Goblin Squad Member
|
Hey guys-
I did some looking, but didn't see anything about this specifically.
I see that 6 people (possibly more through the GW site) have backed Crowdforger Tavern Owner. Does anyone know if we can expect any of the Taverns to make it into EE?
Also, do we know if The Memorial of Honor will be in EE as well and if so where the location might be on the map?
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
I don't know about the Memorial of Honor, but yes the Taverns will be in EE. Exactly when depends on where they are located. According to Lee Hammock, Taverns near Thornkeep (i.e. presumably on the land rush map) should be in the game at the start of EE. Taverns located on other parts of the map will be added as the map expands, but all should be in place before OE.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Do you know where those locations are by chance? :)
Mine is paid up and located at the hex I outlined in red. I am not currently affiliated with any guild.
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5560/14441531810_816a815695_z.jpg
If Ryan or Lee is lurking around, I'm curious about revenue generation with taverns. I've seen a lot of great suggestions for the services they could offer, but my question is whether any of those services will render income to the owner. I'd hate to be paying upkeep on a tavern by running around the world scavenging for crap to sell because, unlike a merchant shop, it's apparently a charitable donation to the world! ;)
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Do you know where those locations are by chance? :)Mine is paid up and located at the hex I outlined in red. I am not currently affiliated with any guild.
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5560/14441531810_816a815695_z.jpg
If Ryan or Lee is lurking around, I'm curious about revenue generation with taverns. I've seen a lot of great suggestions for the services they could offer, but my question is whether any of those services will render income to the owner. I'd hate to be paying upkeep on a tavern by running around the world scavenging for crap to sell because, unlike a merchant shop, it's apparently a charitable donation to the world! ;)
What a sweet spot for a tavern! :D
I'll definitely stop by to visit. Does it have a name yet?
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
That's exactly what I wanted: to be a neutral "eye of the storm" in an area that's heavily trafficked and contested. Obviously no one can say how the game will play out, but I worked with their staff to make some best guesses about locations that would give me what I want. That's the hex we settled on. And if I'm sharing the hex with a memorial, so much the better! If not, there's still a lot of other stuff immediately in the area.
I have not settled on a name yet. I've contemplated a few, some of which are more meta-game jokes than others. But I wanted to see how thematically in-character people were going to approach the game before I went that way.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
That's exactly what I wanted: to be a neutral "eye of the storm" in an area that's heavily trafficked and contested. Obviously no one can say how the game will play out, but I worked with their staff to make some best guesses about locations that would give me what I want. That's the hex we settled on. And if I'm sharing the hex with a memorial, so much the better! If not, there's still a lot of other stuff immediately in the area.
I have not settled on a name yet. I've contemplated a few, some of which are more meta-game jokes than others. But I wanted to see how thematically in-character people were going to approach the game before I went that way.
If it's something I don't like, I'll deal with it. You spent the money, not me. :)
Edit - I don't see anything wrong with that name. It's your Inn. Make sure it's something you love. Who cares what others think.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Yeah, Guurzak is right. In fantasy, it seems like a good percentage of inns are just a combination of a color and an animal name.
At any rate, that's probably not the name I'm going to use. People seem to be looking for a little more immersion in this game -- which I think is awesome -- so I'll come up with something else.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
I've got loads of suggestions because I decided my wife would (let's call it "take Issue") with me handing out that kind of cash.
The Goblin's Head
The Wounded Ogre
Crusaders' Seat
The Working Goblin
Pharasma's Mark
Befuddled Gnome (Or elf, or orc, or goblin......)
The Feather and Shaft
...
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Do you know where those locations are by chance? :)Mine is paid up and located at the hex I outlined in red. I am not currently affiliated with any guild.
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5560/14441531810_816a815695_z.jpg
If Ryan or Lee is lurking around, I'm curious about revenue generation with taverns. I've seen a lot of great suggestions for the services they could offer, but my question is whether any of those services will render income to the owner. I'd hate to be paying upkeep on a tavern by running around the world scavenging for crap to sell because, unlike a merchant shop, it's apparently a charitable donation to the world! ;)
Best spot ever. :) Would have been my number 1 spot for sure.
I take it you would not want to name it anything too obvious like "The Crossing" or "Crossroads"?
I have put up a lot of questions about Inns in the "Ask Lee" thread for the videoblogs, but I feel those videoblogs may be on the backburner right now.
Since I love to speculate about Inns: let us try to flesh out what exactly all this could mean for Inns:
Inn: A welcoming tavern that provides lodgings, player power regeneration, limited trade goods, some training for social classes, and a space for social interaction
This was a quote from Ryan describing some PoI's and you can find pretty much the same in the description on the KS page.
- Lodgings: I am thinking a way to log out of the game, and receiving some perk for that when you do it in an Inn. Maybe a buff when you log back in?
- Player Power regeneration: speaks for itself, luckily this mechanism still seems to be in. There are some loopholes here though. I understand that a Cleric may have spells that can regenerate Power too, I hope they manage to balance this. I am thinking naked pocket-clerics parked at hex-borders or trailing players. This sounds like the number one reason to visit an Inn so I hope Clerics are not too overpowering in their power-regen abilities.
Other musings: how long would it take to regen power? Long enough so that socializing will happen? Will the Inn keeper get a fee for this? I hope so. Maybe you can buy a "drink" from the Inn-regular(not a real item) that actually start the power-regen proces, and you have to stay in the Inn for it to finish.
- Limited Trade Goods: My hope is that the Inn owner can stock his "regular"(that NPC they talk about in the KS description) with goods and can set his own prices. Next to maybe a small selection of low-level general items.
- Some training for social Classes: Bard was mentioned and Commoner I believe. I hope some Bard Feats are Inn-only purchasable. Like Perform tier 3?
- A space for social interaction: this is actually a tough one. This will only work if players truly have business in an Inn. Else players will find their own "hubs", like they did in Everquest where everyone crowded up in that small bank in North Freeport simply because Banking was important business (for trade and such). Absolutely nobody could be found in one of the many cool Inns in those cities. A pitfall, and I hope the devs are aware of this.
Here are a few more features that an Inn could have;
- A stopping place for fast Travel. It was mentioned that Fast Travel could be like the scripted pony rides you have in DaoC and Lotro, and an Inn could be a place where you can hop onto such a horse. It was said that Fast Travel would make use of these "hops": you can not jump into Fast Travel at any point, you need to find the closest hop-on point first. Inns with a small stable seems perfect for that.
- SafeHaven: an Inn could be a safehaven. The fact that Dan's Inn is on an NPC controlled road means that Guards should come running if any unsanctioned PvP is happening. They talked about Marshall-locations from where these guards come running. I wonder how many of those marshall poins there will be per Hex. Just the one? Or less? I am thinking at least one, not sure if hexborders put limitations on this.
The Crossroads where Dan's Inn is, seems like a perfect place for such a marshall post though so that could make it into a safe haven.
More Questions:
Will the Innkeper be safe from PvP in his own Inn?
Will the Innkeeper be able to set laws in his Inn? Alignment restrictions? Reputationtresholds?
Sorry for the long post, I sincerely hope GW will be the first developer that can make a MMO Inn actually interesting. Like the Cantinás were in SWG, for a short time (untill dance-bots entered the game, in like 2 weeks).
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Great post, Tyncale, and is sounds like we're on the same page in terms of our wishlists and questions. My central hope is that they can do something VERY few MMOs have pulled off which is lively, meaningful hubs for social activity.
Buffs, training, and supplies are all ways of accomplishing this. Even more so if they're truly safe neutral grounds. I would also love to see some other features built in like gambling, pub games, and board games. Nothing complex, but just enough to make the places worth visiting.
As for financing, I don't expect it to be a wild cash cow, but it'd be nice if I got some small percentage each time a transaction took place. I want to focus my energy on making the tavern an interesting place to be, conversing with the regulars, etc -- not wandering the wilderness, trying to kill enough goblins to pay my rent.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
I wanted to see how thematically in-character people were going to approach the game before I went that way.I think you can count on it that a lot of us will be working hard to fit in with the River Kingdoms we know-and-love from the campaign materials.
My vote, similar to Cald, is to go the IC route. In fact, you could provide and exemplar example to the world that PFO is an interesting place where you can truly experience the River Kingdoms!
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
After this thread and several PM conversations, I think that's exactly the route I'm going to take. I don't know what game circumstances (e.g. conflict) or tavern features will allow me to do, but I can at least give the place a decent name, interact with anyone that visits, and try to create social activities in and around the place for people to engage in. I really want to give people a reason to be there other than grabbing some supplies and logging off for a "rested" buff.
Heck, if anyone is RPing a bard -- and the inn provides me with income -- I'd love to even hire IC entertainment to visit.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
I completely understand the idea of some sort of tax/revenue/kickback system for people stopping by. That way you could focus more on say, entertaining people at your Tavern, versus (as you said) being forced to kill goblins all day just to pay the upkeep.
I wouldn't say that it should necessarily be enough to 100% pay the upkeep costs, but I do think that the amount should directly reflect the number of visitors/patrons that you can attract. That way, your character's day job really could be working at your tavern.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Branding is always good!
You want branding? Licence some of Caldeathe's lovely specialities!
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Did you, in your conversations with the Devs, learn what kind of upkeep it will require (coin, raw materials, etc.)?
If they know the required upkeep "items", I would think patrons might help with donations to ensure their favorite drinking hole does not disappear.
When I ran a community center in UO, I also had a charity fund that wealthy community members used to contribute to. The coin not only went to buying newbies needed items, but it purchased prizes for community events (archery competitions, horse races, festival events, etc.) that were run out of the community center. You'll find the community will be generous enough to help support an establishment if it benefits the community.
You might even consider a website. Such a site would afford you more space and functionality/features than the Tavern mechanics will likely be able to in-game, such as:
- your menu and prices
- your list of Tavern Services and possibly prices
- upcoming scheduled events (I can list a ton in another post)
- featured entertainment or "guest celebrity barkeep"
- message board (want adds, RP notes left, etc.)
- forums for suggestions for the tavern
- forums for RP stories that center around the Tavern and flesh out what our characters might be up to when we aren't "in-game".
It really just depends on how deep you want to go. Guild launch or other similar sites have all the features I've mentioned here, plus a shout box.
The one item from the above list that I'll flesh out a bit further - Tavern Services. You may find it profitable and also helpful to the community to have a number of services where your part in the deal is simply playing middle man - a nice, easily found location to hook up the real service provider and the customer. You simply charge a fee to the service provider for place of business or even advertising on your site, while also benefiting from the service customers coming to your Tavern and becoming a regular patrons. What those services are is an endless list. The thing to focus on is that Taverns aren't just for drinking and eating - they're focal points for networking. The more valuable you become as a spot for networking, the greater the asset you become for the community, and the more popular your Tavern will be in turn.
Mine is paid up and located at the hex I outlined in red. I am not currently affiliated with any guild.
Nice, very close to where I'll be living (Talonguard, just NE of your place). I look forward to dropping in when you open your doors.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Every town in every TT game system I've ever played has had at least one Slaughtered Lamb. They're like the Starbucks of fantasy RPG taverns.
Call it The Hideout! Bandits will love you for that.
"OK gang. After this job, we all meet back at the Hideout!"
Oooh ooh ooh call it "See a Man about a Dog". Then we can say "I'm off to See a Man about a Dog!"
In hindsight... I might be the only one who finds that funny...
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Oooh ooh ooh call it "See a Man about a Dog". Then we can say "I'm off to See a Man about a Dog!"
In hindsight... I might be the only one who finds that funny...
I found it amusing, and I have my own entry for the name: My Brother's Place
"Where are you going at this hour?"
"My Brother's Place."
"Oh, OK. Tell him I said hi."
"Yes, dear...."
<exit, stage right, grinning>
Haha Mine also was meant as a way to hoodwink a significant other. Because, at the end of the day, is that not what drinking holes are? A way to get away from the real world and the responsibilities one holds there.
Sadly that is why Ireland is falling apart. No one left in the real world to handle problems come 6pm...
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Ireland has been falling apart like that for millennia. It is unlikely to ever recover. Yet it was the Irish who preserved knowledge in Europe after the fall of the Roman Empire. Ireland may well be the sanctuary next time as well.
If it has been falling apart for as long as men can remember, Ireland may well be the last of us standing.
As an Irish man, I was just making a joke about our love of alcohol. In reality Ireland is not doing too badly. Our government is a bit backwards and we are in direction violation of at least two edicts of European Law but... At the end of the day tis graaand.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Did you, in your conversations with the Devs, learn what kind of upkeep it will require (coin, raw materials, etc.)?
No, I haven't heard. I know the tavern will require upkeep, and as long as I pay that upkeep, it can't be sieged or destroyed. But I have no idea what kind of upkeep it requires or what profit (if any) it yields.
You might even consider a website. Such a site would afford you more space and functionality/features than the Tavern mechanics will likely be able to in-game, such as:
That's an awesome list, and I'm going to bookmark it. Thank you for the great suggestions! I'll definitely create a community site for it, and regardless of what mechanical services it allows (i.e. selling supplies), I want to start building a rotation of non-mechanical events like contests, bartering nights, diplomatic gatherings, bard performances, etc.
However, I'm holding off until I at least see what the taverns look like in EE. Right now, I feel like anything I'd write would be such wild guesswork as to be meaningless, anyway.
Call it The Hideout! Bandits will love you for that.
"OK gang. After this job, we all meet back at the Hideout!"
Oooh ooh ooh call it "See a Man about a Dog". Then we can say "I'm off to See a Man about a Dog!"
Apparently it works! There's a real bar in my metro area called "That One Place". So if you tell your friends you're going to that one place, it actually has a specific meaning.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/That-One-Place-Bar-Grill/117160374970173