Hand Chopper clarification


Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

My group had a discussion over the first portion of text on this card as it seems poorly worded.

"If defeated, you may draw 1 random weapon, item, armor, or spell (your choice) from the box and add it to your hand."

Does this card mean draw 1 random weapon, or 1 random item, or 1 random armor, or 1 specific (the "your choice" above) spell?

Or, does it mean just draw 1 random weapon, item, armor or spell?

If it is the 2nd case, I don't see the point of the parenthetical "your choice" in the text. It seems completely superfluous and confusing.

It seems overpowered to be able to pick out a specific spell from the box, but the card seems to read that way.

If the "your choice" is meant to imply pick your choice of either a weapon, armor, item or spell, that is essentially implied by the "or" in the card text.

Alternately, it would seems a lot more efficient to just say "If defeated, you may draw your choice of 1 random weapon, item, armor, or spell.", with no need for any parenthetical comments.

Anyway, we played that the card was poorly worded and every boon was intended to be a random draw.

Any tips/clarification is appreciated.

Pathfinder Adventure Card Game Designer

You make a choice of the four types, and then you draw one card of that type and put it in your hand.


Okay, first the grammar lesson. The way the card is written means exactly how you wrote it with each option having the "or" in it. However, it was agreed upon long ago that we drop all those extra "ors" with it still meaning they exist. Thus just having one or in the statement.

The 2nd part of your question can be summed up as specifying who gets to choose which is something co-op games have to deal with. Imagine 2 other players played a blessing on that check. Did they help defeat it? Yep. So, who should get to choose. Also, you have 3 other players all lobbying you to pick a different type. This card specifies that the decision is 100% yours.

That being said, I agree that your more efficient reworking is better.

So, after defeating the Hand Chopper, you decide what reward you get with the reward being a random card of a specific type (any boon except Blessings or Loot).


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
kysmartman wrote:


The 2nd part of your question can be summed up as specifying who gets to choose which is something co-op games have to deal with. Imagine 2 other players played a blessing on that check. Did they help defeat it? Yep. So, who should get to choose. Also, you have 3 other players all lobbying you to pick a different type. This card specifies that the decision is 100% yours.

I didn't think about the wording from this angle. The text makes complete sense to me now from this perspective.

Thanks!

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

I guarantee that if it had been worded another way, somebody would be asking "do you mean I have to shuffle all my weapons, items, armors, or spells together and then draw 1?"

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

And if it had been this specifically:

NyferFen wrote:
If defeated, you may draw your choice of 1 random weapon, item, armor, or spell.

...we'd have people asking "do you mean I have to draw 1 random weapon, 1 random item, 1 random armor, and 1 random spell, and then choose 1 of those 4 cards?"


Well, you could always leave the card-writing to the LOL Cats...

Then you'd get something like "If defeated, I can haz stuffz!"


Pixel Hunter wrote:

Well, you could always leave the card-writing to the LOL Cats...

Then you'd get something like "If defeated, I can haz stuffz!"

Well, '...I can haz one random stuffz!'


If only I could add a pic...


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Vic Wertz wrote:

And if it had been this specifically:

NyferFen wrote:
If defeated, you may draw your choice of 1 random weapon, item, armor, or spell.
...we'd have people asking "do you mean I have to draw 1 random weapon, 1 random item, 1 random armor, and 1 random spell, and then choose 1 of those 4 cards?"

If event sequencing is the concern, then my suggestion would be to make situations like these explicit as per Mike's response above:

"If defeated, you may choose a Boon (except Ally and Blessing) then draw 1 random card of that type from the box and add it to your hand."

It's 20 more characters including spaces, but there is clearly room for that on the card.

I know it's nitpicking on a minor card but might be helpful if there are similar mechanics down the road.

Love the game, btw. Thanks!

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