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Takes a deep breath
[rant]
Sometimes I just don’t like people and the life a hermit seems very attractive.
Maybe it’s just all in my head, but lately it feels like everyone is actively trying stretch my nerves like a violin string. Then they proceed to seeing how hard they can pluck the string before it snaps.
PFS is a social, cooperative, teamwork, friendly, and organized hobby. Everyone understand this. Right? Please tell me everyone knows this.
That guy
Shows up 15 minutes late.
Then leaves to order food at the restraint next door.
Spends 30 minutes searching for character sheets scattered through folders and books, oh that one is not leveled, oh can’t find the chronicle sheets for that one, hunh no equipment sheet for that one. Has to keep stopping his search to tell us the back story of every character he sees a sheet for.
Then leaves again to go pick up his food.
Won’t stop talking to listen to the intro.
Gets his food all over the map and other peoples dice, mini’s, and the table.
Before he takes an action in an encounter he has to tell us what his other character would have done.
Constantly talks and loudly so that we have to keep asking the GM to repeat himself.
Turned what the people online said was a short scenario (usually about 3 hours) into a nearly 6 hour ordeal.
The other guy
His character spent no money on anything except his +3 adamantine great axe and a chain shirt. Doesn’t even have any food or water on his character sheet. Expects the rest of the party to just spend all their resources and efforts keeping him alive then basking in his greatness as he kills everything (whether it needs killing or not).
Gets bored and disruptive anytime there is not fighting.
The kid (no matter the age)
Runs a CN unpredictable, freedom loving, ash-hat.
“I start throwing thunderstones as fast as I can!” “We’re trying to sneak in.” “So what I keep throwing.”
“My archer doesn’t like to fight in small rooms so he runs past and opens the door at the other end of the hall looking for a bigger room.”
Won’t take part in the diplomacy attempts since he has no ranks but then won’t take part in the fight with talking breaks down because “He never did anything to me, you guys should have done a better job of talking to it.”
“Going to the left all the time is stupid, I go to the right and open the door.” (We had already opened the door on the left and encountered something deadly.)
“My archer doesn’t like DR so he does nothing.” “You could try to take a shot anyway, it is only DR 5 so some damage might get through.” “No.”
“It’s an animal sort of and we shouldn’t kill animals.” “It attacked us.” “But I like animals, so I’m going over here and opening that door.”
“There’s stuff in the way giving it cover, I do nothing.” “You could take the shot anyway. It is only a 4 penalty and a 20 always hits.” “Nope, no point I won’t hit.”
“If I shoot it I’ll provoke so I do nothing.” “You could draw a dagger and stab it since it is beating on you.” “I don’t have anything other than the bow.” “Then why didn’t you pick up one of the weapons off of all the other guys we killed?” ”I don’t have any feats to be good with anything else.” “Well than at least withdraw so it can’t beat on you anymore.” “But that would be cowardly.”
{{ Ok, yes. We probably all had fun with a character like that when we were 12 and playing with other 12 year olds. But come on. He is not 12 and every one of his characters is like that all time. Even when everyone has asked him repeatedly to stop doing it he just keeps on keeping on. }}
I only do X
He built this character to whirlwind/charge/pounce/whatever. So he will ignore or actively disrupt any tactics that doesn’t involve him doing his chosen X specialty.
“Close with the caster.” “But then I can’t do X and 5372 damage.” “We don’t need 5372 damage a couple dozen will probably kill him. But what we really need is for him to not cast a fire ball frying us, destroying all the evidence, and alerting the everyone in the castle.” “I move over to the side to try and set up for X.” Kaboom!
“Cut of the escape route.” “But I can X.” “Your X isn’t useful right now. We need to stop him from getting away. Remember last time?” “Whatever, I move in and X.” “He got away.”
The Unwashed
Take a freakin' shower! If you don't have time to shower then you don't have time to game. I do not want to smell you ripe stench for the next 4 hours. Go home.
Are you really trying to give me an aneurysm?!? Cause you’re doing a surprisingly good job.
[/rant]
Sorry, but I had to get some of that out before the log jam burst and I said something hurtful.
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This is why I never leave my basement.
Also because June locked the door.
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Takes a deep breath
[rant]
Sometimes I just don’t like people and the life a hermit seems very attractive.Maybe it’s just all in my head, but lately it feels like everyone is actively trying stretch my nerves like a violin string. Then they proceed to seeing how hard they can pluck the string before it snaps.
PFS is a social, cooperative, teamwork, friendly, and organized hobby. Everyone understand this. Right? Please tell me everyone knows this.
That guy
Shows up 15 minutes late.
Then leaves to order food at the restraint next door.
Spends 30 minutes searching for character sheets scattered through folders and books, oh that one is not leveled, oh can’t find the chronicle sheets for that one, hunh no equipment sheet for that one. Has to keep stopping his search to tell us the back story of every character he sees a sheet for.
Then leaves again to go pick up his food.
Won’t stop talking to listen to the intro.
Gets his food all over the map and other peoples dice, mini’s, and the table.
Before he takes an action in an encounter he has to tell us what his other character would have done.
Constantly talks and loudly so that we have to keep asking the GM to repeat himself.
Turned what the people online said was a short scenario (usually about 3 hours) into a nearly 6 hour ordeal.The other guy
His character spent no money on anything except his +3 adamantine great axe and a chain shirt. Doesn’t even have any food or water on his character sheet. Expects the rest of the party to just spend all their resources and efforts keeping him alive then basking in his greatness as he kills everything (whether it needs killing or not).
Gets bored and disruptive anytime there is not fighting.The kid (no matter the age)
Runs a CN unpredictable, freedom loving, ash-hat.
“I start throwing thunderstones as fast as I can!” “We’re trying to sneak in.” “So what I keep throwing.”
“My archer doesn’t like to fight in small rooms so he runs past and opens...
I hate those that are "freedom loving" too!
That's why I never play PFS.
My home group can't match schedules often enough to satisfy my PF fix. And my schedule isn't regular enough to start a whole new group.
I also consider PFS an excellent way to vet people before I would invite them to our home group. Needless to say, I have located a few people that will not be coming to my house on a regular basis.
It's not usually like this. There are really very few out of the 50 or so regulars that I have any problems with. There pretty good folks.
But lately...
That's why I never play PFS.My home group can't match schedules often enough to satisfy my PF fix. And my schedule isn't regular enough to start a whole new group.
You wanna know a real nightmare? Those guys have been my home group!
You forgot a few btw. Don't forget that one guy that brought some form of intoxication and tries to get everyone to join in! Or that guy that doesn't just go to get food, he wants to take 2 or 3 people with him. There's also that guy that says he'll show, but he doesn't really mean it and he's all like "Hey bro... BRO! Not going. Out with that one dude you know! YOu know the dude right? Dude? Why you hatin' on me dude?" and this is you calling him like... half an hour later, with no tell he wouldn't show. and oh my gosh so many more I could rant about.
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I will add another:
The Lazy Uninterested Technophobe
When your told from the start that EVERY player at the table does game notes on a rotating basis then refuses to do them out of sheer laziness.
Refuses to use email or any form of social media. Demanding to be contacted by telephone and only telephone. Again out of laziness. While spending hours playing MMOS so it's not a fer of the internet.
Utterly uninterested in getting involved in group emails or tactics.
The player who ignores advice and does not pay attention at the table.
Is either drawing in a book or reading the latest rpg book he or she bought. Then getting very passive agressive when it it ends bad for his character.
Forgets to tell the party that he has used his high level spells in a previous fight. Remembers to tell the party during another fight. It's not up to the rest of the players to ask if the casters are out of magic.
Forgets to tell the group that the charatcer stlls has injuries from a previous fight. Brings it up again during a new fight.
A lack of drive or will to learn the character completely. With a group that is at least 10th level or higher. Still not knowing the spell list. I'm not saying to learn a spell list by heart. After a certain point a player should have the basics down at least.
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I've never had a problem if my players wanted to have a beer or two but they also know if I ever have to call a cutoff point that that means no more at my games so they usually have 1 maybe 2 over the course of the night.
We've had a player that couldn't stay away from his MMO long enough to play one session so he'd do all his "roleplaying" from his computer chair and would be checking the computer during "not my turn" during combat. And then for good measure he'd get mad if others weren't playing their character like he would or didn't game like he did in general. For example I was not a good spell caster because at the time I only owned 3d4 and had to roll 2d4 twice in order to roll my 5d4 magic missile.
Another player we've had was the "I'm playing a character with high Wisdom so that means I'm wise enough to know XXXX could play my character better and I'll let him." ... and then he invited his son to the game (they didn't last much longer)
I have people who are mature enough drink and game, we share a port, wine or whiskey. We eat good cheese and dips, we loosen up and have fun.
The people I game with are all very hard working and half of us have children under the age of 2. We start at 7 and go until midnight every second Friday.
Sometimes one of us will fall asleep at the table.... Not out of boredom just because of the nature of our work, 1 player travels thousands of kilometres in a week others of us are on call and can be in for 24 hours if something goes down.
I really dislike the one who brings some form of intoxication. I ask the one to go away and never play again.
What's wrong with drunk PF? I thought that was the whole point of the Fighter!
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I really dislike the one who brings some form of intoxication. I ask the one to go away and never play again.What's wrong with drunk PF? I thought that was the whole point of the Fighter!
No. I expressly disallow alcohol when either I GM or the game is played at my place. I don't care if people can pace themselves, have insane tolerance or just want a single drink. Alcohol is not to be consumed during my games.
I heard of another dm that also had that firm stance. I think he really overstepped his bounds and forgot who he actually is--just a guy running games for friends. The thing is, dms don't get to decide what I drink. There is enough of the nanny-state now without the dm trying to jump in as well.
My groups have drank fine honeyed ale at games or cruisers, and the experience was made better for it (so much laughter).
The dm can say, no alcoholic beverages in my house at all! Should it actually be their house. Yet he/she doesn't know what they had to deal with that day and such rulings have no power beyond certain spheres. Also, does it extend to sweet alcoholic sweets? My players have brought them and all was well. Yeah, trying to control the drinks imbibed and the chocolates eaten is going too far. The dm is just a guy running games, not peoples lives outside of the game. Focus on the kobolds and 20 by 10 rooms thanks.
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No. I expressly disallow alcohol when either I GM or the game is played at my place. I don't care if people can pace themselves, have insane tolerance or just want a single drink. Alcohol is not to be consumed during my games.
A few of my group drink every time we game - social experience and all. I've found that the players who get embarrassed about role playing tend to be a little more open after knocking back a few. Much like karaoke.
Is your game more serious in nature in that you want everyone focused, or do you just dislike people drinking around you?
To my sorrow, I have gamed with almost all of these types. When I try to sleep at night, they appear, mocking me: "You'll never get those hours of your life back! You'll never get those hours of your life back! Ha ha ha ha haaaa!"
And yet if I shackle them to a mighty stone, and roll that stone into the sea, suddenly I'm the bad guy!
*Neutral dm sipping ale does not judge*.
No. I expressly disallow alcohol when either I GM or the game is played at my place. I don't care if people can pace themselves, have insane tolerance or just want a single drink. Alcohol is not to be consumed during my games.A few of my group drink every time we game - social experience and all. I've found that the players who get embarrassed about role playing tend to be a little more open after knocking back a few. Much like karaoke.
Is your game more serious in nature in that you want everyone focused, or do you just dislike people drinking around you?
Very good karaoke point!
No. I expressly disallow alcohol when either I GM or the game is played at my place. I don't care if people can pace themselves, have insane tolerance or just want a single drink. Alcohol is not to be consumed during my games.A few of my group drink every time we game - social experience and all. I've found that the players who get embarrassed about role playing tend to be a little more open after knocking back a few. Much like karaoke.
Is your game more serious in nature in that you want everyone focused, or do you just dislike people drinking around you?
Hama and I have had this conversation with DMUDB before. Neither of us likes to be around alcohol, period. Speaking personally, I've left games where drinking has been occurring because I simply do not want to be around alcohol. I also don't allow alcohol in my home, so if I'm hosting the game, same goes. If someone else is, and it comes down to a choice between being around people who are drinking and missing out on the game, I bid people farewell and catch them sometime/somewhere the alcohol is not present.
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That's why I never play PFS.
With the exception of cons, I avoid all environments in which just anyone can sit down to game. For example, the games club at my college has a couple belligerent types who make the game exhausting.
But not to worry, the other club members have never read the Five Geek Social Fallacies, so they're still trying to get the annoying players to quit by pulling high school BS!
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Hama and I have had this conversation with DMUDB before. Neither of us likes to be around alcohol, period. Speaking personally, I've left games where drinking has been occurring because I simply do not want to be around alcohol. I also don't allow alcohol in my home, so if I'm hosting the game, same goes. If someone else is, and it comes down to a choice between being around people who are drinking and missing out on the game, I bid people farewell and catch them sometime/somewhere the alcohol is not present.
That makes sense. Some people are just not into alcohol. I don't want to sound like the alcohol advocate, but in my experience its certain people that get obnoxious/aggressive/whatever that makes them unpleasant to be around when they're drunk rather than everyone. With people like that, its not worth it.
We recently had a gamer's weekend where we had two long sessions. As we were in a safe area and no one had to drive anywhere, the alcohol consumption was higher than usual. Two of the guys were drinking hard liquor and became slightly obnoxious. I not so subtlety suggested that if we do a gamer weekend again, no hard liquor.
Either way, if a GM or host asked for no alcohol, I wouldn't have a problem respecting that rule.
Hama and I have had this conversation with DMUDB before. Neither of us likes to be around alcohol, period. Speaking personally, I've left games where drinking has been occurring because I simply do not want to be around alcohol. I also don't allow alcohol in my home, so if I'm hosting the game, same goes. If someone else is, and it comes down to a choice between being around people who are drinking and missing out on the game, I bid people farewell and catch them sometime/somewhere the alcohol is not present.No. I expressly disallow alcohol when either I GM or the game is played at my place. I don't care if people can pace themselves, have insane tolerance or just want a single drink. Alcohol is not to be consumed during my games.A few of my group drink every time we game - social experience and all. I've found that the players who get embarrassed about role playing tend to be a little more open after knocking back a few. Much like karaoke.
Is your game more serious in nature in that you want everyone focused, or do you just dislike people drinking around you?
Yeah, I don't mind fellow gamers drinking to moderation, especially if it helps them relax into character, but I can totally understand no-drink house rules. If for no other reason, some gamers are recovering alcoholics and don't need the temptation.
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Mind you saying one does not want alcohol or smoking at a game needs to be said upfront and ASAP. That way those who like to drink or smoke can do so before or after the game. I also caution people to avoid making too many demands at other people homes. I don't mind accomadating a player or DM to a certain point. Laundry list of demands get you shown to the door. While I don't like alcohol at my game table. I'm also very careful not to offend or demand someone stop drinking in their homes.
Just like as player being rude or a DM with a god complex gets shown the door. I once was told that if I did not like how the DM was running the game to hit the road and not let the door hit me on the way out. In my apartment. As if I was going to leave my apartment so they could continue gaming. It's amazing how people don't think before they talk. The game ended there and then.
I am happy as long as there is no alcohol at the table. I've seen what it does to people, and don't trust anyone to drink responsibly.
Whatever works for your group is good.
As far as not trusting anyone to drink responsibly, that seems quite extreme. Do you not attend any weddings where drinking may occur? Never attend a party/family get together where alcohol is consumed? New Years?
I hope I'm not coming off as badgering - I'm more curious really.
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Alcohol is not welcome to my table either. You want to drink alcohol, fine. Do that instead. Drunk people think they are so much fun to be around, when in truth they are repetitive, annoying, and boring. And drinking moderately works only until the person in question has done so for a while. Then, see the above.
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I wonder if flat out banning of alcohol is a little too hard. Not seeing if this other person can handle their alcohol on a one drink maximum policy, but I can understand sometimes we experience things in life so bad, we can never justify them again. Remember the old saying"wrong me once, shame on you. Wrong me twice, shame on me." That saying leads me to believe I cannot fault him for his no alcohol stance. None of us want to find.out the hard way. If the player is up front about his restrictions on alcohol, then no one need fear people wasting time and money showing up to find a hostile environment. Actually, another person may invite someone over who did not.know the restriction.
I myself once left a New Year eve party 15 before midnight because I could smell drugs in the air. I never want anyone smoki.g drugs around me to ever result in some second hand smoke causing some inconclusive or false positive on a drug test.
I do not want to be in an apartment where drugs are. Even if they are not being used at that time. I do not want a drug raid while I am playing. I do not want to have to defend myself in court that I have nothing to do with distribution from the home ,or any other connectivity to the drug enterprise. Even just counting the drug money would mean you were involved in the drug enterprise.
Also be mindful that even just tobacco smoking can result in changing the way someone's home smells longer then your visit when it gets into the curtains(by the open window), the seating fabric, clothing drying on the fire escape, whatever.
If it's their first time, then it's generally not too hard to say "Hey, please don't bring that stuff into my home or to the game, thanks, that would be cool". It's when you do so and the person gets belligerent about their "right" to bring alcohol(/tobacco/whatever the offending element is) that things get hostile.
I likewise have never had any problems with someone bringing alcohol to the game after I've asked them not to, or showing up drunk (I can't say they didn't have a drink before they came, but I've never had someone slurring or stumbling or otherwise visibly displaying drunkenness). Ditto with cigarettes, I've had numerous friends who smoked and all of them had the courtesy to go outside to do so and spend some time airing out before they returned. One even was nice enough to bring air fresheners with him.
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I am happy as long as there is no alcohol at the table. I've seen what it does to people, and don't trust anyone to drink responsibly.Whatever works for your group is good.
As far as not trusting anyone to drink responsibly, that seems quite extreme. Do you not attend any weddings where drinking may occur? Never attend a party/family get together where alcohol is consumed? New Years?
I hope I'm not coming off as badgering - I'm more curious really.
I do. And I usually leave the moment someone gets drunk. I cannot stand drunken people.
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I don't allow drugs in my home. I won't game at someone else's house if drugs are involved. Period. I have never preached at anyone why they should not do/allow it. However, if asked why, I will inform them of the various reasons for my stance.
I do not mind moderate* drinking of alcohol at my home. I have the occasional drink myself. I don't mind gaming at someone's home that allows moderate drinking. I used to allow it during games at my home. However, a former player really didn't understand the concept of 'moderate' drinking. He didn't pass out or vomit on the table so to him that was 'moderate' drinking. After a few drinks he would slowly start getting louder and more obnoxious. I was just about to ask him to leave the group when he moved out of state anyway.
My current group includes someone recovering from a substance abuse problem. We all readily agreed to not put temptation in front of him. I was frankly glad of the excuse to not have it around during gaming.
* The key word is 'moderate' in that sentence. A couple of drinks of whatever. Being a little bit more loose and relaxed is fine. When several start not being a large enough description or you've already had a few before you arrive and start in on more, that is no longer moderate to me.
I do. And I usually leave the moment someone gets drunk. I cannot stand drunken people.I am happy as long as there is no alcohol at the table. I've seen what it does to people, and don't trust anyone to drink responsibly.Whatever works for your group is good.
As far as not trusting anyone to drink responsibly, that seems quite extreme. Do you not attend any weddings where drinking may occur? Never attend a party/family get together where alcohol is consumed? New Years?
I hope I'm not coming off as badgering - I'm more curious really.
I've never been to a wedding, party, or other celebration where alcohol has been served. (And before you ask, yes, I have been to weddings and parties and such like.) I likewise would probably leave if it was.
Mind you saying one does not want alcohol or smoking at a game needs to be said upfront and ASAP. That way those who like to drink or smoke can do so before or after the game. I also caution people to avoid making too many demands at other people homes. I don't mind accomadating a player or DM to a certain point. Laundry list of demands get you shown to the door. While I don't like alcohol at my game table. I'm also very careful not to offend or demand someone stop drinking in their homes.
Just like as player being rude or a DM with a god complex gets shown the door. I once was told that if I did not like how the DM was running the game to hit the road and not let the door hit me on the way out. In my apartment. As if I was going to leave my apartment so they could continue gaming. It's amazing how people don't think before they talk. The game ended there and then.
Ha, good you took a stand. No, they don't get to own your apartment because they are dming there.
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Hey, folks.
There are posters here from all round the world. Different countries, different cultures, different laws re alcohol, different alcohol, different drinking cultures.
Don't assume that if you normally expect people to drink moderately and sensibly, that means other people, possibly from a completely different part of the world, can do the same.
I used to know someone who would quite often lose his temper and become violent when he drank, (although I never saw him do worse than punch a hole in a door). When he started drinking, it was rather like having a powder keg in the corner of the room, and waiting for the explosion. I can't imagine being able to sit down and play an rpg with some one (or several someones) like that present. Nor would I stay at a wedding if it seemed certain a drunken brawl was going to break out (though I don't know if those are your reasons, Hama).
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The funny thing is that's how I ended meeting and playing with my longest gaming group for years. I was the first guy to stand up to that particular DM. The players as a whole we're just fed up yet to afraid to say anything to the DM for a variety if reasons. Bad news I ended up taking over for the DM. Up until that point I was just a player never a DM. It was a learning experience.
I do recommend being both careful and diplomatic when asking for no alcohol at someone else house. I respect that some have had bad experiences related to alcohol. Acting like a dick about it no matter how good one thinks the reasons are is asking got trouble. I will not hesitate to physically throw out anyone stranger or friend if they act up. Or call the police. Being a adult means acting like one.
I'm willing to make concessions up to a certain point. We used to have a player who just wanted to est at places that served kosher food because of his faith. Accommodating him once, twice a third time then the next time we went out we decided not to call him. I respect others desires. My desires need to be respected as well. I would not be able to ask my friends for zero alcohol 100% of the time. Maybe 50%-60%. After a certain point I would no longer have any friends. Or they would not call me to any social events at all.