
On my way home I was laughing so hard I almost wrecked my car.
I must imagine it was well worth it.
See all my experiences with AD&D player reactions to psionics were of the "cover and cover" variety: No one had actually read the book past the cover, but they knew, they KNEW, without a doubt in their minds that this was the most overpowered, broken stuff in the history of gaming, because if you no longer need to memorize your spells, well you're just plain a god.
Having played AD&D 2nd Edt. psionicist I have to say that there were some really powerful powers and a lot of very weak to basically just fluff powers. The really broken stuff came in the Dark Sun supplement The Will & The Way, which apart from some such excesses was a really cool book.
The real kicker, though, was that it could be combined with a melee class much better than e.g. a wizard and as we all know ;), dual classing was where the soup had its pepper. Or some such saying.You had access to "casting" in armor and a lot of the buffs where that much better when added to a fighter's frame. By themselves, psionicists were rather tame and couldn't do much that a wizard of similar level couldn't do better.
General caveat: It's been a long time and this is drawn from memory.
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I'm about to drop $90 on a book.
Is it strange that I am going to get Ultimate Psionics before Ultimate Magic?
I enjoy the fluff of psionics. That said, I'm not really into spellpoints. A bit too much bookkeeping for my taste. I'd like to see a Vancian option of psionics to make it a bit easier to learn and run for myself. But yeah, definitely love psionics. Especially since I like aliens, Lovecraft, and ancient astronauts in my setting.
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I enjoy the fluff of psionics. That said, I'm not really into spellpoints. A bit too much bookkeeping for my taste. I'd like to see a Vancian option of psionics to make it a bit easier to learn and run for myself. But yeah, definitely love psionics. Especially since I like aliens, Lovecraft, and ancient astronauts in my setting.
The funny thing is, I've started using more psionic characters as NPCs for the exact reason that they are less bookkeeping. Instead of tracking how many of X spell is remaining vs all their other spells, I just have to track PP.
Tracking PP is no more bookkeeping than tracking HP, which is to say, trivial. It makes dealing with lots of NPCs waaaaaay easier. Instead of having to mark which spells each NPC cast from their list of prepared spells, or have a different resource for each spell level (in the case of spontaneous casters), I just have their HP and PP, and everything is A-OK.
It makes combats smoother, cuts down on bookkeeping, and makes running lots of metaphysically inclined NPCs a snap.
Tracking PP is no more bookkeeping than tracking HP, which is to say, trivial. It makes dealing with lots of NPCs waaaaaay easier. Instead of having to mark which spells each NPC cast from their list of prepared spells, or have a different resource for each spell level (in the case of spontaneous casters), I just have their HP and PP, and everything is A-OK.
It makes combats smoother, cuts down on bookkeeping, and makes running lots of metaphysically inclined NPCs a snap.
For example, let's say that I have four 7th level Psions. I pick which powers they have (fairly simple as they only get 2/level), then I write down how many PP they have to spend. Let's say each has 53 PP (14 Int).
If I'm playing live, I'll have a sheet of notepaper that looks something like this.
Psion 1
HP:
PP: 53 / XX
Psion 2
HP:
PP: 53 / XX
Psion 3
HP: XX
PP: 53 / XX
Where X is the power they've spent. So I drop a 3rd level power. Okay, +5 PP spent. 2nd level? +3 PP spent. 4th level? +7 PP spent. When they hit 53 spent, they're out of juice. No tracking spells! Booya!
If I'm running online, in a program such as MapTools, you can even make a macro where you press a button and put in the PP spent for your power and it will automatically deduct it from your current PP (a friend of mine made such a macro for my psionic witch in his campaign).
EDIT: In essence, tracking psionic powers is about as complicated as tracking a Fighter's resources. :P
To me tracking HP isn't really trivial. Not all that great at math, so having more math isn't something I like. That's why I prefer vancian. For me, it's just a tally mark. A lot easier than adding and subtracting, as well as the changing values when you change spells.
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That's what I do with Vancian spellcasting. It's easier for me because no matter what spell I use, I only have to cross off one thing. And I prefer spell slots to mana/spell points in my RPGs anyways. I like that there is a spell point system for those that like it, but I'd like to see a vancian style of psionics.
If you never augment your powers, the bookkeeping is indeed easier. If you do, it's much more complex. Damage dice, save DCs, bonuses, other sundry effects can all be variables at manifesting time.
True, but, wouldn't it be beneficial to augment these effects? I'd feel like I wasn't playing a class to it's full potential if I didn't augment the spells. I'd feel like a rogue that never flanked, or a barbarian that doesn't rage ;)
I choose some powers purely because they are good even without augments.
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If you never augment your powers, the bookkeeping is indeed easier. If you do, it's much more complex. Damage dice, save DCs, bonuses, other sundry effects can all be variables at manifesting time.True, but, wouldn't it be beneficial to augment these effects? I'd feel like I wasn't playing a class to it's full potential if I didn't augment the spells. I'd feel like a rogue that never flanked, or a barbarian that doesn't rage ;)
I don't think the augments are that hard. At least no more harder than spontaneous metamagic which sorcerers have and wizards have via wands.
I know my GM takes quite a lot of time whenever he is running a spell caster. Taking time to consider all the different interactions with other spells.
Another thing I like about psionics is that they address that in their general rules. Everything just runs a lot cleaner. A lot of the time wasting spells just don't exist. There is no summoning general rules and restriction and no questions like "are foci considered expensive magical companants?". Nope none of that. Just a clean modular Astral construct that does everything you could want while running very smoothly. Shaper+boost construct + advance construct + craft(sculpting) and my psionic summons are just as useful as SM and SNA. The utility upgrade from advance construct A list is just great.
I also like how the psion doesn't just make skill points seem stupid. I actually can't find the invisibility equivalent and disguise-self equivalent (at least a 10minut/lvl one). Flight comes in at 4 level spells. Teleport comes online at maybe level 11 for all but the nomad.
It's good. A lot of the confusion that traditional casters bring is not there and replaced by more straightforward answers to problems. It's all just very clean. (You might not play with rules lawyers, but I do and the PF magic system full of interesting interactions that unfortunately sees table time and discussion *shudders* or the GM just sits quietly thinking about the rule thing he ran accross for 5-10minutes)
I like the flavor. I could easily reflavor it as any kind of magic I wanted, but I'll be using it as psionics for my next campaign setting and I'll run it like they suggest with PR and SR being the same thing, dispel magic and dispel psionics works on both, ect.
I choose some powers purely because they are good even without augments.
Like this? or this? I like this one too.
I like more augmentable powers than unaugmented ones. The way I see it psions are like sorcerers except they don't have to learn spells that stop being as useful as their new stuff.
Actually I was thinking Entangling Debris/Time Hop/Dispel Psionics which are amazing even with 0 augments tacked on and all have a good bit of flexibility in their augments, but ya all those are solid options.
And let us not forget Energy Conversion where for 13 points flat you get a duration of 10min/level which considering the amount of "points free" damage you can get with it is priceless.
If you never augment your powers, the bookkeeping is indeed easier. If you do, it's much more complex. Damage dice, save DCs, bonuses, other sundry effects can all be variables at manifesting time.True, but, wouldn't it be beneficial to augment these effects? I'd feel like I wasn't playing a class to it's full potential if I didn't augment the spells. I'd feel like a rogue that never flanked, or a barbarian that doesn't rage ;)I don't think the augments are that hard. At least no more harder than spontaneous metamagic which sorcerers have and wizards have via wands.
I know my GM takes quite a lot of time whenever he is running a spell caster. Taking time to consider all the different interactions with other spells.
Another thing I like about psionics is that they address that in their general rules. Everything just runs a lot cleaner. A lot of the time wasting spells just don't exist. There is no summoning general rules and restriction and no questions like "are foci considered expensive magical companants?". Nope none of that. Just a clean modular Astral construct that does everything you could want while running very smoothly. Shaper+boost construct + advance construct + craft(sculpting) and my psionic summons are just as useful as SM and SNA. The utility upgrade from advance construct A list is just great.
I also like how the psion doesn't just make skill points seem stupid. I actually can't find the invisibility equivalent and disguise-self equivalent (at least a 10minut/lvl one). Flight comes in at 4 level spells. Teleport comes online at maybe level 11 for all but the nomad.
It's good. A lot of the confusion that traditional casters bring is not there and replaced by more straightforward answers to problems. It's all just very clean. (You might not play with rules lawyers, but I do and the PF magic system full of interesting interactions that unfortunately sees table time and discussion *shudders* or the GM just sits quietly...
I've had weird rule combinations that have come up with traditional spell casting, but I usually rule that quickly and efficiency. I don't let rules question turn my game into a quagmire. Though, that doesn't mean there couldn't be some simplification to the spells, but I think that's more of an issue with the spells and less with vancian vs spell points. Though I really don't have much of a problem with invisibility/disguise self.
But we can definitely agree that we like the flavor of psionics. Fantasy, sci-fi, or anything in between, I love them :D
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I enjoy the fluff of psionics. That said, I'm not really into spellpoints. A bit too much bookkeeping for my taste. I'd like to see a Vancian option of psionics to make it a bit easier to learn and run for myself. But yeah, definitely love psionics. Especially since I like aliens, Lovecraft, and ancient astronauts in my setting.
I can't imagine how the PP system is somehow more bookkeeping than the slot system, especially when playing a prep caster.
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I enjoy the fluff of psionics. That said, I'm not really into spellpoints. A bit too much bookkeeping for my taste. I'd like to see a Vancian option of psionics to make it a bit easier to learn and run for myself. But yeah, definitely love psionics. Especially since I like aliens, Lovecraft, and ancient astronauts in my setting.I can't imagine how the PP system is somehow more bookkeeping than the slot system, especially when playing a prep caster.
Admittedly, I don't like prepared casting case it's worse. I like spontaneous better. I prefer sorcerers and oracles to wizards and clerics. What I do is I just have two columns. One has the spell levels I can cast, and the other is a tally of how many I can use. I just mark off the ones I use and that's that. With spellpoints, I have to recalculate for augmentation and such. I prefer just the single tally mark of losing a spell. Even with metamagic, it's still just a single tally mark off of a higher level spell.
I've used poker chips to tracks all kinds of stuff before.
I can definitely attest to this idea.
Our group tried Psionics for the first time a week ago (all of us except the GM). For people like myself, poker chips or pennies help a lot with power management!Dreamscarred Press did an excellent job with psionics. Ultimate Psionics was a fantastic purchase! I can't say I was initially excited about learning a new subsystem... But after a couple sessions, psionics became much more intuitive than vancian magic. And I've quickly come to love it!
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I definately like Psionics for it's fluffy. In play, it's important to note that, at least as my experiences have shown me, Psionics is a system that comes out stronger then Magic at low levels
Our Armored Blade Soulknife was a monster truck of simple, High Ac, brutal damage pain.
Our Psion used Energy Missiles and Animating often, while cackling at the puppet-play.
I, our Vitalist, made healing into an art form, especially since I was using an archtype that leeched life from enemies that I drew into the Collective. It turned into; harm the enemy, then like surgery, give 4 Hp to the tank, 2 each to the mildly wounded. Next round, Bull's strength, augmented to provide to everyone over collective.
My gripe though, was I felt like our non-psionic characters were jokes beside us...
So, if your gonna run Psionics; I advise telling everyone they ought to run psionic, otherwise that feeling of balance will start WAY off.
It'll finish as fair, or even slightly off for the psionics, but the journey matters more then the destination.
I recently met a friend's girlfriend. He seemed rather nervous about us meeting and I couldn't figure out why.Until... She informed me that the crystal jewelry wasn't jewelry. They were powerstones with bindings to hold them in the focal points of her aura. The tattoos where to guide the flowing power of her surroundings into the powerstones and replenish them.
There were just so many things I wanted to say that I couldn't decide where to start. But, I looked at my friends nervous expression and decided I didn't want to start a fight. So, I just smiled (I tried very hard to not smirk or sneer) and said I had never seen anything like it. Which was very true.
On my way home I was laughing so hard I almost wrecked my car.Yeah, probably not a good idea to start a fight with her: If she gets initiative, she could take you out in one turn with augmented Hammer. ;)
We have included Psionics twice in our campaigns... a third time I tried to get Dreamscarred's version for PF approved but no luck there.
Attempt one was with that underpowered 3e book. I played the psion and by mid level I was wishing I could be a sorceress instead. Psionics got banned for being useless.
The next inclusion came much later and lovable mr munchkin wanted to add the 3.5e psionics into his already high level game, and since I had just retired my twice fallen paladin archer I got to be the first guinea pig again. I made a catgirl psion and absolutely dominated every combat. Even with my LA penalties for the custom race my psion was able to take point into each dangerous situation and watch the enemy fall back in dismay as they encountered my impenetrable shield which I would only drop after they wasted some good attacks on me, and once my companions were into place to dish out a lot of hurt themselves I would drop the shield and then we just mopped the bad guys up as a team. Rinse and repeat for the next room. If I got hurt I could quickly heal myself and not bother the over worked cleric. And if combat turned badly we could hide in my restored impenetrable shield to fully recuperate before restarting the fight. Of course the next campaign psionics were banned again, this time for being too good.
I hear the PF ones are better balanced but I do have some concerns... unfortunately I may have to wait for an online game to actually try them.
And if combat turned badly we could hide in my restored impenetrable shield
What sorcery is this? O.o
And if combat turned badly we could hide in my restored impenetrable shieldWhat sorcery is this? O.o
Not sorcery silly, it was a psionic power... some sort of kinetic barrier if I recall correctly that stopped all attacks regardless of type. I had three free uses from my races 3/day psi power and plenty of points to keep it going after that.
And if combat turned badly we could hide in my restored impenetrable shieldWhat sorcery is this? O.oNot sorcery silly, it was a psionic power... some sort of kinetic barrier if I recall correctly that stopped all attacks regardless of type. I had three free uses from my races 3/day psi power and plenty of points to keep it going after that.
Lol, whut? :P
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Plane and simple,Ultimate Psionics is considered as a Core Rulebook at our groups table.
And if combat turned badly we could hide in my restored impenetrable shieldWhat sorcery is this? O.oNot sorcery silly, it was a psionic power... some sort of kinetic barrier if I recall correctly that stopped all attacks regardless of type. I had three free uses from my races 3/day psi power and plenty of points to keep it going after that.
Lol, whut? :P
Is that a serious response?
Wizard's have a similar spell I believe but can't use it this frequently.
I can only assume that you mean the 8th level Kineticist power psionic telekinetic sphere, which does create a telekinetic barrier that is pretty much impervious to damage and stuff. The thing is, this is the description for the power.
As the telekinetic sphere spell, except as noted here.
Notice something funny about this? It's a power that mimics a spell of the same level, except the power is harder to get (you either have to be a 15th level kineticist, or a 17th level anything else with a feat tax). Even then, it's hardly that amazing as it specifically notes that it can be taken apart with a rod of cancellation, rod of negation, disintegrate or -- ooh, ooh, get this one -- a targeted dispel magic. That's right, dispel magic breaks it.
Sorcery indeed. :P
Is that a serious response?
Wizard's have a similar spell I believe but can't use it this frequently.
Yeah, because I was confused. Firstly, I was trying to figure out how you managed to get an 8th level kineticist power as a 3/day psi-like ability as a racial (?_?), and you spoke like you were then manifesting said psi-like ability with PP when you ran out of daily uses (which is, uh, as illegal as using spell slots to power SLAs). Then you're talking about an impervious shield of imperviousness, except it's actually breakable by virtually any spellcaster / outsider / enemy that's worth a crap at the level that you get it (seriously, things throw around dispel magic at will).
I thought something sounded fishy, and sushi is definitely on the menu tonight.
I can only assume that you mean the 8th level Kineticist power psionic telekinetic sphere, which does create a telekinetic barrier that is pretty much impervious to damage and stuff. The thing is, this is the description for the power.
As the telekinetic sphere spell, except as noted here.Notice something funny about this? It's a power that mimics a spell of the same level, except the power is harder to get (you either have to be a 15th level kineticist, or a 17th level anything else with a feat tax). Even then, it's hardly that amazing as it specifically notes that it can be taken apart with a rod of cancellation, rod of negation, disintegrate or -- ooh, ooh, get this one -- a targeted dispel magic. That's right, dispel magic breaks it.
Sorcery indeed. :P
A dispel needed to roll to take it down and since we were like just hitting early epic levels at this point that wasn't an easy roll to make. Oh the GM did take it down on me a couple times with disjunction I believe but that didn't really detract from it's usefulness.
I hear the PF ones are better balanced but I do have some concerns... unfortunately I may have to wait for an online game to actually try them.
Well if it matters, in Pathfinder, resilient sphere, wall of force, and so forth have hardness and HP. And you can still crush the 8th level keneticist-only-until-17th level+feat-tax with dispel magic.
Not that it was OP before. Heheh.
A dispel needed to roll to take it down and since we were like just hitting early epic levels at this point that wasn't an easy roll to make. Oh the GM did take it down on me a couple times with disjunction I believe but that didn't really detract from it's usefulness.I can only assume that you mean the 8th level Kineticist power psionic telekinetic sphere, which does create a telekinetic barrier that is pretty much impervious to damage and stuff. The thing is, this is the description for the power.
As the telekinetic sphere spell, except as noted here.Notice something funny about this? It's a power that mimics a spell of the same level, except the power is harder to get (you either have to be a 15th level kineticist, or a 17th level anything else with a feat tax). Even then, it's hardly that amazing as it specifically notes that it can be taken apart with a rod of cancellation, rod of negation, disintegrate or -- ooh, ooh, get this one -- a targeted dispel magic. That's right, dispel magic breaks it.
Sorcery indeed. :P
An 8th level spell/power should be useful. :P
EDIT: Besides, it's a decent entirely defensive tactic. It protects enemies outside of the sphere as much as it does allies inside the sphere. It's a stall tactic, generally. Telekinetic sphere is the favorite spell of a friend of mine who is enamored with it because of an abjurer wizard he played in a game of ours that went epic. He used that spell offensively and defensively, and even had some metamagic versions of said spell, and used metamagic rods on it too.He usually used at least 1/fight.
An 8th level spell/power should be useful. :PA dispel needed to roll to take it down and since we were like just hitting early epic levels at this point that wasn't an easy roll to make. Oh the GM did take it down on me a couple times with disjunction I believe but that didn't really detract from it's usefulness.I can only assume that you mean the 8th level Kineticist power psionic telekinetic sphere, which does create a telekinetic barrier that is pretty much impervious to damage and stuff. The thing is, this is the description for the power.
As the telekinetic sphere spell, except as noted here.Notice something funny about this? It's a power that mimics a spell of the same level, except the power is harder to get (you either have to be a 15th level kineticist, or a 17th level anything else with a feat tax). Even then, it's hardly that amazing as it specifically notes that it can be taken apart with a rod of cancellation, rod of negation, disintegrate or -- ooh, ooh, get this one -- a targeted dispel magic. That's right, dispel magic breaks it.
Sorcery indeed. :P
I think the concern was two fold; not only was it (mostly) impenetrable in 3.5e but I could use it once or twice in at least six or more encounters. Which was our typical number of encounters before resting.
My gripe though, was I felt like our non-psionic characters were jokes beside us...
So, if your gonna run Psionics; I advise telling everyone they ought to run psionic, otherwise that feeling of balance will start WAY off.
Non psionic members or non magic members?
DSP only addresses martial v caster disparity by giving you tons of magus-like classes so you don't have to run into that problem.
I still think psionics does a better job of not invalidating skills though. But that doesn't help in-combat where post like level 10-12 spells and one barbar build > not spells (monk, fighter, rogue).
It's less of an issue is parties where most of the group is the "mundanes" or poorly optimized rangers and paladins. Since the full caster/manifester might decide to caste things like haste/battlesense
An 8th level spell/power should be useful. :PA dispel needed to roll to take it down and since we were like just hitting early epic levels at this point that wasn't an easy roll to make. Oh the GM did take it down on me a couple times with disjunction I believe but that didn't really detract from it's usefulness.I can only assume that you mean the 8th level Kineticist power psionic telekinetic sphere, which does create a telekinetic barrier that is pretty much impervious to damage and stuff. The thing is, this is the description for the power.
As the telekinetic sphere spell, except as noted here.Notice something funny about this? It's a power that mimics a spell of the same level, except the power is harder to get (you either have to be a 15th level kineticist, or a 17th level anything else with a feat tax). Even then, it's hardly that amazing as it specifically notes that it can be taken apart with a rod of cancellation, rod of negation, disintegrate or -- ooh, ooh, get this one -- a targeted dispel magic. That's right, dispel magic breaks it.
Sorcery indeed. :P
I think the concern was two fold; not only was it (mostly) impenetrable in 3.5e but I could use it once or twice in at least six or more encounters. Which was our typical number of encounters before resting.
It's also good to point out that there exist a spell at 8th that does exactly the same thing.
The next inclusion came much later and lovable mr munchkin wanted to add the 3.5e psionics into his already high level game, and since I had just retired my twice fallen paladin archer I got to be the first guinea pig again. I made a catgirl psion and absolutely dominated every combat. Even with my LA penalties for the custom race my psion was able to take point into each dangerous situation and watch the enemy fall back in dismay as they encountered my impenetrable shield which I would only drop after they wasted some good attacks on me, and once my companions were into place to dish out a lot of hurt themselves I would drop the shield and then we just mopped the bad guys up as a team. Rinse and repeat for the next room. If I got hurt I could quickly heal myself and not bother the over worked cleric. And if combat turned badly we could hide in my restored impenetrable shield to fully recuperate before restarting the fight. Of course the next campaign psionics were banned again, this time for being too good.
Psionics are faster to "come into their own" than magic or mundane fighting. Around Level 9 or so you have Psion (Nomad) teleporting all over the place, the Psychic Warrior with a buffable Inertial Armor or Force Screen in the mid-to-high 20s, and the Psion (Shaper) making Large astral constructs on the battlefield. Every psion/wilder can get Energy Wall at Level 5, which is ugly to enemies if your Psion (Kineticist) does it with a different energy type each round. Energy Wall is the definition of "battlefield control" as you make a Tron-like Cycle Wall for enemies to go through. Wizards and Sorcerers may have Teleport, Lighting Bolt, Fireball, etc, but they are limited to a few slots a day, not using the same power over and over again until you run out of points. The Fighter is still dreaming about his or her +5 longsword while the Psion does 9D6 damage with an Energy Ray.
But it is Psychic Reformation that makes psionics uber. Make a mistake in assigning your skill points while you leveled? Have favored enemies at Level 1 that are gone by Level 6 in the Adventure Path, never to be seen again? Got a Headband of Vast Intelligence to buff a skill, so you don't need to put so many skill points into that skill? Wish you could swap out a feat you chose at lower level? Or even a power that is now less than optimal? Use Psychic Reformation and a day or two to recover, and you can optimize your psionic character like never before. Swap out crafting feats as needed. Get rid of Energy Adaptation, Specified now that you have the real Energy Adaptation. Etc. And you can use the power on others.
Soulknives are also perfect to use to walk into the anti-magic field with the boss creature and still get their weapons of choice with a concentration check. Or when your team is roleplaying at the king's ball and all your mundane weapons have been confiscated by the guards.
The one glaring Achilles Heel to the psion(s), and I've mentioned this on Dreamscarred Press' board, is the lack of an equivalent to Silence. The one most important spell in the D&D or Pathfinder game to stop the wizard from spellcasting, stop anybody in the corridor outside from hearing your curb-stomp inside, or stopping nasty monsters TPK'ing the party with sonic-based effects. Control Sound doesn't come close. There are Energy Adaptations to sonic effects, but no psionic Silence.
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I've been negatively inclined toward psionics in fantasy since 1st-edition AD&D. I felt that the flavor doesn't mesh well in the fantasy stories I wanted to tell in my Dungeons and Dragons games. I've also had some major problems with having a completely different game mechanic system that did more-or-less exactly what magic already did.
TSR/WotC continued the flavor mis-match and system dichotomy for psionics in both AD&D 2e and in D&D 3.x.
The 3.x psionics system (including DSP's updaiting of it for the PFRPG) are very well thought-out, and balanced systems. However, I just don't see the point of introducing another full game mechanic system that's pretty much equivalent to magic. Consequently, even though it's a fine system, I don't use it.
There is "psychic magic" in my game, to represent things like ESP, telepathy, psychokinesis, object reading, pain suppression, etc. It's essentially a sorcerer bloodline/archetype.
Setting aside game mechanics, another big thing that turns me off about the 3.x / DSP psionics system is what the various psionic character classes are named. The names just seem way too "game-y" for my taste, and are very much out of tune with those of the traditional character classes.
"Rogue," "bard," "wizard," "ranger," "alchemist," "druid," "ninja," "paladin," "sorcerer," "witch," "cavalier," and the rest are all real-world words with long histories in legend and/or literature. The classes reflect, more-or-less, what the words mean in plain English.
The psionic classes have names that don't mean anything outside of the context of the game: "psion," "soulknife," "vitalist," etc. If I referred to a non-gamer about a "wizard" they'd know what I was talking about. If I mentioned a "soulknife..." well, not so much. Heck, even the term "psionics" has far more traction within the role-playing gaming world than as a general term.
Better names for the classes, with ties to what the names actually mean in a literary, mythological, or socio-historical context would greatly increase my desire to use them. Terms like "telepath," or "seer," or "spiritualist," or "fakir," or even just "psychic" have meaning outside the context of the game.