| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
So I am looking into it. I skimmed over the reviews both here and on drive through and people seem to dig it and say it is the goodness.
Has anyone here used it? How well did it work and how would you compare it to 3.5 Tome of Magic Pact magic?
On a semi-related note what are some good points to convince someone who thinks that it resembles demonic possession too much to let you play one?
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I have a great love for PMU, and have used it quite extensively in my campaigns (though I admit I have only used Occultists as NPCs). It's great stuff.
I can't really comment on how well it compares to 3.5 Pact Magic as I've never used the older material, but here is my point on convincing your GM that it isn't demonic possession: pactioners are no more vile than clerics- both act as conduits for greater beings whose values run the gambit. Sure, some occultists are evil but so are some priests yet I doubt he'd have problem if you ran a cleric despite some worshiping real nasty stuff. Thematically I believe the only difference between gods and spirits is that that one group (gods) seek dedication and worship from those that call upon them; spirits meanwhile (the good, the bad, and the indifferent) are a little more petty and are willing to aid those who appease them with tribute.
Also, if I recall correctly there is an angel one can bind, as well as other heroic character yet no actual fiends that I can remember (though there are a few evil still); just food for thought.
Hi "The NPC"! Leave any questions you have here and I'll sure to get back to you on it!
Has anyone used it?
Outside of our playtests, I've used several pact magic villains. When you play Pact Magic, you have to remember that compared to the wizard, you play for the long-haul. There's no "going nova" for you. That said, you excel when time is pressing and you have to do many encounters in a very short amount of time.
How does it stack up to the Tome of Magic?
I like to think we're better focused. We took the old system and give it some unique mechanics, like Vestigial Companions, Constellations, and the Major / Minor system. We also changed around the spirit progression so it mimics the wizard's spell progression. Nine levels of spells, nine levels of spirits. Finally, we standardized the number of granted abilities that spirits get (all of them have five) and we created the aforementioned Major/Minor distinction so that different feats and abilities and interact with granted abilities with better efficiency.
On demonic possession....
Well ... anyone who says that this is sort of like demonic possession is sort of right. Sort of. Pact Magic as a concept stems from geotia magic, when you can read about online. Geotia was about invoking angels (aka bargaining with angels for power) and evoking demons (aka ripping demonic power right out of a demon). The net result was that you asked nicely from good things and ripped mercilessly from bad things that were already sealed away anyway. You can read all about the real-world concepts that pact magic is based by googling Aleister Crowley. Bit of a freaky Brit, that one.
To some extent, your allies / GM SHOULD look at pact magic like demonic possession, because flavor-wised that's how most of the world views it too. To the vast majority of folk, pact magic is NOT okay, even when you're sealing pacts with angels because for the most part, you're messing around with your immortal soul when you perform a pact and there as a general rule of thumbs, spirits are out for themselves. They want to use you to accomplish their goals. Nothing more, nothing less.
So the question is: are you strong enough to master them regardless?
Interesting. I will ponder some then try to catch my DM when he's feeling better.
I'll put any questions I think here. Thanks :)
Do you guys have any intent to do any mythic support for Pact Magic? Maybe just a list of recommended paths and abilities?
Do you guys have any intent to do any mythic support for Pact Magic? Maybe just a list of recommended paths and abilities?
Yes. Eventually. It won't be our next product, but it will exist.
I want to do Mythic versions of our feats and Mythic pacts. In my head, a Mythic pact would let you add X to the spirit's binding DC in order to gain one of the following: new major granted ability, new minor granted ability, or a major upgrade to an existing granted ability. Not sure how it'll work yet, but it's definitely been on my mind as my kitsune bellflower tiller makes his way through Wrath of the Righteous.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
If I may chime in here, Alexander's Pact Magic is the definitive version of the "soul splicing" magic system. The system is clean and can be played simply, yet it can grow to something huge and complex for a few additional character gains should that sort of powergaming be desired. The various dichotomies he has built can require some ciphering to get through, so be ready to focus a bit should the depths of the rabbit hole be your goal. The end result is worth it, though, so pop a peppermint for focus and get in there!
The only thing I didn't like was the nine-level progression, but this is merely from a workload standpoint. Nine levels means 50% more work for the designer if he wants to avoid having sparse options in his offerings. Rest assured that Mr. Augunas has liberally paid for that aspect of his design. You have your options. He lost sleep giving you them. In the end, this class really feels like it has brain baby status in the creator's mind. As a result, it has more support than most everything from the Advanced Player's Guide.
He lost sleep giving you them.
And continues to loose sleep giving them to you. -_-
Thanks for the kind words! :D
He lost sleep giving you them.And continues to loose sleep giving them to you. -_-
Thanks for the kind words! :D
Sleep is for the weak!
More questions: In the 3.5 version there was a feat called Practiced Binding, at least I think that was what is called and it gave a +4 bonus on your binding checks. I looked over the occult feats presented on the d20pfsrd and didn't see an equivalent. Is there one in some of the other books?
Villains of Pact Magic and Pact Magic Unbound vol. 2. There is overlap from what I understand. How much and what would be better for a player to get?
In some ways could pact magic be viewed as a kind of urban or scholarly shamanism?
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
More questions: In the 3.5 version there was a feat called Practiced Binding, at least I think that was what is called and it gave a +4 bonus on your binding checks. I looked over the occult feats presented on the d20pfsrd and didn't see an equivalent. Is there one in some of the other books?
I think our version of that feat is in Volume 2. About half of Volume 2 is on the D20PFSRD.com site.
Villains of Pact Magic and Pact Magic Unbound vol. 2. There is overlap from what I understand. How much and what would be better for a player to get?
Villains of Pact Magic was written for 3.5. As such, Pact Magic Unbound, Vol 2 is going to be better for you unless you want GM supplements, like campaign story hooks and stuff. Villains is AWESOME for campaign seeds.
In some ways could pact magic be viewed as a kind of urban or scholarly shamanism?
That's how occult scholars view it. Occult scholars are pretty much obsessed with using Pact Magic to learn esoteric information about history through their eye-witness accounts. Even if it hasn't always been "legal" or "popular," there have been occultists during every known era of the world, so spirits have SEEN a lot of stuff. An occult scholar's job is to interview those spirits and learn what he can from them.
We mention occult scholars a lot throughout Pact Magic lore, but they get an official occultist archetype in Vol 2.