[PFS] Eldritch Knight gear advice


Advice

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Grand Lodge

This EK has hit 12th level in PFS, and has started playing through the "Eyes of the Ten" retirement arc. I've played part 1, so there are 3 sessions left. I've got just over 20,000gp at the moment, and I'm trying to decide what to buy. Here's a rundown of my current situation, as best I can remember it:

Human
Fighter1/Wiz6/EK5
Divination (Foresight), opposition schools are Necromancy and Illusion
Stats (including items):

STR 20
DEX 18
CON 14
INT 20
WIS 10
CHA 07

Traits: Reactionary, World Traveler (Diplomacy), Magical Knack, Fate's Favored.

Feats: Toughness, Dodge, Improved Initiative, Weapon Focus (longsword), Spell Focus (conjuration), Arcane Armor Training, Empower Spell, Arcane Strike, Additional Traits, Arcane Armor Mastery, Weapon Specialization (longsword), Improved Critical (longsword)

Gear:
Headband INT +4
Jingasa of the fortunate soldier
Cloak of Resistance +2 (I think?)
+3 mithral breastplate
Amulet of Natural Armor +3
Ring of Protection +2
Dusty rose prism ioun stone for +1 AC (insight)
Gloves of Reconnaissance
Adamantine longsword
Lesser Extend Rod
2x Pearl of Power I

That's all I can remember. Note the lack of a magic weapon, because I use an Extended greater magic weapon to keep my adamantine longsword at +3 for 24 hours a day. I also extend a darkvision all day, and save the third Extend for when I decide to cast heroism, making it last 4 hours.

I also don't have a shield; typically, if it looks like I'll be fighting in melee, I cast shield first, taking my AC to 36 total.

Now, throughout my first 11 levels of play, the key to this EK has been versatility: since table make-ups are random, it's nice to be able to slide into whichever of the tank, caster, or Knowledge roles happens to be missing. However, I'm now planning on another three sessions with a single group. With that in mind, I feel like I should maybe specialize a little more...?

Right now I'm the only melee/tank in the group (the rest includes a casting-focused druid, a blaster wizard with a 1-level crossblooded dip for damage arcanas, a zen archer, and a gunslinger/inquisitor). As such, I was thinking of maybe upping my AC some more so I can last longer soaking hits. Additionally/alternatively, maybe some nifty consumables or X/day items that could help me deal with weird situations? I dunno. I feel a little lost, having never played at this level before. Also I could probably stand to upgrade my cloak of resistance a bit...

Help?

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Bump?

Shadow Lodge

Might be worth having a level 2 Pearl of Power if you have the cash to burn on it. Another rod of Extend might also be worth looking into, to apply to things like Shield [which should last for about 18 minutes, which might get you through a couple of combats].

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

EvilPaladin wrote:
Might be worth having a level 2 Pearl of Power if you have the cash to burn on it.

I considered more pearls, but honestly I never find myself wishing I had more spells.

Quote:
Another rod of Extend might also be worth looking into, to apply to things like Shield [which should last for about 18 minutes, which might get you through a couple of combats].

I did consider a normal Extend rod so that overland flight could be 24 hours, and that would open up two more extends per day... but 12 hours tends to be plenty, and I don't feel the need to extend anything else, really. Not enough to justify the cost, anyway.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Ooooh, it just occurred to me I could also be spending cash on ascribing new spells. Any suggestions for (preferably no-save) spells that aren't in-combat buffs?


Beyond upgrading the items you already have the only easy way to improve your AC is adding an armored kilt to your mithral breastplate. That would make it heavy armor in terms of proficiency, which is fine, and medium in terms of penalties, which lowers your speed, without messing with armor check penalties or spell failure chance. You could also buy two second level pearls of power and a lesser rod of extend for your druid, to get them to have barkskin on you at all times. This comes at a cost of 11000 gold, most of which you can recoup by selling your +3 amulet of natural armor, and you end up with a +5 instead of +3 to NA.

To my mind though, the best defenses possible at your level are mirror image (prohibited school, but worth the double slot) and communal stoneskin. The 100 gp fee may seem annoying, but in the end you probably don't need to cast it more than about 10-15 times in your entire career to keep it up through all battles for the rest of your career, so that's a fairly minor fee. And if any party members want to be part of the casting, let them pay for it.

As for what else to spend your money on: boots of speed. It's most of your money, but it makes a huge difference, and if you're the main tank you don't have time to cast it yourself in combat. And I'm guessing the blasting wizard probably doesn't want to.

edit: As for spells: do you have sleet storm, emergency force sphere, wall of stone and some teleportation type stuff? Shrink item is also worthwhile, either for looting or for some serious surprises during combat. Nothing says 'battlefield control' like a 15-foot rock in a hallway. Preferably on top of some enemies (just throw the shrunken item at the ceiling above them).

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Use of the armored kilt is specifically not allowed in PFS.


LazarX wrote:
Use of the armored kilt is specifically not allowed in PFS.

Ah, didn't know that. Good catch.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

soupturtle wrote:
To my mind though, the best defenses possible at your level are mirror image (prohibited school, but worth the double slot)

Hm, I should look up how pearls interact with opposition spells...

Quote:
and communal stoneskin. The 100 gp fee may seem annoying, but in the end you probably don't need to cast it more than about 10-15 times in your entire career to keep it up through all battles for the rest of your career, so that's a fairly minor fee. And if any party members want to be part of the casting, let them pay for it.

Or I could just go for the non-communal version. ;)

Quote:
As for what else to spend your money on: boots of speed. It's most of your money, but it makes a huge difference, and if you're the main tank you don't have time to cast it yourself in combat. And I'm guessing the blasting wizard probably doesn't want to.

She prepped it last time around, which was nice because it helped not just me but also the gunslinger and zen archer. Still considering it, though...

Quote:
edit: As for spells: do you have sleet storm, emergency force sphere, wall of stone and some teleportation type stuff? Shrink item is also worthwhile, either for looting or for some serious surprises during combat. Nothing says 'battlefield control' like a 15-foot rock in a hallway. Preferably on top of some enemies (just throw the shrunken item at the ceiling above them).

Not impressed with sleet storm, especially considering my friendly ranged guys.

Dunno what book EFS is in.
I'll consider wall of stone, but 5th is my highest spell level so not a lot of slots.
Got the teleporting covered, usually slotting a couple of d-doors and a teleport.

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

2 cracked pale green prism ioun stones. 1 for +1 to all attack rolls, another for saves. 4000 each.

Cracked dusty rose prism, for plus 1 to initiative. 500

Tourmaline sphere, treat Con as 2 higher to determine when you die. 1000

Cracked tourmaline sphere, plus 1 insight on saves against death effects. 800

Spellguard bracers, plus 2 to concentration checks to cast defensivley, and 3/day roll twice and take the better. 5000

Or just spend 20000 on a stone of good luck. Plus 2 (with Fate's Favored) on all saves, skills, and ability checks (including initiative).

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

RainyDayNinja wrote:
2 cracked pale green prism ioun stones. 1 for +1 to all attack rolls, another for saves. 4000 each.

Oh yeah! Forgot about those.

Quote:
Cracked dusty rose prism, for plus 1 to initiative. 500

Seems unnecessary, but I guess it's only 500gp.

Quote:
Tourmaline sphere, treat Con as 2 higher to determine when you die. 1000

All kinds of unnecessary, since I already have a boon that—

*headdesk*
*headdesk*
*headdesk*
*headdesk*
*headdesk*
I'm such an idiot. I died in the last session because I have 14 CON and hit –15 HP. Except I'm not supposed to be dead until like –21 or something. Grrrrrr.

Quote:
Spellguard bracers, plus 2 to concentration checks to cast defensivley, and 3/day roll twice and take the better. 5000

Hm, could be good; I did cast defensively a couple of times.

Quote:
Or just spend 20000 on a stone of good luck. Plus 2 (with Fate's Favored) on all saves, skills, and ability checks (including initiative).

That is a lot of money for +2 to those things. No thanks.


EFS is from a rather obscure source as it turns out: Pathfinder Chronicles - Cheliax: Empire of Devils.

The reason I was recommending communal stoneskin over stoneskin is that the communal version is only 100 gp per target, whereas normal stoneskin costs 250 per casting. You make a good point about 5th being your highest spell level though, so for that reason the regular one might be preferable. You could also use the spell blood money (from rise of the runelords) to pay for the material component, which would casue you to take 1 point of strength damage and 1d6 regular damage, effectively costing you 105 gold once you've healed yourself back up with wands of cure light wounds and lesser restoration.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I don't have C:EoD or RotRL, so those options are out. Stoneskin seems like a possibility.


I might consider making your sword +1 and adding heartseeker (for a grand total of +2). Granted, you do already enchant it up, but heartseeker is a good enough property to be worth the cost. It's almost as good as seeker on a bow (but of course it isn't since melee can't be as good as archers).

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

8,000gp to ignore concealment when it comes up doesn't seem like that great of a deal to me.

Dark Archive

Jiggy wrote:
I died in the last session because I have 14 CON and hit –15 HP. Except I'm not supposed to be dead until like –21 or something. Grrrrrr.

Somebody forgot their rune of life.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Yup. I guess I'll email the GM and see how he feels about refunding the PP spent on the raise and restorations, seeing as those were the only permanent effects of the death. I should probably write down my death threshold on my sheet, next to my HP area. :/


I am not seeing any sort of physical stat buff belt on your list. +2 to two of the three will cost you 10k and is a decent investment.

If you have Perception as a skill then eyes of the eagle are pretty excellent at 2500.

More scrolls and/or wands of situational spells are never a bad idea.

Upgrading the cloak of resistance is pretty much always a good idea.

Depending on what your other skills are a competence skill booster can be a good idea.

Depending on how good your will save is the clear spindle ioun stone in a wayfinder might be a good investment. You would need Seeker of Secrets to make any use of its main effect.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

andreww wrote:
I am not seeing any sort of physical stat buff belt on your list. +2 to two of the three will cost you 10k and is a decent investment.

Oops, forgot to list my +2 belt of physical perfection. It's factored into the stats, I just forgot to mention it. My bad.

Quote:
More scrolls and/or wands of situational spells are never a bad idea.

Suggestions?

Quote:
Upgrading the cloak of resistance is pretty much always a good idea.

Yeah, I'll probably be doing at least another +1.

Quote:
Depending on how good your will save is the clear spindle ioun stone in a wayfinder might be a good investment. You would need Seeker of Secrets to make any use of its main effect.

I do have that book, so that's a very real possibility as well.


Jiggy wrote:
Ooooh, it just occurred to me I could also be spending cash on ascribing new spells. Any suggestions for (preferably no-save) spells that aren't in-combat buffs?

Walls, stone, force or ice for control, fire for trapping enemies or hitting undead.

Command Undead, unintelligent undead gain no save. You have barred necromancy but should be able to use scrolls

Dimensional Anchor, great for dealing with enemy casters and outsiders.

Black Tentacles, scales based on caster level but great against humanoid caster opponents

Pilfering Hand, disarm people at range using your casting stat and caster level. Not ideal for you but great for removing spell component pouches and holy symbols from low CMD casters

Rock to Mud, huge area control and movement limitation.

Interposing Hand, no save and it gives you cover against an opponent

Die for your master, immediate action emergency save if you have a familiar, from animal archive

Ice Storm, damage is poor but creates a large area of difficult terrain, Stone Call does similar at level 2

Animate Dead, having more bodies o your team can be really useful, tends to smell a bit


Jiggy wrote:
Quote:
More scrolls and/or wands of situational spells are never a bad idea.
Suggestions?

Pretty much have a copy of anything in your spellbook that you are not currently memorising. Particularly level 1 and 2 spells are so cheap as scrolls there isn't really any reason not to have them. Just avoid anything which allows a save or SR or a caster level check. Generally useful ones I would suggest include:

Any of the various detect spells
Comprehend Languages
One or two of each of the protection from alignment spells. Enemies are sometimes annoying and summon good aligned outsiders
Floating Disc
Mount
Obscuring Mist
Reduce Person
Air Bubble (or potions of)
Touch of the Sea
Aram Zeys Focus
Fog Cloud
Gltterdust (allows a save but still useful to reveal)
Invisibility
Locate Object
Rope Trick
Levitate/Fly in case overland flight gets dispelled
Mirror Image for emergencies
Invisibility Sphere for group sneaking
Phantom Steed, long lasting and very fast for getaways
Magic Circle versus x, no save and keeps summons at bay, does allow SR
Sleet Storm/Ash Storm, for covering escapes or dropping on archer opponents
Dimension Door, generically useful
Elemental Body I, slight, swim or earth glide in one package
Resilient Sphere, use defensively on yourself if you don't have access to emergency force sphere
Overland Flight, in case of emergencies
Teleport, I would always have 1 at this level to enable running away


Jiggy wrote:

Yeah, I'll probably be doing at least another +1.

Buy the cracked Ioun Stone first, it provides +1 for 4k versus 5k to upgrade the cloak from +2 to +3.


Jiao-long wrote:
...Additionally/alternatively, maybe some nifty consumables or X/day items that could help me deal with weird situations?...

Sipping Jacket. Get potions that last rounds/day to be much more useful. (haste, vanish, sanctuary, abjuring step(?))

Upgrade that cloak of resist to +3. Saves just get more and more important the higher a level you get.

Feather token (tree). Because... You always need more trees. Too versatile to not have one on hand.


Jiggy wrote:
8,000gp to ignore concealment when it comes up doesn't seem like that great of a deal to me.

Your call, but the amount of times I have had to fight invisble/blurred/displaced/mirror imaged foes at high level made would make a mere 8k worth it to me.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

drbuzzard wrote:
Jiggy wrote:
8,000gp to ignore concealment when it comes up doesn't seem like that great of a deal to me.
Your call, but the amount of times I have had to fight invisble/blurred/displaced/mirror imaged foes at high level made would make a mere 8k worth it to me.

That ability does not interact with all of those things.


Yeah, that is 8k to negate Blur which is lot to spend on a very minor effect.


Name one where it doesn't.

I have an enemy wizard in front of me employing any of blur/mirror image/displacement. I close my eyes and swing at the square. Any of the protections are now ignored and I have a 50% miss chance from total concealment. Then heartseeker cuts in and it hits without the concealment.


Nope, heartseeker affects concealment, not total concealment.


Are you actually going to argue that total concealment isn't a form of concealment?

From the PRD:


A heartseeker weapon is drawn unerringly toward beating hearts. A heartseeker weapon ignores the miss chance for concealment against most living targets, though the attack must still target the proper square. This special ability does not apply against aberrations, oozes, plants, outsiders with the elemental subtype, or any creature specifically noted to lack a heart.

Nothing in there says it doesn't work on total concealment. Much like seeker from a bow can be used to target invisible creatures if you know the square.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

drbuzzard wrote:

Name one where it doesn't.

I have an enemy wizard in front of me employing any of blur/mirror image/displacement. I close my eyes and swing at the square. Any of the protections are now ignored and I have a 50% miss chance from total concealment. Then heartseeker cuts in and it hits without the concealment.

Okay, granted I wasn't thinking about closing my eyes.

But in any case, I could spend 8,000gp to deal with those things with my sword, or I could spend 0gp to let some black tentacles chew on his low-CMD caster arse while my gunslinger and zen archer buddies fill him with holes.


That's fine, but plenty of demons, devils, and other unsavory outsiders will have such things. Not to mention many of the casters will come in prepped with freedom of movement (very common in PFS these days in high level modules).

Again, it's your money, but as soon as I saw that I dropped it on my falcata on my seeker fighter. I'd seen the difference in effectiveness against many targets between my melee guy and the archer with seeker.


where do you find the list of cracked ioun stones?


Seeker of Secrets


Here


Closing your eyes to have a better chance at hitting something with mirror image up is horrible metagaming, in my humble opinion. Note that my definition of horrible metagaming is 'anything that would make me feel really cheated if my GM used it against me,' which I feel is a pretty good guideline to judge what is or isn't acceptable in terms of rule-bending.


soupturtle wrote:
Closing your eyes to have a better chance at hitting something with mirror image up is horrible metagaming, in my humble opinion. Note that my definition of horrible metagaming is 'anything that would make me feel really cheated if my GM used it against me,' which I feel is a pretty good guideline to judge what is or isn't acceptable in terms of rule-bending.

YMMV, I see it as a rational response to a spell which makes a martial have fits. Truth be told, if all the images have to fit in a 5' square, you should be able to swing a weapon through the space (bludgeoning or slashing) until you hit the target no matter how many copies are standing there.

Oh, and this is PFS, so the rules are the rules, your feelings on rule bending are not really relevant.

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

soupturtle wrote:
Closing your eyes to have a better chance at hitting something with mirror image up is horrible metagaming, in my humble opinion.

"But with the blast shield down, I can't see a thing! How am I supposed to fight?"

"Your eyes can deceive you. Don't trust them..."

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

But don't you know that trying to overcome an obstacle with any action that doesn't have a description in the rules stating "use this against obstacle X" is inherently metagamey and borderline-cheaty?


I don't mean to hijack this thread but what does it mean when it says stacks beside the ioun stones? Stack with other similar bonuses, or with other ioun stones? I am not sure.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

NIghtrider wrote:
I don't mean to hijack this thread but what does it mean when it says stacks beside the ioun stones? Stack with other similar bonuses, or with other ioun stones? I am not sure.

You'll want to look outside the chart at the full descriptions. If memory serves, you're looking at stat-boosting stone, yes? If memory serves, you can get multiples of those stones and have them stack with each other.


NIghtrider wrote:
I don't mean to hijack this thread but what does it mean when it says stacks beside the ioun stones? Stack with other similar bonuses, or with other ioun stones? I am not sure.

I believe it means stacks with other ioun stones. For example there are two different sets of stat boosting stones. Some give a +2 bonus but don't stack, the others can be stacked to get up to +6. The latter are appreciably more expensive because the price is based on the fraction of the maximum boost from the stack.


Jiggy wrote:
But don't you know that trying to overcome an obstacle with any action that doesn't have a description in the rules stating "use this against obstacle X" is inherently metagamey and borderline-cheaty?

Of course. I should know better. That fact that a martial won't just lie down and let a spellcaster walk all over him is pure cheese.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Your eyes can deceive you, you know. The trope's too common in fantasy and fiction literature to hand-wave as being "meta-game-y". In my opinion, anyway, feel free to disagree.


To me it just doesn't make sense that it's easier to hit something with your eyes closed, whatever the circumstances. There may be circumstances where you want to disregard what your eyes tell you, but swinging into a square that has to have an enemy somewhere in it shouldn't get easier by closing your eyes, in my opinion.

But I guess the problem with that is actually in the mirror image spell itself: it doesn't make sense that mirror image makes it more difficult to be hit than invisibility, since in both cases you're just trying to hit an enemy that you know to be somewhere in a 5 foot square (and in the mirror image case you at least know what size your enemy is).

I still feel it's a bit matagamey though: since mirror image is clearly intended to be different from concealment, it feels a bit cheap to me to change it into concealment by closing your eyes, especially when you just 'happen' to have a magical ability that overcomes concealment. And it also doesn't make any sense that a heartseeker weapon works against mirror image when you close your eyes and not when you keep them open. Either the enchantment can find the heart or it can't, the enchantment shouldn't care about whether you've closed your eyes. So that's why I'll stick with metagaming: it looks to me like it's against the intended rules, and it doesn't follow common sense either.

edit: I know a magical world isn't supposed to follow 'common' sense, but it doesn't make 'magical fantasyworld sense' either.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Bumping this thread, as Part 2 has been scheduled for tomorrow night so I have to finalize my shopping tonight. Any additional suggestions would be great, thanks!

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

What have you already purchased, and how much gold do you have left?

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Nothing, and all of it.

Seriously, who finalizes purchases any sooner than they have to? ;)

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

I'd go with:

Cracked Pale Green Prism Ioun Stone x2 (+1 to all attacks and saves) (4000gp x2)
Boots of Speed (12000gp)

Dark Archive

Given that you mention you died (even if you shouldn't have) defences definitely seems like an idea knowing nothing more about what you'll face or how often you dip low.

I'd echo Stoneskin and the components to cast it a few times, then the 2 Cracked Pale Green Prims and finish off with a Ring of Foe Focus (if they're PFS legal, I have little knowledge about what is and isn't sadly, but that ring is killer for upping defences).

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

RainyDayNinja wrote:

I'd go with:

Cracked Pale Green Prism Ioun Stone x2 (+1 to all attacks and saves) (4000gp x2)

Went with these, plus upgrading my armor from +3 to +4 and getting a Clear Spindle/Wayfinder combo and 3x Snapleaf (one of them with PP).

Leaves me with about 2-3 grand, plus the ~10k I just got from last night's session.

At first I was thinking maybe this time I'd go for the boots of speed, but I noticed that last night I made all of one longsword attack. Other contributions involved an empowered scorching ray against a fire-vulnerable critter, lending my recon gloves to the invisible-and-earthgliding druid for scouting, a pilfering hand, a couple of divinations that were useless because plot, a black tentacles spell against some mooks, four insta-kills from a cloudkill, and teleporting the damsel in distress to safety (leaving the party behind in a fight, because this character is a selfish jackass).

So I'm not sure what to buy this time around, or what feat to take. :/

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