Hey everyone. I'm about to take the plunge and buy a few Pathfinder books (Core Rulebook, APG, and probably Ultimate Combat or Magic) and I'm trying to decide if I want to go with digital or physical copies. There appears to be a lot of good reasons to go the PDF route (price, portability, etc.). Unfortunately, from what I've seen tablets really struggle with these fancy PDFs when flipping quickly for references. Has anyone found a PDF reader that is exceptionally fast or has some other feature that helps in this area? Obviously, bookmarks are helpful, but I'm still new enough that everything would be bookmarked. I recall hearing about some super fast PDF reader a while back that essentially buffered the whole book at the tradeoff of sacrificed zoom image quality, but I can't recall or find anything about it now. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
Well paizo offers 'light' versions of all their rpg book pdfs now. They dont have the art and are much more compressed files. Those flip through rather easily on my kindle fire HD, and its only the larger books I've ever had an issue with. Its never going to be as fast as flipping through a normal book in my mind, but thats just a function of the limitations of current tablets then a problem with the pdf and the reader.
That said, for the most part, for quick referencing I use the prd or srd any time I have access to the internet. I use the pdfs or the books for general reading, but if i need to look up a rule or a spell or something, the prd is something I've gotten really comfortable with.
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The PDFs are pretty heavy, even the light ones. However, my Nexus 7 from a couple of years ago actually does OK with them; it's not too bad flipping. If you factor in the fact that you've got a table of contents you can click on, even though the page rendering is noticable it's still probably faster than flipping actual physical pages.
(Note that Paizo's "Light" PDFs do have the art. I'm not exactly sure what's "Light" about them, but I would guess the art and background images are not as high resolution. You probably won't even notice this unless you print it out. They only have "Light" versions for the RPG line, not for the Campaign Setting, Adventure Path, etc. lines.)
On my computer, I use Linux. Both evince and okular (PDF readers) were painfully slow rendering the pages. (A few seconds.) However, the mupdf library (and the very basic mupdf reader) is quite snappy. I discovered a standalone PDF reader called llpp (yes, that's a git archive, meaning I downloaded the source and compiled it myself; I don't know if there are binary distributions anywhere) that most people probably wouldn't like, but that I love, because it uses keyboard commands similar to the "less" utility that an old grognard Unix user like myself feels very comfortable and at home with. I use llpp for all my RPG PDF browsing on my laptop and desktop nowadays, and it's extremely functional.
TL;DR Moral of the story: some PDF readers are much faster than others, by an order of magnitude. Experiment a bit, play with different readers, and you might find one that works faster and better than the one you had been using. If one advertises that it uses the "MuPDF" library as its back-end, it might be a fast one. Adobe's reader probably isn't going to be the best one.
All that being said, I'm like Kolokotroni. For big, two-columned books, I prefer to browse in a physical book. I don't know if I'll be able to continue to afford to do this, but I've been subscribing to lots of lines to get both PDF and physical, and I've been buying the physical RPG books at my FLGS and the PDFs from Paizo, so I'll have both formats. The PDFs are very handy for carrying around, but if I'm just idly reading, I really like having the books.
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If you're using any iOS devices, I cannot recommend GoodReader highly enough, and FoxIt is also superb.
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To clarify: The "Lite" versions of our PDFs have simplified/flattened background elements that improve page loading time on mobile devices. These area available for all of our Hardcover products (the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game line, Inner Sea World Guide, Inner Sea Gods, and Rise of the Runelords Anniversary Edition).
I haven't explored readers much. I use Adobe or iBooks for my third-generation iPad, and I only use the regular (heavy?) PDFs. I notice lag when I try to quickly flip through several pages in succession. In all honesty, though, I don't really notice the lag when I'm trying to skip through links in the document or through shortcuts in the "Bookmarks" section.
One truism about computers is that if they're slow doing something, wait a couple of years and buy a new computer... :)
(I remember back in 1991 or thereabouts when rendering a JPEG image took a long time.)
With the video and 3D gaming capability of an ipad (or any other major tablet), the last thing I expected to desire more processing power for was reading books.
Does this look like the mupdf feature that you mentioned? https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/mupdf/id482941798?mt=8
I have to use a lot of pic heavy pdfs for textbooks, so I've actually tried iBooks, PDF Reader and Adobe Reader. Outside of ibooks terrible non-collapsible contents tab (it shouldn't take ten swipes to get to the bottom of the contents tab) they all perform similarly. I've read good things about Goodreader, Readdle PDF Expert, and iAnnotate, but seeing as some of these cost $10 it can be difficult to try them all.
Chief Technical Officer
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I do have to mention that different PDF rendering engines can sometimes display things differently. While most parts of most PDFs should look just fine in most PDF readers, using a recent version of Adobe Reader is the only way to be sure that what you're seeing is what we intended.
(Apple's Preview app has been notably problematic in the past.)
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If you're using any iOS devices, I cannot recommend GoodReader highly enough, and FoxIt is also superb.
+1 to Goodreader. I use an iPad and Goodreader is a really great PDF viewer.
I prefer PDF Expert on iOS, it even does full text search across the complete library.
If you're using any iOS devices, I cannot recommend GoodReader highly enough
I love GoodReader and have used it for years. They just released a new version which both iPad and iPhone compatible, and will even import all your old version's content. (Which took a while cause I have 16+ GB of content.)
So here's the follow up for anyone interested: I ended up getting Goodreader and the "Lite" versions of CRB, APG, UM, and ARG. The difference is really impressive. While it isn't instantaneous (nothing is), it is about as good as I could have possibly expected. Pages located near my current page (i.e. flipping around) preload well, and when they aren't they normally take less than a half-second. Jumping to a random page normally results in a load time of about 2 seconds. iBooks with the full PDFs on the other hand, often takes 2-3 times that long (and sometimes much longer than that). This was all with an iPad 4 for reference.
Thanks for the tips everyone! I definitely don't regret going the PDF route now!
Hey everyone. I'm about to take the plunge and buy a few Pathfinder books (Core Rulebook, APG, and probably Ultimate Combat or Magic) and I'm trying to decide if I want to go with digital or physical copies. There appears to be a lot of good reasons to go the PDF route (price, portability, etc.). Unfortunately, from what I've seen tablets really struggle with these fancy PDFs when flipping quickly for references. Has anyone found a PDF reader that is exceptionally fast or has some other feature that helps in this area? Obviously, bookmarks are helpful, but I'm still new enough that everything would be bookmarked. I recall hearing about some super fast PDF reader a while back that essentially buffered the whole book at the tradeoff of sacrificed zoom image quality, but I can't recall or find anything about it now. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
I picked up a Galaxy NotePro 12.2 specifically for this. With Repligo Reader (something like $5), I find it works very well. Not cheap, but I deliberately wanted a massive screen which is very nearly 1:1 for a physical book. If you zoom in just enough to not be showing the margins, you are at 1:1
It handles bookmarks, page-navigation, zooming, all the usual stuff. It remembers where you were within a PDF so when you re-open you get the same page. It has a recent PDFs list, so bouncing back and forth between a few books is easy.
However, my Nexus 7 from a couple of years ago actually does OK with them; it's not too bad flipping.
I have the Nexus 7 but never use it (since I've moved to iPads). What PDF viewer would you recommend for the Paizo PDFs?
Thanks!
However, my Nexus 7 from a couple of years ago actually does OK with them; it's not too bad flipping.I have the Nexus 7 but never use it (since I've moved to iPads). What PDF viewer would you recommend for the Paizo PDFs?
Thanks!
This is me, pointing at the post above yours. <Grin>
Oh, and it turns out it's $3.
It depends on what kind of playing you do and how many books you think you'll pick up. If you always play at the same place and you only plan on picking up 3-4 books then PDFs are not that attractive. If you play in different locations or use many books (my tablet has about 25 books on it) then PDFs are definitely the way to go.
After trying out a few different PDF readers I settled on Goodreader. I'm using it on a first(!) generation iPad and I get by okay - it's not great for rapidly flipping through pages because of the loading times, but for reading it works well.
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However, my Nexus 7 from a couple of years ago actually does OK with them; it's not too bad flipping.I have the Nexus 7 but never use it (since I've moved to iPads). What PDF viewer would you recommend for the Paizo PDFs?
Thanks!
The one I've been using is called "DocumentViewer", which is a fork of the last GPL version of EBookDroid. Its home page is
https://github.com/dschuermann/document-viewer
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Hey everyone. I'm about to take the plunge and buy a few Pathfinder books (Core Rulebook, APG, and probably Ultimate Combat or Magic) and I'm trying to decide if I want to go with digital or physical copies. There appears to be a lot of good reasons to go the PDF route (price, portability, etc.). Unfortunately, from what I've seen tablets really struggle with these fancy PDFs when flipping quickly for references. Has anyone found a PDF reader that is exceptionally fast or has some other feature that helps in this area? Obviously, bookmarks are helpful, but I'm still new enough that everything would be bookmarked. I recall hearing about some super fast PDF reader a while back that essentially buffered the whole book at the tradeoff of sacrificed zoom image quality, but I can't recall or find anything about it now. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
I have a 1st generation iPad and I use GoodReader to view PDFs. The only Paizo PDF my tablet struggled with was the Inner Sea Poster Map. I haven't tried opening it in a long time, so maybe one of the various GoodReader updates fixed the crash.
-Skeld
It depends on what kind of playing you do and how many books you think you'll pick up. If you always play at the same place and you only plan on picking up 3-4 books then PDFs are not that attractive. If you play in different locations or use many books (my tablet has about 25 books on it) then PDFs are definitely the way to go.
Another problem that PDFs solve occurs when your spouse happens to also play Pathfinder. If both people need a book at different locations (like at a con) a PDF is much more cost effective option. From what I understand from messageboard posts, the single watermark is valid for both spouses/domestic partners. While this is probably a pretty uncommon issue, it's something to keep in mind for a few people.
Quick PDF question. If you buy a PDF and the book is later reprinted with errata included, can you download a newer version PDF with the errata?
I have seen a few times where I got a message from Paizo hat said "this PDF has been updated". Then I just downloaded it again. PDFs are a heck of a lot easier to fix than a printed book. :)
Many PDF readers also allow you to put notes of your own into it.
I think a lot depends on whether you are playing PFS or not.
For PFS, you need the PDF for any book you want to use but don't want to carry with you.
For home games, I generally find it quite satisfactory to buy the book alone and reference the needed material in the Paiso PRD or the d20pfsrd site if I need it at a game session.