Like the title of the thread states, is it possible to grapple someone, and also pin someone in the same round?
Lets say I take a Full attack action to charge someone and grapple them at the end. Because I am charging, I get a +2 to the grapple. However, since I am using flurry of maneuvers, I am taking a -2 to the grapple, so a net of +0 to the first grapple. Then with the flurry of maneuvers, I try to pin the opponent. Do I get to pin him with a -2? OR..... Because I charged that round, do I get a to pin him with a net of +0? For the same reason of a ragepouncelance benefit of charging?
Do you know where I can find this general consensus?
Do you know where I can find this general consensus?A charge is a specific full-round action, distinct and different from a full attack action. Thus you cannot combine them.
Otherwise everyone would take full attack actions after a charge, and pounce would have no value.
Actually I was referring the later part that spoke of grappling someone and then pinning them using a flurry of maneuvers.
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You can't flurry of maneuvers and grapple then pin simone in the same round. The reason is basically this. Flurry of maneuvers only changes one thing about the maneuvers the action needed to initiate them. The actual rules ro how the maneuvers themselves work does not in any way change.
So general rule says all maneuvers are standard actions. Special flurry of maneuvers rule.changes this. Specific grapple rules say maintaining a grapple is a standard action.
The maintain rule is specific to grapple and not mentioned in flurry of maneuvers. The end result is you can only pin while maintaining as a standard action.
You can't flurry of maneuvers and grapple then pin simone in the same round. The reason is basically this. Flurry of maneuvers only changes one thing about the maneuvers the action needed to initiate them. The actual rules ro how the maneuvers themselves work does not in any way change.
So general rule says all maneuvers are standard actions. Special flurry of maneuvers rule.changes this. Specific grapple rules say maintaining a grapple is a standard action.
The maintain rule is specific to grapple and not mentioned in flurry of maneuvers. The end result is you can only pin while maintaining as a standard action.
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At 1st level, as part of a full-attack action, a maneuver master can make one additional combat maneuver, regardless of whether the maneuver normally replaces a melee attack or requires a standard action
Flurry of maneuvers specifically changes the grapple maneuver to be an attack. It doesn't matter if that maneuver is being used to establish a hold or maintain one. The check being an attack is the entire point of a maneuver masters ability.
Your designation of the grapple rules as the most specific is incredibly arbitrary, and the expectation that they should reference an archetype ability that wouldn't be written for years is... odd.
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grapple someone, and also pin someone in the same round?
Full attack action to charge someone and grapple them at the end.
If you have FoM, you can do a Grapple then do a Grapple to Pin. Expect table variance.
You can't Charge and Grapple at the end unless you have Pounce and FoM that allows you to take a Full Attack at the end of the Charge.
At 1st level you cannot FOM to pin an opponent unless you have a weapon that gives you a grapple attempt. At 6th level when you can perform 2 maneuvers you can grapple twice, once to establish a grapple, and once to pin, as part of your full attack sequence.
The only way to get 2 maneuvers at 1st level with FOM is if at leas one of them can be substituted for an attack action, like trip. Only the extra maneuver granted by FOM gets to ignore the action restriction for maneuvers like grapple or dirty trick which are normally separate standard actions.
As has been mentioned above, a charge is a separate action from full attack so FOM does not apply on a charge.
If you are looking to pin someone as early as possible, the quickest build that I've come up with was level 3 Maneuver master monk/Lore Warden fighter
1st(monk): Bonus feat: Improved trip, flurry of blows, stunning fist, unarmed strike, Feat: Ki throw
2nd(1st fighter): Fighter feat: Improved grapple
3rd(2nd fighter): Feat: Binding throw, Combat Expertise, Fighter feat: Equipment trick - rope trick - hogtie
Of course you could change up the classes a bit but going this route at 4 (fighter 3) you would get +2 cmb.
With this setup if you weren't right next to the target you would charge and trip at the end of the charge which (if successful leads you to grapple)
If next to the target you would FOM and use your regular attack to trip (which leads to grapple) and then for your maneuver you could move to pin.
If however you are looking for the fastest way to Tie up (make someone helpless) you can actually skip pinning and go straight to tying them up with this build.
If you are grappling the target, you can attempt to tie him up in ropes, but doing so requires a combat maneuver check at a –10 penalty.
Hogtie (Improved Grapple): When you attempt to tie up an opponent you are grappling, your penalty is only –5 instead of the normal –10.
As you can see you can go from the grapple (which you get a free check as a swift action when you trip thanks to binding throw) to tie up by taking a -5 to CMB with this feat. However; The target is tripped, grappled, and prone with a -6 to their CMD leaving you slightly better off than you were when you started.
If you are looking to pin someone as early as possible, the quickest build that I've come up with was level 3 Maneuver master monk/Lore Warden fighter
1st(monk): Bonus feat: Improved trip, flurry of blows, stunning fist, unarmed strike, Feat: Ki throw
2nd(1st fighter): Fighter feat: Improved grapple
3rd(2nd fighter): Feat: Binding throw, Combat Expertise, Fighter feat: Equipment trick - rope trick - hogtie
Of course you could change up the classes a bit but going this route at 4 (fighter 3) you would get +2 cmb.
With this setup if you weren't right next to the target you would charge and trip at the end of the charge which (if successful leads you to grapple)
If next to the target you would FOM and use your regular attack to trip (which leads to grapple) and then for your maneuver you could move to pin.
If however you are looking for the fastest way to Tie up (make someone helpless) you can actually skip pinning and go straight to tying them up with this build.
If you are grappling the target, you can attempt to tie him up in ropes, but doing so requires a combat maneuver check at a –10 penalty.Hogtie (Improved Grapple): When you attempt to tie up an opponent you are grappling, your penalty is only –5 instead of the normal –10.As you can see you can go from the grapple (which you get a free check as a swift action when you trip thanks to binding throw) to tie up by taking a -5 to CMB with this feat. However; The target is tripped, grappled, and prone with a -6 to their CMD leaving you slightly better off than you were when you started.
You missed a couple of prereqs. Binding Throw has Ki Throw as a prereq. And Ki Throw has Improved Trip.